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  #61  
Old 26.05.2020, 12:54
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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Its not an appointment for a hairdresser, its an appointment that is life changing to most

The honourable thing to do is to honour the scheduled appointments which have been made, that is the polite thing to do, at least where I come from

Absolutely. There should be a law that forces sellers to involve a psychologist.


The next thread will be about "the house has been on the market for months and the bugger refuses to lower the price".
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  #62  
Old 26.05.2020, 13:48
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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I agree, we had a buffer of a couple hundred thousand we could have gone above asking price but as a I said its a surprise from a sellers point of view its a fixed price system
Actually IME fixed prices are fairly rare - at least for the niche where I am looking.

Far more common is the 'Bieterverfahren', the bidding round. This is (hopefully!) discussed upfront. Viewings are on days A and B, the deadline for the first round of bids is day C. After the first round, the top X bidders are invited to submit a second bid. Sometimes additional rounds are sought. Highest bid wins.

Well, usully the highest bid. The winning criteria could be something quite different, and perhaps arbitrary. Seller decides.

I haven't seen a fixed price in years. But then, the kind of house I was looking for is scarcer than hen's teeth, and half of Switzerland seems to want the same thing, and the few people with such houses (actually their heirs ) know they are sitting on goldmines.
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  #63  
Old 26.05.2020, 13:50
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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Its not an appointment for a hairdresser, its an appointment that is life changing to most

The honourable thing to do is to honour the scheduled appointments which have been made, that is the polite thing to do, at least where I come from
Are you being dense on purpose?

Say, we matched on a dating app on a Monday and decided to meet for drinks on Friday. On Wednesday, I meet a group of people to play Cards Against Humanity and fall head over heels for a guy there, meeting him for lunch AND dinner the next day. Would you still expect me to show up for drinks on Friday OR would you prefer I tell you after my Thursday lunch that I have met someone?

That's a life changing decision too, isn't it?
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  #64  
Old 26.05.2020, 13:54
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

I haven't read the whole thread but I'm a bit surprised that it's commonplace to take the first offer like this. Not saying it's 'wrong' but if the first buyer turned up and immediately offered the asking price I'd assume that the property was undervalued. I realise there's a balance to be made somewhere between not annoying the first potential buyer who happens to have got there first, not annoying all the other potential buyers who've made appointments, and looking after your own financial self interest.

But I guess it's all a learning process. If that's the way things work here, so be it.
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  #65  
Old 26.05.2020, 13:58
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

it was a real whirl for me trying to buy a place in zurich, what a learning curve! there's one process that 1st establishes you have a minimum and then invite bids over that, it's amazing! the houses that weren't sold by the time of my appointment were all a bit awful and like three bus switches. my favourite tho was the ex crowne plaza suite ('in zurich's trendy west district!') and now kind of a storage place of all the crap owned by a mystery seller 'based in' geneva who wanted a quick deal. i offered just for a laugh a 30% reduction and the agent said yes, if we can do cash.
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  #66  
Old 26.05.2020, 14:17
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

As a seller, there's an old adage, that your first offer is usually your best one. You could also say a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. Hence why people will often accept the first offer, not necessarily because of a desperation to sell.

As a buyer, and I'm sure I'm not the only one, I don't want to hang around for an answer, or see others perhaps bidding the price up. I'll make an offer (sometimes below, sometimes above the asking price) which is non negotiable and open for 12 hours. I make it through my lawyer who then handles the whole process and who knows my red lines. It keeps me out of the process and removes all emotional decisions.
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Old 26.05.2020, 14:18
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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I haven't read the whole thread but I'm a bit surprised that it's commonplace to take the first offer like this. Not saying it's 'wrong' but if the first buyer turned up and immediately offered the asking price I'd assume that the property was undervalued. I realise there's a balance to be made somewhere between not annoying the first potential buyer who happens to have got there first, not annoying all the other potential buyers who've made appointments, and looking after your own financial self interest.

But I guess it's all a learning process. If that's the way things work here, so be it.
OP has no clue how much the other party bid, of what was agreed upon. All he knows is that it is sold to somebody else.
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  #68  
Old 26.05.2020, 14:19
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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As I said if you were selling a house, would you want to get the most you could for it under normal circumstances?

Its a good system for buyers
Depending on what relationship the sellers have with their neighbours, they may actually factor in how well the new owners would fit into the neighbourhood.

The other really important thing you need to learn about Switzerland is that although we are as capitalist as the next western country, we don't like people who think that everything and everyone is for sale because they aren't.

My favourite example is the fact that no amount of money will just buy you a place to moor your boat in most villages around the lake of Zurich. You either a) buy a house with a boat mooring (rare as hen's teeth and mucho expensive), b) buy someone else's boat with the slot included or c) go on the waiting list just like everybody else. In some cases, you pay a fee to stay on the list tp avoid people just signing up for the heck of it.

The notion of time and avoiding stress being more valuable than money is also a big factor in this. Having sold a few things on FB Marketplace as well as here, I can tell you that many people are incredibly tiresome. The worst is when you give something of value away for free, the concept of first come first served is beyond certain people. Or if you sell something for a good price, the hagglers rock up in force although you already have five offers at the full price - if only the first person who said they would take it could respond to your messages instead of just reading them.

I cannot imagine what selling a house must be like although hopefully it attracts a much smaller and different crowd. And I am pretty happy that we don't have the bidding war system here because there are a lot of very deep pockets for not that many properties, the bubble would be so much worse than it is now. Even apartments on the borders of Zurich are selling for 30-40% more than they were bought for ten years ago. Absolute madness.
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  #69  
Old 26.05.2020, 14:29
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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My favourite example is the fact that no amount of money will just buy you a place to moor your boat in most villages around the lake of Zurich.
Or Lugano.

We looked at a boat, but wanted the berth as well. No go (only residents of the town could get a berth), so no sale.

Meanwhile, when we bought the rustico 5 years ago, the seller had some other views planned, including later that day with a friend of mine. We agreed on the price (actually lower than asked), seller said it was ours, and that was that. My friend did show up for the viewing, but was informed that it was sold. He knows we bought it, that was not a problem.

Tom
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Old 26.05.2020, 14:31
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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I think that in this particular point, you are mistaken. As others have said, some offers to purchase are made conditional upon being accepted within 24 or 48 hours. This means that not only the buyer, but also the seller has to decide very quickly. The seller doesn't always have the leisure to wait.

To illustrate: the seller makes viewing appointments, one a day, for a week, starting on Monday, and yours is on Friday.

The Monday-viewers make an offer, on the spot, which expires on Wednesday at noon. That gives the seller the chance to let the Tuesday-viewers in, and to see whether they make an offer that is higher (or if they are purchases that she just prefers). She even has space to squeeze in the Wednesday-viewers if they can be done by 10h, to give her an hour to think, and then to accept or reject one of the offers of the Monday, Tuesday, or Wednesday folk. Done! No need for the Thursday and Friday folk to come by.
Is that the norm though because I have bought and sold houses before without these conditions

Of course that kind of offer can happen but as discussed the market here is first come first served so no need for that kind of stipulation.

I was making a point why would a seller settle for asking price when they could potentially make more than it
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Old 26.05.2020, 14:32
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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Absolutely. There should be a law that forces sellers to involve a psychologist.


The next thread will be about "the house has been on the market for months and the bugger refuses to lower the price".
ok smart ass
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  #72  
Old 26.05.2020, 14:34
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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I was making a point why would a seller settle for asking price when they could potentially make more than it
Because they like the buyer?

Tom
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Old 26.05.2020, 14:36
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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Are you being dense on purpose?

Say, we matched on a dating app on a Monday and decided to meet for drinks on Friday. On Wednesday, I meet a group of people to play Cards Against Humanity and fall head over heels for a guy there, meeting him for lunch AND dinner the next day. Would you still expect me to show up for drinks on Friday OR would you prefer I tell you after my Thursday lunch that I have met someone?

That's a life changing decision too, isn't it?
Keep your insults to yourself

you are comparing apples and oranges
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Old 26.05.2020, 14:37
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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Is that the norm though because I have bought and sold houses before without these conditions

Of course that kind of offer can happen but as discussed the market here is first come first served so no need for that kind of stipulation.

I was making a point why would a seller settle for asking price when they could potentially make more than it
How would you know what the agreement is?

Stop assuming things and grow up.
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Old 26.05.2020, 14:40
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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How would you know what the agreement is?

Stop assuming things and grow up.
Because i spoke to the agent and he told me thats what happened. I have accepted thats how it was done just surprised thats how the market works.

Although not surprised to see alot of snarky and smart ass comments here as you see it from the same people on other threads here. But whatever they get their kicks out of
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Old 26.05.2020, 14:42
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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Is it really that stressful for a seller to wait another week until all appointments have been met and you have a number of offers on the table, after all appointments have been arranged and time off had been arranged and time wasted meeting at the bank going through the documents and discussing finance.

Its common courtesy I believe
What if he didn't accept the offer straight away.... the 1st buyer changed his mind and none of the other viewers were interested. Why would the seller take the risk?
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Old 26.05.2020, 14:43
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

As said, I feel for you. However, could this not happen where you come from?
The situation in England is diabolical- as people can take you for a ride for months, right up to exchange of contract. Not the case in Scotland nor in France - and I am not sure, not in Switzerland (?)... where once you have agreed to buy, you are contracted to do so, and with very heavy financial penalties if you do not.

But this was just a viewing- it is not as though you had viewed and had stated you were definitely interested, had made an offer which was accepted ...
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Old 26.05.2020, 14:53
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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As said, I feel for you. However, could this not happen where you come from?
The situation in England is diabolical- as people can take you for a ride for months, right up to exchange of contract. Not the case in Scotland nor in France - and I am not sure, not in Switzerland (?)... where once you have agreed to buy, you are contracted to do so, and with very heavy financial penalties if you do not.

But this was just a viewing- it is not as though you had viewed and had stated you were definitely interested, had made an offer which was accepted ...
I agree, usually where I am from it is how I was saying, viewings are conducted and if the first person likes it than they can put in an offer but usually all other viewings are completed to see if more offers are entered, if there are then it becomes a bidding process 10k more then 10 k more etc until one buyer pulls out.

The whole point was I was expressing my surprise that that wasnt the case as 99% of the time you want to get the most return out of your asset. But hey thats how its done here, personally I was ready to make an offer and was ready for increased bidding process but alas not to be.
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Old 26.05.2020, 14:56
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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What if he didn't accept the offer straight away.... the 1st buyer changed his mind and none of the other viewers were interested. Why would the seller take the risk?
True and I understand that view but the buyer knew they had a very good property that was going to attract alot of interest.

The previous house we looked at has been on the market for months and we were about to put an offer down before we discovered something about the area by doing more research, that is the reason the house wont sell and if they got an offer they would bite the hand off offering it
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Old 26.05.2020, 15:01
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Re: House sold before even viewed it

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I agree, usually where I am from it is how I was saying, viewings are conducted and if the first person likes it than they can put in an offer but usually all other viewings are completed to see if more offers are entered, if there are then it becomes a bidding process 10k more then 10 k more etc until one buyer pulls out.

The whole point was I was expressing my surprise that that wasnt the case as 99% of the time you want to get the most return out of your asset. But hey thats how its done here, personally I was ready to make an offer and was ready for increased bidding process but alas not to be.

It's not that different here. As someone mentioned if you want to win you offer 10-20% above offered price and don't loose time haggling over 10K.
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