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Old 02.09.2019, 19:09
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Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

Hello,

Is it possible to keep and sublet my flat in kanton ZH while I go work and live in another kanton ?
I might need to go for work (and I don't really want too so I want to keep a foot here)
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Old 02.09.2019, 19:43
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

Providing you inform your landlord/agency if you don't own the flat.
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Old 02.09.2019, 21:34
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

of course,

i thought perhaps that's not possible if i deregister to register at the new kanton

but actually i thought: perhaps i can stay registered here (it would be lower tax on top of that! and deduct transportation costs from tax declaration)
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Old 02.09.2019, 22:54
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

Are you EU or non-EU? Normally non-EU (at least early on) needs to live in the same canton as work, unless permission is obtained to live and work in different cantons.

If you want to stay where you are for tax purposes then you can't de-register and you'd need to keep some kind of address where all the official mail is sent. You might be able be a "wochenaufenthalter" - basically a weekday resident in one canton so long as you return to your home canton on the weekend.
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Old 03.09.2019, 00:19
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

yes that was my idea (come back and pick up the mail on weekends)

Thanks!
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Old 31.10.2019, 10:41
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

Hello,

I'm reviving this thread to ask you if I should do any procedure regarding this move and "wochenaufenthalter" status (is it a status ?)

I'm going to the new (high tax Kanton) beginning of December. I still need to find a flat there, where I will stay only during weekdays.
I've read here that when I sign a rental contract, the gemeinde would contact me to register there (which I don't want, I'm keeping my flat in the old Kanton).
This situation is hopefully temporary, but I would really like to avoid paying taxes in the expensive Canton for just working there 2 weeks (in 2019)
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Old 31.10.2019, 11:29
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

Hi,



You just need to register in the new kanton(gemeinde) telling you already have your primary residence in other kanton.



Then, they give you a questionary to determine if you meet the conditions of the wochenaufenthalter status. What they want to find is where you spend most of your money (e.g. highest rent) and where you have your strongest personal relationships.



I did it once during the trial period for a new job. Since the wife stayed at the primary residence, it was simple to register the secondary residence even with a B permit.



Subletting the whole flat may make the things a bit complicate. Maybe keep a room?
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Old 31.10.2019, 12:17
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

Thanks,

Unfortunately, I can't split the flat. Would the High tax Gemeinde find out about the sublease by contacting the Low Tax Gemeinde ?

I will be staying at my girlfriend (unfortunately, that is same Kanton but another 3rd Gemeinde...) on weekends. We are not married. This could be seen as weak. Would it help if I participate in her rent ? Register at this 3rd Gemeinde (i'm at the current one for 8yrs) ?

I just wait for the new gemeinde to call me in, no 1st step or declaration to do on my side ?

Last edited by patrickk; 31.10.2019 at 12:36.
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Old 31.10.2019, 13:21
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

Assume that the municipalities, the cantonal authorities, the tax offices of both municipalities and both cantons, the federal tax office and the immigration/permit authorities, and all of those dealing with both yourself and your partner, know the ENTIRE story. You are not the first person in this situation, so the authorities know all about the various routes.

From that honest and transparent basis, work through your options.

In Switzerland, your place of residence is not determined exclusively by where you have your papers ("angemeldet" in German), but where the centre point of your life is. Here's a thread containing links to yet more threads which set out the concept of centre point of one's life. https://www.englishforum.ch/permits-...itzerland.html
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Old 31.10.2019, 13:42
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

They will find out about your scam.

Tom
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Old 31.10.2019, 14:06
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

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Thanks,

Unfortunately, I can't split the flat. Would the High tax Gemeinde find out about the sublease by contacting the Low Tax Gemeinde ?

I will be staying at my girlfriend (unfortunately, that is same Kanton but another 3rd Gemeinde...) on weekends. We are not married. This could be seen as weak. Would it help if I participate in her rent ? Register at this 3rd Gemeinde (i'm at the current one for 8yrs) ?

I just wait for the new gemeinde to call me in, no 1st step or declaration to do on my side ?
This sounds like a complicated plan. Why not just move in with your girlfriend and be done with it? My guess is that you want to keep paying the lower taxes.

If you're moving to a higher-tax area, that canton will certainly be interested in getting your tax money at some point. They may want to check up that you're actually returning to the original flat on weekends.

Another thing to consider - depending on which insurance you have, you might be restricted to routine treatments in the home/original canton and you're only covered for emergencies or via referral in other cantons.
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Old 31.10.2019, 14:08
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

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Assume that the municipalities, the cantonal authorities, the tax offices of both municipalities and both cantons, the federal tax office and the immigration/permit authorities, and all of those dealing with both yourself and your partner, know the ENTIRE story. You are not the first person in this situation, so the authorities know all about the various routes.

From that honest and transparent basis, work through your options.

In Switzerland, your place of residence is not determined exclusively by where you have your papers ("angemeldet" in German), but where the centre point of your life is. Here's a thread containing links to yet more threads which set out the concept of centre point of one's life. https://www.englishforum.ch/permits-...itzerland.html

I'll add employers and service companies with whom you sign a contract to that list. A short story.


I returned a studio which was my secondary residence for a year, and got my deposit back from the manager. The last electricity bill arrived 2 months after I left because the apartment manager forgot to notify them I was leaving at X date.


Of course, I did not pay on time because I had no idea the bill even existed. The electricity company contacted the apartment manager. The apartment manager told them I had already left. Then, the electricity company contacted the gemeinde. The gemeinde called HR office of my employer. HR reminded me to pay my outstanding electricity bill.



The information sharing between private and government entities left me astounded. So, doropfiz amt Tom are right. Assume everyone knows what you know and plan from there.
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Old 31.10.2019, 14:31
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

Thanks.
Well, I'm here since 9.5 years.
I took what is considered an "unacceptable job" by RAV standards because I want to work and not just sit and wait for the right opportunity (I do have more than 300 days left of benefits). I do want to come back asap so I try to avoid moving every little thing I have accumulated over the last 10 years, close all the contracts, find a new appartment etc.) for a lifestep that could last 2 months only. So sorry, there is no scam, I'm just asking about the conditions of a status and yes I will return every weekend.
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Old 31.10.2019, 15:10
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

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...sorry, there is no scam, I'm just asking about the conditions of a status and yes I will return every weekend.
Okay, then perhaps you changed your mind? Above you said you were only going to collect the mail on the weekends, and might sublet the flat which would mean you couldn't actually stay there. This left the impression it's a longer-term plan.

In the short term for a few months it might work out, although I personally wouldn't want to be under 2 leases at once. If you were questioned by the authorities you could explain you only took this job until you can find one back in the original canton so it's all temporary.
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Old 31.10.2019, 15:39
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

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no 1st step or declaration to do on my side ?
Yes there is. You need to register, usually within 14 days. Depending on where that is your new landlord may already have informed that commune, such is mandatory in many.

With 8yrs at your primary residence it's probably no issue getting accepted in the the 2nd (new one) as "Wochenaufenthalter" (this is what you want to check on the registry form, it means [secondary] workdays residence).

It's probably better to not register at your gf's, that looks like an unnecessary complication. Once you move together you just change your primary residence, keeping your Wochenendaufenthalter if still applicable.

I was registered in Zürich city for about 15+ years as Wochenendaufenthalter, with my primary residence near where I had grown up, that was never an issue.
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Old 01.11.2019, 14:38
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

I am also curious about the situation. Then is it legal to subrent the primary address to other people?

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Yes there is. You need to register, usually within 14 days. Depending on where that is your new landlord may already have informed that commune, such is mandatory in many.

With 8yrs at your primary residence it's probably no issue getting accepted in the the 2nd (new one) as "Wochenaufenthalter" (this is what you want to check on the registry form, it means [secondary] workdays residence).

It's probably better to not register at your gf's, that looks like an unnecessary complication. Once you move together you just change your primary residence, keeping your Wochenendaufenthalter if still applicable.

I was registered in Zürich city for about 15+ years as Wochenendaufenthalter, with my primary residence near where I had grown up, that was never an issue.
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Old 01.11.2019, 15:40
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

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I am also curious about the situation. Then is it legal to subrent the primary address to other people?
Will be difficult as you then no longer live at your primary address.
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Old 01.11.2019, 15:45
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Re: Changing Canton / Keeping your flat

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I am also curious about the situation. Then is it legal to subrent the primary address to other people?
Yes, considered you still actually live there as well. You can rent and own as many places as you can afford, rent, sub-let them (as long as you inform landlord about the conditions of the sublet), or use them as you primary residence (only one), workday residence (which might be tax deducible if it is at least 1h away from your primary residence), or vacation home. (there is a per commune limit on vacation homes of 20%).
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