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Old 13.09.2020, 13:14
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New Kitchen

Hello

Just wondering has anyone experience of purchasing a kitchen from Sabag in terms of service, quality and price
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Old 13.09.2020, 13:44
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Re: New Kitchen

We have a Sabag kitchen installed in a new build 12 years ago. No complaints at all...

We visited their showrooms Lucerne way. They were pleasant helpful and efficient. Pricewise it depends what you chose. It’s not Ikea or Jumbo...
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Old 13.09.2020, 14:21
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Re: New Kitchen

Did they send someone out to measure the Kitchen up before final purchase and deciding on exact details

Some german kitchen suppliers ask you to bring measurements with you but I like the idea that Sabag can manufacture to your exact needs

we have a budget of approx 45k for our 15m2 kitchen so we hope that should be more than sufficient to cover the kitchen and some top applicances
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Old 13.09.2020, 14:26
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Re: New Kitchen

All the kitchen design companies offer estimates, renderings and altogether different options (design, brands & material). Appliances are a non factor since you can get what you want from all of them - warranty terms can differ, surprisingly though
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Old 13.09.2020, 14:52
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Re: New Kitchen

I don't have experience with Sabag kitchens but have used them for other products without a problem. They are a commercial firm so there will be trade and retail prices for identical products, on kitchens this can be upto 25%. As a retail customer you will struggle to get this. Also note, your first point of contact will be who you are stuck with for the entire process unfortunately for one of my projects my clients already had consulted someone so politely put he was less than competent which soured the experience for an otherwise good company.

The more work you do in defining and designing what you require the better price you will receive. I would consider using an online planning tool to rough it out and then ask for their imput.
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Old 13.09.2020, 15:32
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Re: New Kitchen

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Did they send someone out to measure the Kitchen up before final purchase and deciding on exact details

Some german kitchen suppliers ask you to bring measurements with you but I like the idea that Sabag can manufacture to your exact needs

we have a budget of approx 45k for our 15m2 kitchen so we hope that should be more than sufficient to cover the kitchen and some top applicances
Sabag were the „preferred“ kitchen and wet area suppliers of our developer. They were able to work from the floor plans provided. We did receive colour printouts in the 3D of the proposed design. But the view out of the window on their plans was much better than reality...
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Old 13.09.2020, 18:24
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Re: New Kitchen

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The more work you do in defining and designing what you require the better price you will receive. I would consider using an online planning tool to rough it out and then ask for their imput.
That's a great idea.

I used the free Ikea tool for a Rational kitchen as it was a great starting point for the kitchen company we used here. They were then able to suggest a few good changes and improvements.
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Old 10.03.2021, 07:42
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Re: New Kitchen

Hi all,

How would you claim taxes from the kitchen renovation? Are there any specific way to organize the kitchen renovation documents so that they could be used for the reduction of taxes? I suppose the renovation contract has to mention that we have replaced the old kitchen with the new one? Thank you for advice.

Last edited by leonie; 10.03.2021 at 07:53.
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Old 10.03.2021, 08:26
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Re: New Kitchen

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How would you claim taxes from the kitchen renovation?
You don't.

Tom
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Old 10.03.2021, 09:11
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Re: New Kitchen

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Hi all,

How would you claim taxes from the kitchen renovation? Are there any specific way to organize the kitchen renovation documents so that they could be used for the reduction of taxes? I suppose the renovation contract has to mention that we have replaced the old kitchen with the new one? Thank you for advice.
Against Eigenmietwert on page 2 of the tax form. You can either claim the Pauchal or individual items. What is allowed varies from canton to canton (of course)....
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Old 10.03.2021, 09:26
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Re: New Kitchen

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Against Eigenmietwert on page 2 of the tax form. You can either claim the Pauchal or individual items. What is allowed varies from canton to canton (of course)....
But only for replacement, not for improvement.

Tom
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Old 10.03.2021, 09:28
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Re: New Kitchen

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But only for replacement, not for improvement.

Tom
Not quite sure how you renovate a kitchen without replacing it...
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Old 10.03.2021, 09:32
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Re: New Kitchen

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Not quite sure how you renovate a kitchen without replacing it...
Replace it with a 70's style kitchen or whatever was there before.
Presumably you can set an upgraded kitchen against CGT as it's an improvement
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Old 10.03.2021, 10:22
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Re: New Kitchen

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Not quite sure how you renovate a kitchen without replacing it...
Many thanks, by renovating we replace everything in the kitchen.
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Old 10.03.2021, 10:26
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Re: New Kitchen

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Hi all,

How would you claim taxes from the kitchen renovation? Are there any specific way to organize the kitchen renovation documents so that they could be used for the reduction of taxes? I suppose the renovation contract has to mention that we have replaced the old kitchen with the new one? Thank you for advice.
First: This answer is for Zürich, I don't know what Kanton you are in.
Second: I am not sure this is valid now, but it was 10 years ago.
Third: I am not a tax expert and I am not your tax expert. Check all of this carefully.

The first thing you have to do is decide not take the standard deduction for maintenance costs (Unterhaltskosten). Then you have to supply documentation and you have to sort the costs into maintenance (which is deductable) and things that add value (I think) which are not deductable. This sounds complicated, but in Zürich - it isn't.

Go to the Kanton Zürich tax website and you'll find instructions (in German). If you scroll down to J. Abgrenzungskatalog you'll find a long list of different parts of a building that can be renovated --> see 4.3 Kücheneinrichtungen

There you'll see four possibilities and how much you can deduct for each:
4.3a Repair or replacement with equal value - you can deduct all of the costs.
4.3b Replacement with improvements - you can deduct 2/3 of the costs
4.3c Replacement with a large improvement in an old apt. - you can deduct only a 1/4 of the costs
4.3d Additional new installations - you can't deduct any of the costs.

My guess is that your rennovation is a 4.3b and you can deduct 2/3 of the the costs...
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Old 10.03.2021, 10:52
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Re: New Kitchen

Perhaps things vary by canton, and then who actually reviews your tax claim.

In Kanton Aargau we deducted 100% of the kitchen replacement. We basically gutted the kitchen, which was over 30 years old, and installed a new one.

We submitted the invoice from the kitchen firm, as well as all the invoices from the various tradespeople, plumber, electrician, plasterer, painter, tile person.

What we weren't allowed to deduct was the kitchen planning fee which was charged to us by a carpenter who did a design for us, but we didn't end up using him for the kitchen build. Had we used him the fee would have been part of the final invoice.

I am not sure how the distinction is made by the tax department between replacement with improvements, as opposed to replacement with equal value in the case of a 30 year old kitchen which was installed when the house was built.
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Old 10.03.2021, 11:11
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Re: New Kitchen

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Perhaps things vary by canton, and then who actually reviews your tax claim.
I think there are general principles that apply in most, if not all, cantons, that any renovation work you do within a set period (2 years?) of buying a property is deductible, then you can replace kitchens, bathrooms, etc. once every ten years and claim back the tax. More frequent changes won't be deductible.

There will be all sorts of exceptions and special cases, I'm sure, and they will most likely vary by canton. And of course those 'rules' apply to a home that's a primary residence, and may or may not differ if you own property to let out. In the latter case I'm assuming that _any_ maintenance work is deductible, and my tax accountant didn't disagree with the raft of receipts I put through for 2019.

And yes, it will probably depend on the individual who inspects your tax return. I made no effort to apportion costs over the various units I've been doing work on, but I could imagine that they could theoretically ask for more detail of what work has been done in each apartment to work out what may or may not be deductible, if they felt so inclined; they haven't done so far...
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Old 10.03.2021, 11:47
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Re: New Kitchen

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Against Eigenmietwert on page 2 of the tax form. You can either claim the Pauchal or individual items. What is allowed varies from canton to canton (of course)....
And then what? The Eigenmietwert goes up?
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Old 10.03.2021, 16:36
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Re: New Kitchen

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I think there are general principles that apply in most, if not all, cantons, that any renovation work you do within a set period (2 years?) of buying a property is deductible, then you can replace kitchens, bathrooms, etc. once every ten years and claim back the tax. More frequent changes won't be deductible.

There will be all sorts of exceptions and special cases, I'm sure, and they will most likely vary by canton. And of course those 'rules' apply to a home that's a primary residence, and may or may not differ if you own property to let out. In the latter case I'm assuming that _any_ maintenance work is deductible, and my tax accountant didn't disagree with the raft of receipts I put through for 2019.

And yes, it will probably depend on the individual who inspects your tax return. I made no effort to apportion costs over the various units I've been doing work on, but I could imagine that they could theoretically ask for more detail of what work has been done in each apartment to work out what may or may not be deductible, if they felt so inclined; they haven't done so far...
Sadly that wasn‘t the case for us in Schwyz. The tax accountant went off a rate card provided by the Kanton on what classed as improvements and what was replacements. This was on a full renovation of a 1970s place that had had very little TLC. All in I think about 2/3s was classed as replacements, but it really varied at an individual item level.

It‘s worth noting that while it‘s nice to deduct as much as possible in the short term, depending upon how long you keep the place, it may well be much more valuable to have it deducted from the capital gains, which particularly in the short term is both punitive and accelerated in early years.
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Old 10.03.2021, 16:41
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Re: New Kitchen

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Not quite sure how you renovate a kitchen without replacing it...
our plan for sure- there is no way we can afford a new kitchen. But we can revamp and replace worktops and remove one of the double sinks, tiling and appliances, put in new ceiling - so about 5 k instead of ???????? 30+ and more.
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