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Old 19.09.2018, 14:06
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Landlord has no time around the date of handover

My contract ends on a Sunday, 30.09 and it's all good when it comes to a timely notice.

My landlord says that they don't have time for a handover appointment around that date, meaning 01.10, 02.10 or 28.09. Latest they offer is next Tuesday 25.09.

I absolutely cannot leave on Tuesday and the cleanup company will do their job on the 28.09.

In terms of leverage, the landlord has my deposit so they could make it difficult for me (?) if I cannot give them a date that suits for the handover.

They claim I wasn't "timely" enough to schedule an appointment and they cannot give one because of that.

What should I do in this case?
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Old 19.09.2018, 14:13
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

You don't have to leave on the date of the handover.

Tom
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Old 19.09.2018, 14:17
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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My contract ends on a Sunday, 30.09 and it's all good when it comes to a timely notice.

My landlord says that they don't have time for a handover appointment around that date, meaning 01.10, 02.10 or 28.09. Latest they offer is next Tuesday 25.09.

I absolutely cannot leave on Tuesday and the cleanup company will do their job on the 28.09.

In terms of leverage, the landlord has my deposit so they could make it difficult for me (?) if I cannot give them a date that suits for the handover.

They claim I wasn't "timely" enough to schedule an appointment and they cannot give one because of that.

What should I do in this case?
On what date did you contact them to ask them for the handover appointment?
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Old 19.09.2018, 15:04
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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On what date did you contact them to ask them for the handover appointment?
I never contacted them for a handover appointment. My previous landlord gave me the date by mail for the handover on the following day of the contract end so I thought it was the same.

Today they called saying I didn't contact them for a handover appointment and on the letter confirming the notice they didn't say anything either.
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Old 19.09.2018, 15:33
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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You don't have to leave on the date of the handover.

Tom
Could you be more specific?

Where should I go if I leave before the 30th? I can only enter my new place on the 01.10. and the rent has been paid until the end of the month so technically, I can stay until 30.09 23:59. Or am I wrong?
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Old 19.09.2018, 15:37
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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Could you be more specific?
You can leave after the handover.

You just have to leave by the end of the contract.

Tom
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Old 19.09.2018, 15:42
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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My contract ends on a Sunday, 30.09 and it's all good when it comes to a timely notice.

My landlord says that they don't have time for a handover appointment around that date, meaning 01.10, 02.10 or 28.09. Latest they offer is next Tuesday 25.09.

I absolutely cannot leave on Tuesday and the cleanup company will do their job on the 28.09.

In terms of leverage, the landlord has my deposit so they could make it difficult for me (?) if I cannot give them a date that suits for the handover.

They claim I wasn't "timely" enough to schedule an appointment and they cannot give one because of that.

What should I do in this case?

Don't make it your problem. You are entitled to the apartment until the last date. Your landlord seems difficult and I recommend getting advice from the Mieterverband and sending a letter accordingly.
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Old 19.09.2018, 16:15
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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You can leave after the handover.

You just have to leave by the end of the contract.

Tom
All true, but one has to clean before handover (unless landlord doesn't care at all, something I yet have to see happening in Switzerland.)

And cleaning/hand-over simply sucks if all the stuff is still in the apartment.
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Old 19.09.2018, 17:17
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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You can leave after the handover.

You just have to leave by the end of the contract.

Tom
That would basically mean, I could still live inside the apartment after the handover happened but before the end of the contract?

I don't think you can do that because the handover implies handing over the keys?

Or is there some sort of agreement at the handover time saying "I accept the apartment as it is right now, clean and without any damage, you can stay until the end as long as it is cleaned (again) by then?"
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Old 19.09.2018, 18:31
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

Handover means checking for damage, etc.

When my wife moved out, we did the check before she moved out.

The keys were left with the woman in charge of the building some time later.

Also, you don't need to be there.

Tom
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Old 19.09.2018, 18:54
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

I suspect you gave notice 3 months ago. That surely is "timely" enough. Still is if you for example only needed to give notice one month ago.

You don't need to contact the landlord for a handover date as it basically is given with the end date of the contract, easily seen in the notice you've given.

Tell them that's no problem, you can do it anytime after September 30th.
(If they can afford to keep the flat empty what does it matter to you?)


Don't let them push you. Just make sure you got their arguments in writing.
And they can't keep your deposit without your signature.
(You do know that any landlord - friend or fiend - can take up to 12 months to return the deposit?)
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Old 19.09.2018, 19:40
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

Whatever arrangements you make with the landlord/agent, get it in writing.
Do not rely on anything that was arranged by phone.

I have never heard of the option of doing the hand-over (including the inspection for damages) and then the tenant continuing to live in the flat for another few days. That doesn't sound the right way round, to me.
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Old 19.09.2018, 19:42
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

The rules about when, exactly, the rental contract ends are, like so many other things, cantonal. In which canton are you? Make sure you're looking at the right set of rules.

Also: what, exactly, does it say in your contract, about by when you have to leave the flat?
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Old 19.09.2018, 20:58
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

It ends when it ends.

Handover date changes nothing.

Tom
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Old 19.09.2018, 23:09
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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Don't make it your problem. You are entitled to the apartment until the last date. Your landlord seems difficult and I recommend getting advice from the Mieterverband and sending a letter accordingly.
This.

Even the owner's association (in German only, sorry) says that by default key handover is to happen on the last day of the contract during business hours. No business hours on Saturdays, Sundays and public holidays so handover is shifted on to the next business day. Some contracts mention clear dates and rules for that, in which case they usually prevail.

While key handover and inspection of the apartment usually happen at the same time, that don't need to apply always. The risk will be on the party that needs to deviate from that rule. Demand reimbursement for all your costs, plus nonpayment of unused rent, plus a meaningful monetary "thank you", if you agree to leave the apartment early. That's nothing but fair, but it won't happen unless you demand so.
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The rules about when, exactly, the rental contract ends are, like so many other things, cantonal.
Not in this case. While default cancel dates do indeed differ by Canton, the rules on how the ending itself is to be handled are federal law and regulation.
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Old 20.09.2018, 10:19
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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The rules about when, exactly, the rental contract ends are, like so many other things, cantonal. In which canton are you? Make sure you're looking at the right set of rules.

Also: what, exactly, does it say in your contract, about by when you have to leave the flat?
Canton ZH. On my contract there's nothing specific. It follows the HEV rules.
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Old 20.09.2018, 10:28
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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This.

Even the owner's association (in German only, sorry) says that by default key handover is to happen on the last day of the contract during business hours. No business hours on Saturdays, Sundays and public holidays so handover is shifted on to the next business day. Some contracts mention clear dates and rules for that, in which case they usually prevail.

While key handover and inspection of the apartment usually happen at the same time, that don't need to apply always. The risk will be on the party that needs to deviate from that rule. Demand reimbursement for all your costs, plus nonpayment of unused rent, plus a meaningful monetary "thank you", if you agree to leave the apartment early. That's nothing but fair, but it won't happen unless you demand so.
Not in this case. While default cancel dates do indeed differ by Canton, the rules on how the ending itself is to be handled are federal law and regulation.
Much appreciated for the detailed info. I'll make sure to have it in writing too if it comes to that.

Funny thing is that on the link you gave it basically says there should be a talk between both the Landlord and renter about handing over "early enough".
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Old 20.09.2018, 10:37
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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(You do know that any landlord - friend or fiend - can take up to 12 months to return the deposit?)
12 months? I really didn't know that.

According to this link (German only) it should happen "timely" () as soon as I moved out. Otherwise, I have the right to contact the authorities "Schlichtungsbehörde" to have the money back..

[Edit] Did not see the last paragraph on that link.

Last edited by chicofranchico; 20.09.2018 at 11:56.
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Old 20.09.2018, 11:25
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Re: Landlord has no time around the date of handover

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12 months? I really didn't know that.

According to this link (German only) it should happen "timely" () as soon as I moved out. Otherwise, I have the right to contact the authorities "Schlichtungsbehörde" to have the money back..
You can contact them, but they will tell you to wait a year.

It even says so in your link.

I recently gave back a space we were renting. We are on very good terms with the owner and agency, but it still took almost two months to get my money, despite filling out the account release forms a week or so after the handover, and not having any NK bills to process.

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