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-   -   Scammed by the Hauptmieter (https://www.englishforum.ch/housing-general/303581-scammed-hauptmieter.html)

yoyo 10.04.2021 15:20

Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Hi,
I just moved to a new flat as a long term Untermieter, I just found out that I'm paying for half of the whole apartment rent, when there are 4 people living there!

What are my legal options in this case? Of course I can give my 3 month notice, or find another dupe to take over the apartment, but I thing the right thing to do would be to make these s**ts pay.

The did the same to one of the other flatmates, and after she confronted them reduced the rent a bit to 1/3 of the total rent.

Would getting a lawyer make sense? Should I try to talk to the owner (seems to be a bank)?
If not, I'm thinking of calling the police on the owner's little THC weed operation, and/or unsanitary restaurant,

Anyone here had to deal with anything similar?

yoyo 10.04.2021 15:22

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
To be clear, there are 4 bedrooms, and mine is the smallest. The price I'm paying is in the upper part of the normal range for the area.

NotAllThere 10.04.2021 15:30

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
You signed a contract for a home and you were happy with the price, presumably, when you signed.

Nope. No scam. Nice profit for the main tenant. Is there any specific reason why you need to know how much rent the main tenant pays? Nor why he/she shouldn't sublet their home for a profit

JackieH 10.04.2021 15:32

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
I feel your frustration- but there is nothing illegal in what they did. You did not ask the questions- and you agreed to the terms and price they stated. You can discuss this with them, and say you'd like to stay but feel the rent needs to be adjusted. And they can agree, or not ...Bonne chance.

evop 10.04.2021 15:52

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
I would recommend going with these questions to ZH Mietverband. Just become a member and get a professional legal advise, it is not expensive.

https://www.mieterverband.ch/mv/miet...am-wohnen.html

About the price: there may be something illegal going on, but discovering it would require to see certain papers (your sub-rental contract, the main rental contract, the regulations for your house - for example, if the WG in located in any sort of price regulated property).

Also, a basic recommendation would be to approach this issue with a cold head. Getting rid of the Hauptmieter (that is what I assume you want to achieve by reporting him to authorities) may or may not be a good idea in your situation, and it will certainly be a stressful journey, so one shall be prepared before going down this road.

newtoswitz 10.04.2021 16:11

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
According to the law a sub-tenant has the same rights as the main tenant.

https://www.fedlex.admin.ch/eli/cc/2...8/chap_3/lvl_E

So you can complain about unfair rent within 30 days of taking on the let.

Also the landlord can object to unfair rent:

https://www.fedlex.admin.ch/eli/cc/2...8/chap_1/lvl_K

Since you have the same rights and can make the landlord's life difficult they have some incentive to sort this out.

Sigh 10.04.2021 16:11

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Is the second half of the rent devided by the other three?

"How high can the sub-rent be?
In principle, the main tenant may not make any profit from the sublet. The amount of the sublease is usually calculated based on the proportion of living space used. Costs for electricity, water or fees can also be charged proportionally. In the case of a furnished apartment, the surcharge may not exceed 20 percent. If the sub-rent is higher, the landlord can prohibit his main tenant from sub-letting. For information: In a federal court ruling, surcharges of 30 percent were classified as improper."

https://www.comparis.ch/immobilien/r...ertrag-schweiz

yoyo 10.04.2021 16:27

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Thanks for answers guys.

I will talk to the Mieterverband and keep a cool head.

One of the main tenants is also a flatmate, and the other main tenant used to live in the room that I live in now, and used to pay 10% of the rent for it (according to the other flatmate who paid too much). As a flatmate, he's pretty terrible as well, which is surprising. You would expect him to be extra nice if he's milking me and wants me to stay there for long.

The outcome that I'm hoping for is get my money back and find another place.

JackieH 10.04.2021 16:37

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Good luck and come back to tell us of the outcome.

Did you ever sign a contract?

kri 10.04.2021 16:42

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by NotAllThere (Post 3294913)
You signed a contract for a home and you were happy with the price, presumably, when you signed.

Nope. No scam. Nice profit for the main tenant. Is there any specific reason why you need to know how much rent the main tenant pays? Nor why he/she shouldn't sublet their home for a profit

You are meant to attach the original rental contract to a sublet. Also one of the conditions of sublet is that the contract owner does not make a big profit. So a few things went amiss here....

OP - do you have the sublet authorization from the apartment owner? If not the sublet may not be legal.

Mietverband is the way to go!

K

Sinking 10.04.2021 16:46

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kri (Post 3294940)
You are meant to attach the original rental contract to a sublet. Also one of the conditions of sublet is that the contract owner does not make a big profit. So a few things went amiss here....

OP - do you have the sublet authorization from the apartment owner? If not the sublet may not be legal.

Mietverband is the way to go!

K

One thing I would do is find out if the owner KNOWS that the guy is subletting and for what price!

yoyo 10.04.2021 16:59

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
All I have is a sublet contract.
The other flatmate who paid too much sent me photos of the contract for the apartment.

I will talk to MV on Monday, and then probably to the owning company.

I'll keep you posted. Thanks for the advice!

Poutel 10.04.2021 17:11

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by yoyo (Post 3294907)
If not, I'm thinking of calling the police on the owner's little THC weed operation, and/or unsanitary restaurant,

:rolleyes:
If your conscience tells you to report a crime just do it. Using this as a blackmail material is unlikely to solve any of your issues.

yoyo 10.04.2021 17:31

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
You are right, that's a little hot-headed.

Sinking 10.04.2021 17:34

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sinking (Post 3294941)
One thing I would do is find out if the owner KNOWS that the guy is subletting and for what price!

Imagine how fun it would be if the owner had no idea ... :msntongue:

kri 10.04.2021 17:35

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sinking (Post 3294949)
Imagine how fun it would be if the owner had no idea ... :msntongue:

Yeah it would be great, everyone evicted and all :msnshock:

yoyo 10.04.2021 17:53

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by newtoswitz (Post 3294931)
According to the law a sub-tenant has the same rights as the main tenant.

https://www.fedlex.admin.ch/eli/cc/2...8/chap_3/lvl_E

So you can complain about unfair rent within 30 days of taking on the let.

Thanks newtowitz!
The 30 days mark will be in a couple of days. Is it "business days" or including weekends and holidays? Who should I complain to and how? (i.e. do I need to send an express official letter?)

yoyo 10.04.2021 17:57

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Sinking (Post 3294949)
Imagine how fun it would be if the owner had no idea ... :msntongue:

The owner is reportedly a bank, and the apartment contract is signed with a real estate management company. I would be very surprised if they were informed of the details of my sublet contract.

nickatbasel 10.04.2021 20:29

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
From what youíve said, OP it does not sound like an altogether pleasant place to live - do you really want to continue living there if you donít like your co-residents?

Use the MV as suggested to explore any legal routes for getting any of your money back. At the same time start looking for a new place to live.

Cheers,
Nick

doropfiz 10.04.2021 21:31

Re: Scammed by the Hauptmieter
 
Find out what the MV says, asap.

So you know exactly what it is that you're going to fight for, calculate what the worst case is. Let's say: you lived there for n months in total, and each month and you pay y Francs when you should have paid y-z Francs. So your over-charge or loss is y-z x n, and not more than that.

It can be worth it to stand up for your rights, but not worth destroying your time, energy and soul to do so. Work out what it is worth to you. No matter how angry you are, take only the kind of steps which will bring you closer to what you want. Do nothing merely for vengance' sake.

Everything you want to complain about (and if the MV advises you to do so), put it in writing, in a registered letter to your landlord. (Landlord in this context is the main tenant or Hauptmieter with whom you have the rental contract.) A registered letter is the proper, formal way, in Switzerland. Keep a copy of the letter, a photo of the envelope and a scan the receipt you get from the post office which reflects the date you send the register the letter. This receipt is proof that you sent the letter, but the quality of that print-out is often poor so that it fades with time, hence my advice to scan it.

For a letter to be properly within any notice period, it must arrive by mail on the last day, i.e. if the new period starts on the 15th, your letter must arrive by mail on the 14th, latest, as long as the 14th is a working day. If the new period starts on a weekend or a public holiday, then the letter must arrive by mail on the last working day before that weekend or public holiday.

Quote:

Originally Posted by nickatbasel (Post 3294987)
From what youíve said, OP it does not sound like an altogether pleasant place to live - do you really want to continue living there if you donít like your co-residents?

Use the MV as suggested to explore any legal routes for getting any of your money back. At the same time start looking for a new place to live.

Cheers,
Nick

This, exactly. Look for a new place, asap.


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