Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Housing in general  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 29.08.2021, 06:50
Newbie
 
Join Date: Aug 2021
Location: Islamabad
Posts: 1
Groaned at 0 Times in 0 Posts
Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts
nidamaqbool has no particular reputation at present
family of three requires how many room apartment

My family of three (husband, wife, and a 5-year-old kid) are planning to move to in Switzerland the early upcoming year. How many room apartment do we need to take as per regulations there?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 29.08.2021, 07:17
NickGB's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Location: Zug
Posts: 1,199
Groaned at 10 Times in 10 Posts
Thanked 1,675 Times in 674 Posts
NickGB has a reputation beyond reputeNickGB has a reputation beyond reputeNickGB has a reputation beyond reputeNickGB has a reputation beyond reputeNickGB has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

I'm not sure about regulations, however, my suggestion would be 4.5 rooms. This will provide 3 bedrooms: one for the parents, one for the child and one as a guest room or home office.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank NickGB for this useful post:
  #3  
Old 29.08.2021, 07:44
curley's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: canton ZH
Posts: 13,131
Groaned at 218 Times in 182 Posts
Thanked 15,264 Times in 7,847 Posts
curley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
My family of three (husband, wife, and a 5-year-old kid) are planning to move to in Switzerland the early upcoming year. How many room apartment do we need to take as per regulations there?
The general rule is amount of people minus 1 = amount of rooms.
That in your case would be a 2-room apartment. That is very small though, do consider that in Switzerland flats are offered in real amount of rooms, not bedrooms. That means if you rent a two room apartment, that's exactly what you get, which leaves you with a living room and 1 bedroom.

Therefore I would suggest a minum of a 3-room flat, which gives you a living room, a bedroom for the child and a bedroom for the parents.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank curley for this useful post:
  #4  
Old 29.08.2021, 07:50
robBob's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Zurich
Posts: 3,297
Groaned at 67 Times in 52 Posts
Thanked 3,296 Times in 1,751 Posts
robBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
My family of three (husband, wife, and a 5-year-old kid) are planning to move to in Switzerland the early upcoming year. How many room apartment do we need to take as per regulations there?
The only regulation here is how much money and or income you have to pay the rent.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank robBob for this useful post:
  #5  
Old 29.08.2021, 09:42
Mrs. Doolittle's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Lugano
Posts: 6,597
Groaned at 129 Times in 95 Posts
Thanked 8,048 Times in 3,746 Posts
Mrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond reputeMrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond reputeMrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond reputeMrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond reputeMrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond reputeMrs. Doolittle has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
The general rule is amount of people minus 1 = amount of rooms.
That in your case would be a 2-room apartment. That is very small though, do consider that in Switzerland flats are offered in real amount of rooms, not bedrooms. That means if you rent a two room apartment, that's exactly what you get, which leaves you with a living room and 1 bedroom.

Therefore I would suggest a minum of a 3-room flat, which gives you a living room, a bedroom for the child and a bedroom for the parents.
I have never heard of such a general rule. Why give such a complicated answer ? What is expected is that a 5 year child has his/her own bedroom. So a couple with a child would need a minimum 3 to 3.5 room apartment.

There is a federal guideline 843.142.3 which covers the amount of space people are expected to have. This says it is not a question of rooms but square metres, but this is rarely used and most property managers consider number of people as the main consideration in addition to rent to income ratio.

Affordability is of course a different matter. More space is nice to have, particularly if one is working from home, but not always possible.
__________________

Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Mrs. Doolittle for this useful post:
  #6  
Old 29.08.2021, 10:01
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 32,703
Groaned at 2,625 Times in 1,868 Posts
Thanked 39,816 Times in 18,778 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
I have never heard of such a general rule.
I have, but it only applies to non-Swiss.

Tom
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank st2lemans for this useful post:
  #7  
Old 29.08.2021, 10:18
Island Monkey's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Wallis
Posts: 6,693
Groaned at 118 Times in 82 Posts
Thanked 7,511 Times in 3,426 Posts
Island Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond reputeIsland Monkey has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

A bedroom for the parents and one for the child plus living space.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Island Monkey for this useful post:
  #8  
Old 29.08.2021, 10:53
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2016
Location: Zug
Posts: 246
Groaned at 24 Times in 14 Posts
Thanked 174 Times in 98 Posts
Xenophanes is considered knowledgeableXenophanes is considered knowledgeableXenophanes is considered knowledgeable
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
My family of three (husband, wife, and a 5-year-old kid) are planning to move to in Switzerland the early upcoming year. How many room apartment do we need to take as per regulations there?
I’d say to be comfortable you would need minimum 3.5 rooms = 2 bedrooms, and 100m2 space.

As for regulations, I think it’s probably a matter of judgment for the immigration department of your canton as to whether the residence is appropriate. A 1.5
room studio for 3 people would not be sufficient. That suggests something dodgy … say a slum landlord, or a scam to gain a postal address for residency in a low-tax Gemeinde while living elsewhere.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Xenophanes for this useful post:
  #9  
Old 29.08.2021, 11:03
st2lemans's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Lugano
Posts: 32,703
Groaned at 2,625 Times in 1,868 Posts
Thanked 39,816 Times in 18,778 Posts
st2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond reputest2lemans has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
A 1.5 room studio for 3 people would not be sufficient.
Unless you are Swiss, then it's fine!

Tom
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank st2lemans for this useful post:
  #10  
Old 29.08.2021, 11:57
curley's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: canton ZH
Posts: 13,131
Groaned at 218 Times in 182 Posts
Thanked 15,264 Times in 7,847 Posts
curley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
I have never heard of such a general rule. Why give such a complicated answer ? What is expected is that a 5 year child has his/her own bedroom. So a couple with a child would need a minimum 3 to 3.5 room apartment.

There is a federal guideline 843.142.3 which covers the amount of space people are expected to have. This says it is not a question of rooms but square metres, but this is rarely used and most property managers consider number of people as the main consideration in addition to rent to income ratio.

Affordability is of course a different matter. More space is nice to have, particularly if one is working from home, but not always possible.
It is not. My post clearly stated: 3 people = 2 rooms (yet uncomfortable in real life imo).

Just because you never heard of it and find it complicated it doesn't make it wrong. It is a rule used by city of Zurich with their flats, housing cooperatives publish on their websites (example) <<The rental guidelines of the ABZ provide for a minimum occupancy of the number of rooms minus one person when occupying an apartment, analogous to the occupancy regulations of the properties of the City of Zurich.>>
And it's what BFM also uses in cases of family reunion. It's not a law, it's one of those famous Swiss rules that become habit and are also used by private landlords.

However, OP was smart enough to realize this will be a subject when moving here and asked, I gave the answer. I don't see why people who live here since for ever now start a discussion about whether they feel it's reasonable or not.

OP: Again, min. 2 rooms. But as you probably come here with a job-contract and a good income I'd personally go for a 3-room-apartment.
All the best.
__________________
It's all a matter or perspective.
So move your butt and look at it from the other side
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank curley for this useful post:
  #11  
Old 29.08.2021, 12:06
curley's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: canton ZH
Posts: 13,131
Groaned at 218 Times in 182 Posts
Thanked 15,264 Times in 7,847 Posts
curley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond reputecurley has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
I have, but it only applies to non-Swiss.

Tom
Lots of private landlords use this rule of thumb too. I've seen my landlord do it. It's all about wear and tear of the flat to them though, not about the well-being of the tenant.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank curley for this useful post:
  #12  
Old 29.08.2021, 12:28
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Zurich
Posts: 1,144
Groaned at 27 Times in 24 Posts
Thanked 522 Times in 349 Posts
minimimi has earned the respect of manyminimimi has earned the respect of manyminimimi has earned the respect of many
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
I have never heard of such a general rule. Why give such a complicated answer ? What is expected is that a 5 year child has his/her own bedroom. So a couple with a child would need a minimum 3 to 3.5 room apartment.
We received once a letter from ZH migration stating this rule.
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank minimimi for this useful post:
  #13  
Old 29.08.2021, 13:04
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Zurich
Posts: 5,724
Groaned at 424 Times in 234 Posts
Thanked 6,578 Times in 3,024 Posts
ZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Goodness, just f*ing look on the internet for an apartment, or hire a relocation service - for such a large family you will need to pay shit loads for an apartment.
Reply With Quote
The following 7 users groan at ZuriRollt for this post:
  #14  
Old 29.08.2021, 13:14
Tom1234's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Kanton Luzern
Posts: 17,281
Groaned at 674 Times in 522 Posts
Thanked 26,289 Times in 10,599 Posts
Tom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond reputeTom1234 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
Goodness, just f*ing look on the internet for an apartment, or hire a relocation service - for such a large family you will need to pay shit loads for an apartment.
No point reporting this post as the mods said anything goes nowadays but your post is totally out of order.

Regulations about number of people being allowed to rent depending on space/number of rooms have been discussed many times in the past here.
The OP was asking a genuine question in a civil manner.

Perhaps they are looking or have found a place already but want to check it is officially okay to rent such a place.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Tom1234 for this useful post:
  #15  
Old 29.08.2021, 14:35
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Zurich
Posts: 5,724
Groaned at 424 Times in 234 Posts
Thanked 6,578 Times in 3,024 Posts
ZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
No point reporting this post as the mods said anything goes nowadays but your post is totally out of order.

Regulations about number of people being allowed to rent depending on space/number of rooms have been discussed many times in the past here.
The OP was asking a genuine question in a civil manner.

Perhaps they are looking or have found a place already but want to check it is officially okay to rent such a place.
That‘s just silly - the OP is Juist looking for a place for a family. There are many threads on this site that answer that question. We all had to go through finding an apartment, and I do not like the terminology „we require“, so I won‘t help.

I had to unblock you in order to answer to this.
Reply With Quote
The following 7 users groan at ZuriRollt for this post:
  #16  
Old 29.08.2021, 14:40
robBob's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Zurich
Posts: 3,297
Groaned at 67 Times in 52 Posts
Thanked 3,296 Times in 1,751 Posts
robBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond reputerobBob has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
Lots of private landlords use this rule of thumb too. I've seen my landlord do it. It's all about wear and tear of the flat to them though, not about the well-being of the tenant.
Therefore, the ideal Tennant is single. Has no pets. Never holds parties. Never subleases. Works all day. Always eats out and if necessary, comes home only to sleep.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank robBob for this useful post:
  #17  
Old 29.08.2021, 14:51
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ticino
Posts: 3,121
Groaned at 96 Times in 67 Posts
Thanked 4,135 Times in 1,646 Posts
Snoopy has a reputation beyond reputeSnoopy has a reputation beyond reputeSnoopy has a reputation beyond reputeSnoopy has a reputation beyond reputeSnoopy has a reputation beyond reputeSnoopy has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
and I do not like the terminology „we require“, so I won‘t help.
I think that is being rather harsh. Not everyone is a native English speaker and the correct/incorrect use of a word could be overlooked. Ultimately the OP's question is clear. If you don't want to help, then just don't, but there is no need to be a pr*ck about it (maybe I used the wrong term, it could have been a*se, or something else...not sure)
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Snoopy for this useful post:
  #18  
Old 29.08.2021, 14:57
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Ticino
Posts: 3,121
Groaned at 96 Times in 67 Posts
Thanked 4,135 Times in 1,646 Posts
Snoopy has a reputation beyond reputeSnoopy has a reputation beyond reputeSnoopy has a reputation beyond reputeSnoopy has a reputation beyond reputeSnoopy has a reputation beyond reputeSnoopy has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
It is not. My post clearly stated: 3 people = 2 rooms (yet uncomfortable in real life imo).

Just because you never heard of it and find it complicated it doesn't make it wrong. It is a rule used by city of Zurich with their flats, housing cooperatives publish on their websites (example) <<The rental guidelines of the ABZ provide for a minimum occupancy of the number of rooms minus one person when occupying an apartment, analogous to the occupancy regulations of the properties of the City of Zurich.>>
And it's what BFM also uses in cases of family reunion. It's not a law, it's one of those famous Swiss rules that become habit and are also used by private landlords.
As you said, it's not a rule, but it is a guideline. And I think you will find that with fairly typical Swiss consistency, it is not applied consistently from one canton to another. Mrs. D. posted the reference to the federal directive concerning the amount of space required per person in an apartment, but this applies directly to the Building Facilitation Program (my translation of Bauförderung), it is also used as a rule of thumb elsewhere.

Art. 24 of the Federal Act on Foreign Nationals and Integration just states:
"Foreign nationals may only be admitted in order to work if suitable accommodation for them is available."

And the instruction and explanation "Weisung und Erläuterungen" to this act only says:

Wohnung (Art. 24 AIG)
Im Rahmen des Bewilligungsverfahrens entscheidet die kantonale Behörde, ob die Voraussetzungen von Artikel 24 erfüllt sind.

In other words, the cantonal authorities get to decide what meets the criteria and what doesn't.

In their Merkblatt the Staatsekretariat für Migration states:
"Wer seine Familie nachziehen will, muss über eine angemessene Wohnung verfügen. Angemessen
ist eine Wohnung dann, wenn sie den ortsüblichen Verhältnissen entspricht, die für Schweizer
Bürgerinnen und Bürger gelten"

"If you want to bring your family to live with you, you must have adequate housing. Appropriate
is considered adequate if it corresponds to the usual local conditions that apply to Swiss citizens."

What that means is anyone's guess...

The Canton of Schwyz uses your rule of thumb, however they also go on to say that in Schwyz larger families may be treated a bit more flexibly if there are 5 or more people in the household.

So, ymmv depending on which canton you are in.

Last edited by Snoopy; 29.08.2021 at 15:13.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 29.08.2021, 14:58
Axa's Avatar
Axa Axa is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2019
Location: Suhr, Aargau
Posts: 4,432
Groaned at 75 Times in 70 Posts
Thanked 6,218 Times in 2,925 Posts
Axa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond reputeAxa has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
That‘s just silly - the OP is Juist looking for a place for a family. There are many threads on this site that answer that question. We all had to go through finding an apartment, and I do not like the terminology „we require“, so I won‘t help.

I had to unblock you in order to answer to this.
So, link to one of these threads. No need to be rude for no reason.

Last edited by Axa; 29.08.2021 at 15:08.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Axa for this useful post:
  #20  
Old 29.08.2021, 15:20
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Zurich
Posts: 5,724
Groaned at 424 Times in 234 Posts
Thanked 6,578 Times in 3,024 Posts
ZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond reputeZuriRollt has a reputation beyond repute
Re: family of three requires how many room apartment

Quote:
View Post
So, link to one of these threads. No need to be rude for no reason.
You are clearly also one of „those people“ that believe in Corona conspiracies, and don‘t understand why the rest of society thinks you are ignorant, uninformed and stupid when you put your mask under your chin while drinking your Red Bull on the tram.

Well. You are just stupid.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users groan at ZuriRollt for this post:
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Family-friendly 3-room apartment in ZH for rent Leonidas05 Property offered 0 09.02.2019 22:20
Want to rent a room for a month-ok is also a room in some family apartment naninina Property wanted 1 11.06.2017 15:35
Family friendly & sunny 3 bed room apartment with large balcony - Küsnacht (ZH) lauraga Leaving Switzerland 0 30.05.2012 22:36
Room for Dec and January in a 3.5 room apartment [Zurich] Sandra8 Housing in general 1 19.11.2009 14:01
1 room in a 3 room apartment Thebrit Housing in general 2 19.10.2007 16:15


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 06:48.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0