Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Housing in general  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 25.03.2021, 10:42
Mr.Maquiavelo's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Zurich
Posts: 354
Groaned at 70 Times in 33 Posts
Thanked 258 Times in 125 Posts
Mr.Maquiavelo has made some interesting contributions
Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

I have jumped into the environmental friendly wagon of switching from diesel to hybrid and electric cars. I have then asked the apartment administration whether they have a solution to allow charging the car in the parking place either the fast charging or slow charging that is billed to my apartment and not to the whole building.

The car vendor has a fast charging adapter that costs about 700.-Sfr and the sales guy says it can be installed all in for about 1k Sfr.

The apartment administration however is asking for 2500.-Sfr or more to do the installation and provide the fast charging facility for us. Consider that the parking spots here cost already too much 150.-Sfr per month.

Two questions: is the apartment administration trying to rip us off? and why would the tenants have to bear the costs of a permanent building installation to adapt to the new energy efficient trends?

My first reaction was to ask the apartment administration to get a quotation from a different electric firm but they have not accepted (my rip off alert went off). Since the car is hybrid I could not care less, I will just fill the tank with gasoline and charge it for free in the shopping centers around ...

Any feedback or related experiences?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 25.03.2021, 10:54
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2020
Location: Up there over the fog
Posts: 1,821
Groaned at 235 Times in 177 Posts
Thanked 2,045 Times in 1,007 Posts
JackieH has a reputation beyond reputeJackieH has a reputation beyond reputeJackieH has a reputation beyond reputeJackieH has a reputation beyond reputeJackieH has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Interesting question.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank JackieH for this useful post:
  #3  
Old 25.03.2021, 12:02
Axa's Avatar
Axa Axa is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Suhr, Aargau
Posts: 2,434
Groaned at 31 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 3,308 Times in 1,532 Posts
Axa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post
Two questions: is the apartment administration trying to rip us off? and why would the tenants have to bear the costs of a permanent building installation to adapt to the new energy efficient trends?
Rip-off? A matter of offer and demand. Considering people rent apartments even without a parking place, there business case to install a charger does not exist today and not in the future. You need the charger, not them, that's why you pay.

But...some new buildings in finished in the last couple years do have chargers. Why? A few extra cables are 0.001% (back of napkin estimate) of the total development budget. Consider moving to one of these new building.

Why no other company to make the install? Probably liability. If the admins bring another company to install the chargers, the company that made the original installation will tell they're no longer responsible for anything.

Personally, I think 2'500 is in the range of 1 month of rent. It shouldn't be that hard for them to make their apartment building stand out with electric chargers. But, offer and demand. If they don't need to invest 2'500 to rent the apartment, why?
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Axa for this useful post:
  #4  
Old 25.03.2021, 12:14
NickGB's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Zug
Posts: 918
Groaned at 9 Times in 9 Posts
Thanked 1,202 Times in 480 Posts
NickGB has a reputation beyond reputeNickGB has a reputation beyond reputeNickGB has a reputation beyond reputeNickGB has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

No direct experience, however, you are not that far apart, financially. I would let them do it and then they are responsible for the installation and it's upkeep.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank NickGB for this useful post:
  #5  
Old 25.03.2021, 12:15
Mr.Maquiavelo's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Zurich
Posts: 354
Groaned at 70 Times in 33 Posts
Thanked 258 Times in 125 Posts
Mr.Maquiavelo has made some interesting contributions
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post
But, offer and demand. If they don't need to invest 2'500 to rent the apartment, why?
Very good points. Indeed you're right. A cost effective solution => a portable battery I can charge at home (billed to my apartment only), then bring it to the parking place and charge the car. I will be asking the car sales representative if such solution exists.

I was even thinking whether the Goverment would help fund such installation initiatives for buildings without the provisions in the spirit of clean energy and sustainability.
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 25.03.2021, 12:30
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: na
Posts: 10,822
Groaned at 34 Times in 30 Posts
Thanked 25,278 Times in 7,886 Posts
meloncollie has a reputation beyond reputemeloncollie has a reputation beyond reputemeloncollie has a reputation beyond reputemeloncollie has a reputation beyond reputemeloncollie has a reputation beyond reputemeloncollie has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Here are some threads discussing the cost of installing electric charging stations in garages, one in a new build, others in older garages:

https://www.englishforum.ch/housing-...-charging.html

https://www.englishforum.ch/transpor...-who-pays.html

https://www.englishforum.ch/transpor...tric-cars.html

As my posts show, installing electric charging stations in older garages can bring up a plethora of issues and costs.

Our Quartier - a mix of single family homes, duplexes, and two four-flats - share a common underground garage. Installing electric chargers is proving to be complicated and expensive. Our early estimates of 3-10K per owner is looking to run towards the hgher end. We've each had to kick in1.5K so far just to fund a feasibility study. We are guessing we are years away from a solution.

Your 2.5K for the whole thing is looking like a good price.

One issue we face is the amount of power required to charge 50-some cars. Or even half that, assuming each owner only charges one of their cars at a time. The current electric system can only take 5 or so cars at a time, so we either need to build what essentially would be our own power substation (for which permits are unlikely to be forthcoming) or to come up with some sort of charging rota - shades of the shared laundry room horrors we all thought we had left behind when buying our own homes, and would mean our cars might not be useable for much of the time.

Yes, a charging station is cheap if you have an installation for a single car - that is, a stand alone garage that is entirely yours. Add in other cars or communal usage, and it starts to snowball.

Our home owners' association is at an impasse at present - given current regs, power supply, garage structure it looks like at present it is almost not feasible to install chargers for our common garage.

Yet electric is the future. An infrastructure out trade.

So my 2P:

If you can get a charger installed in your garage, never mind the cost, just get it while you can.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank meloncollie for this useful post:
  #7  
Old 25.03.2021, 12:38
robBob's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Zurich
Posts: 2,671
Groaned at 52 Times in 39 Posts
Thanked 2,491 Times in 1,339 Posts
robBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Wait a few years. We'll all be driving fuel cells by then.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 25.03.2021, 12:40
Axa's Avatar
Axa Axa is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Suhr, Aargau
Posts: 2,434
Groaned at 31 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 3,308 Times in 1,532 Posts
Axa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post
Very good points. Indeed you're right. A cost effective solution => a portable battery I can charge at home (billed to my apartment only), then bring it to the parking place and charge the car. I will be asking the car sales representative if such solution exists.

I was even thinking whether the Goverment would help fund such installation initiatives for buildings without the provisions in the spirit of clean energy and sustainability.
This is from a year ago. Real estate management companies say no demand for chargers, we don't advise property owners to invest on them.
https://www.blick.ch/wirtschaft/elek...d15682188.html

If the car is hybrid, a 220V outlet should be enough to fill the battery overnight. No need for a dedicated higher capacity charger.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Axa for this useful post:
  #9  
Old 25.03.2021, 12:40
Axa's Avatar
Axa Axa is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Suhr, Aargau
Posts: 2,434
Groaned at 31 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 3,308 Times in 1,532 Posts
Axa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post
Wait a few years. We'll all be driving fuel cells by then.
Or a Porsche running on synthetic carbon neutral gas =)
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 25.03.2021, 12:42
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 30,938
Groaned at 2,237 Times in 1,659 Posts
Thanked 37,251 Times in 17,630 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post
A cost effective solution => a portable battery I can charge at home (billed to my apartment only), then bring it to the parking place and charge the car. I will be asking the car sales representative if such solution exists.


Tom
Reply With Quote
The following 11 users would like to thank st2lemans for this useful post:
  #11  
Old 25.03.2021, 12:51
Ato Ato is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: ZH
Posts: 1,287
Groaned at 14 Times in 14 Posts
Thanked 2,355 Times in 964 Posts
Ato has a reputation beyond reputeAto has a reputation beyond reputeAto has a reputation beyond reputeAto has a reputation beyond reputeAto has a reputation beyond reputeAto has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

See if there's space for a diesel generator, one with a tow bar.
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank Ato for this useful post:
  #12  
Old 25.03.2021, 18:16
AbFab's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Zürich
Posts: 8,110
Groaned at 345 Times in 235 Posts
Thanked 11,629 Times in 4,010 Posts
AbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Forget batteries for charging.

Domestic 220volt socket in your garage will get you up to 11kms per hour charging.

Tesla Wall Connector using 3 phase will get you 66 kms per hour.

I was charged CHF1900 for installing and connecting it. The Wall Charger is CHF520 ish extra.

Forget hybrid, it has no environment advantage. Either charging or worse still so-called „self charging“, which just burn fuel.

Fuel cells are not going to happen, certainly for private cars...
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank AbFab for this useful post:
This user groans at AbFab for this post:
  #13  
Old 25.03.2021, 18:19
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 30,938
Groaned at 2,237 Times in 1,659 Posts
Thanked 37,251 Times in 17,630 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post
Forget batteries for charging.

Domestic 220volt socket in your garage will get you up to 11kms per hour charging.

Tesla Wall Connector using 3 phase will get you 66 kms per hour.
This.

A mini nuclear reactor could be the perfect solution, however.

Tom
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank st2lemans for this useful post:
  #14  
Old 25.03.2021, 18:35
Castro's Avatar
à la mod
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: ZG
Posts: 5,515
Groaned at 117 Times in 95 Posts
Thanked 16,415 Times in 5,227 Posts
Castro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Think about your usage and whether you really need a home charge point. If you only do a couple of hundred km a week then its entirely possible to get away with charging at supermarkets, highway services etc..

I did the same analysis as I was considering a Tesla Model 3, knowing that I wouldn't be able to charge at home. In the end I didn't go for it, but it wasn't due to charging at home. I knew I could get a free charge at work or at any one of the dozens of other places I frequently visit.

P.S The Tesla model 3 battery weighs 480 kg, even if your portable only weighed 100kg you're not going to give it much juice
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank Castro for this useful post:
  #15  
Old 25.03.2021, 19:25
Axa's Avatar
Axa Axa is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Suhr, Aargau
Posts: 2,434
Groaned at 31 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 3,308 Times in 1,532 Posts
Axa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post
Forget hybrid, it has no environment advantage. Either charging or worse still so-called „self charging“, which just burn fuel.
Why? We live in small Switzerland. Plug in hybrids with 50km electric range are more than enough for daily errands. Possible to drive entirely on electricity from Monday to Friday and burn gas only on a longer weekend drive.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Axa for this useful post:
  #16  
Old 25.03.2021, 23:44
smashe's Avatar
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Zurich
Posts: 80
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 42 Times in 28 Posts
smashe has no particular reputation at present
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post
Why? We live in small Switzerland. Plug in hybrids with 50km electric range are more than enough for daily errands. Possible to drive entirely on electricity from Monday to Friday and burn gas only on a longer weekend drive.

agreed, got a plug-in hybrid with charging station in tiefgarage - 80% of 5000 km made was on electric only


i would say you need a charging station in the tiefgarage even more for plug-in hybrids than pure electric, because the battery is small you need to charge often, a tesla you can charge at work or at X place and get 400 km range, you can do 3x charge / month and get 1000km range

Last edited by smashe; 25.03.2021 at 23:45. Reason: sentence is not needed
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank smashe for this useful post:
  #17  
Old 26.03.2021, 07:14
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 30,938
Groaned at 2,237 Times in 1,659 Posts
Thanked 37,251 Times in 17,630 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post
We live in small Switzerland. Plug in hybrids with 50km electric range are more than enough for daily errands.


I wouldn't get to work and back on that!

Tom
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank st2lemans for this useful post:
  #18  
Old 26.03.2021, 08:18
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Greater Zürich Area
Posts: 941
Groaned at 124 Times in 77 Posts
Thanked 714 Times in 397 Posts
EPMike has an excellent reputationEPMike has an excellent reputationEPMike has an excellent reputationEPMike has an excellent reputation
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post


I wouldn't get to work and back on that!

Tom
A PHEV is not for everyone. You need a use case for it.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank EPMike for this useful post:
  #19  
Old 26.03.2021, 09:48
Axa's Avatar
Axa Axa is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Suhr, Aargau
Posts: 2,434
Groaned at 31 Times in 31 Posts
Thanked 3,308 Times in 1,532 Posts
Axa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post


I wouldn't get to work and back on that!

Tom
What kind of job where 220V outlets are not available?
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Axa for this useful post:
  #20  
Old 26.03.2021, 10:06
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 30,938
Groaned at 2,237 Times in 1,659 Posts
Thanked 37,251 Times in 17,630 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Apartment parking charge station for hybrid / electric cars .. who pays?

Quote:
View Post
What kind of job where 220V outlets are not available?
Have them at work, but NOT at home.

Tom
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Any all-electric cars for less than 30K bowlie Transportation/driving 20 30.10.2019 12:37
Electric Car Charging Point-Who pays? Elly Transportation/driving 35 17.09.2018 17:58
What Hybrid Cars are Available in CH? esto Transportation/driving 47 19.03.2018 16:00
Cars, Petrol, Diesel or Hybrid Fidgety Transportation/driving 14 17.01.2017 10:44
Why So Few Hybrid Cars? jerallie Transportation/driving 168 31.08.2016 14:26


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 07:16.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2021, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0