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  #81  
Old 18.09.2008, 21:06
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

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Snoop, there are plenty of properties available in Zurich and its surrounds,.
You may be misinformed....

http://www.studisurf.ch/news/article...n-zimmer-frei/

http://design.nzzdomizil.ch/interior..._1.775947.html

http://www.statistik.zh.ch/services/mm/2001/m05.pdf

The last link is particularly interesting because it points out that the shortage is over the whole canton of Zürich, not just the city.

Interestingly, most point out that those suffering the most are those on lower incomes...
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  #82  
Old 19.09.2008, 09:21
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

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Also, we like the apartment so much that we are ready to offer at least 600 CHF a month above the pricetag. So we were thinking of offering that when bringing in the application. Has anyone ever had any experience doing such a thing? Would that help us get to the top of the pile?
As I read this thread it brings to mind other competitive situations, like looking for a job, and how one behaves knowing there are other candidates. As a candidate, would you offer to work for less money just to give yourself what you perceive to be an advantage over other candidates? Surely in this situation the employer is looking for the person who they feel is best suited to the job and were prepared to pay a certain salary.

In many ways I think the rental market is very much like looking for a job. Many candidates meet the basic requirements. Once satisfied about the applicant's ability to pay, which is a basic concern, the landlord is looking for the tenant who he/she perceives to be the most suitable. This is completely subjective, and unfortunately for prospective tenants, requires no justification.

I have had clients chosen by the landlord because they were the only ones who offered to take their shoes off to view the apartment. In other cases the tenant had visited the clients home country and we had a long conversation (with me translating) about their travels. In another situation the tenants and landlord were both pet owners and they shared anecotes about their pets.

Sometimes you just "click" with someone and that brings your application to the top of the pile.

In my experience, many property owners prefer to rent to families rather than 2 -3 unrelated colleagues or friends who have chosen to share a flat.
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  #83  
Old 19.09.2008, 09:31
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

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In my experience, many property owners prefer to rent to families rather than 2 -3 unrelated colleagues or friends who have chosen to share a flat.
This can mean up to 6 people living in the flat when their partners stay over. I wouldn't make this mistake again. This means extra showers, drying clothes and cooking and loads of extra condensation. Then they complained about the mould because they didn't open the windows.

I have reduced the rent for a single person. Much less wear and tear and she's been there 4 years now. The second bedroom comes in handy for her shoes
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  #84  
Old 19.09.2008, 11:45
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

A quick check on homegate.ch shows that there are currently 3475 properties available for rent in Canton Zürich. This does not include furnished places either, so it may be fair to say that homegate alone has up to 4000 free properties in Zürich...are there that many homeless people here?!

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You may be misinformed....

http://www.studisurf.ch/news/article...n-zimmer-frei/

http://design.nzzdomizil.ch/interior..._1.775947.html

http://www.statistik.zh.ch/services/mm/2001/m05.pdf

The last link is particularly interesting because it points out that the shortage is over the whole canton of Zürich, not just the city.

Interestingly, most point out that those suffering the most are those on lower incomes...
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  #85  
Old 19.09.2008, 12:04
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

But where are these properties ? Because every new expat aspires to live in Seefeld, simply because that's what they are "told" - which must be just after they are "told" how much of their salary to spend on rent.

I can hear the relocation companies now: "Noooooo...you can't live there. Here there be dragons"*


dave

* When in actual fact they mean "foreigners, you know, not like you, the "bad ones" "


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A quick check on homegate.ch shows that there are currently 3475 properties available for rent in Canton Zürich. This does not include furnished places either, so it may be fair to say that homegate alone has up to 4000 free properties in Zürich...are there that many homeless people here?!

Last edited by DaveA; 19.09.2008 at 12:25.
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  #86  
Old 19.09.2008, 12:22
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

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A quick check on homegate.ch shows that there are currently 3475 properties available for rent in Canton Zürich. This does not include furnished places either, so it may be fair to say that homegate alone has up to 4000 free properties in Zürich...are there that many homeless people here?!
OK, well if that's the case, why are there so many people on this forum moaning about not being able to find somewhere to live? Why did the OP feel that they had to pay more to ensure that they found a place to live? Why are there 300 people viewing one apartment?

Homegate is not the be-all and end-all of apartment statistics. However, let's look at it a little closer anyway:

According to the Statistics Office of the Canton of Zürich, the average wage in Zürich is CHF 5700 a month. If you consider that the acceptable ratio of rent to salary is 30%, that would put the average acceptable rent at CHF 1710 per month. Of the 3475 apartments that you pointed out, 2524 were priced at over CHF 1700 per month. So, that would tend to indicate that there are not enough apartments to go around for the average person.
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  #87  
Old 19.09.2008, 12:30
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

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Most Swiss spend 30% of their income on rent. Don't be stingy and spend 2,000 a month when you earn 20k plus a month. That's what he means.
Biggest mistake I made when I came here was thinking if the Swiss can do 30% on a place to live then I must be Ok. I struggled for 2 years then went down to 20%. Now im having fun.

DC
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  #88  
Old 19.09.2008, 13:29
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

Que?!?

You have just proved there are 951 empty apartments in that bracket...

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OK, well if that's the case, why are there so many people on this forum moaning about not being able to find somewhere to live? Why did the OP feel that they had to pay more to ensure that they found a place to live? Why are there 300 people viewing one apartment?

Homegate is not the be-all and end-all of apartment statistics. However, let's look at it a little closer anyway:

According to the Statistics Office of the Canton of Zürich, the average wage in Zürich is CHF 5700 a month. If you consider that the acceptable ratio of rent to salary is 30%, that would put the average acceptable rent at CHF 1710 per month. Of the 3475 apartments that you pointed out, 2524 were priced at over CHF 1700 per month. So, that would tend to indicate that there are not enough apartments to go around for the average person.
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  #89  
Old 19.09.2008, 13:32
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

Not everyone lives alone. Which has a significant skew on the figures. Otherwise the housewives would have nothing to post about...

dave


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Que?!?

You have just proved there are 951 empty apartments in that bracket...
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  #90  
Old 19.09.2008, 14:09
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

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Que?!?

You have just proved there are 951 empty apartments in that bracket...
OK, I'm out of here.... This is obviously a waste of time.
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  #91  
Old 19.09.2008, 18:29
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

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Snoop, there are plenty of properties available in Zurich and its surrounds, sure you may not get the town centre flat you are looking for, but come on, be realistic, if you aren't willing to pay 'over the odds' you never will. There are a plethora of places within 20 or 30 mins of Zurich, that are considerably cheaper and lesser subscribed.
You seem to be expecting that poorer people (or people unwilling to spend as much) should have exactly the same opportunity to get the same flat as someone prepared to pay more. This is very nice in theory, and we'd all love to live in this wonderous dimension of immaterialism, but it is a bonkers concept for Switzerland.
I'm not sure we are talking about whether there are more expensive properties for people with more money & less expensive places for people with less money. That is a fact of life. That happens. And no one (that I read) is suggesting a socialist structure.

The question is whether it's appropriate to offer to pay more rent than what is being asked. In some countries/regions this is normal & more acceptable behavior. From what I have seen in my time working in relocation in the Lausanne area, is that this is type of offer frowned upon. In one instance my colleague had a client who offered more & was promptly marched out of the rental agency & told that they would not work with our clients again.

The attitude in Switzerland* to this sort of thing seems to be rather negative. Even our friend on EF who offered ASKING price to buy a house was told he was too pushy & the owner backed out of the sale. In Switzerland*, it seems people who are willing to pay more are seen as arrogant, pushy & throwing thier money around**.



* or at least from what I've seen 'round these parts
**Yes, I'm generalizing & clearly this doesn't apply to _everyone_ but is seems to be the more common response.
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  #92  
Old 19.09.2008, 18:34
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

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banks start concentrating on their customers again rather than on bonuses and shareholders....
You are clearly very naive. Bottom line and shareholders always come first for any large company!
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  #93  
Old 19.09.2008, 18:43
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

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Biggest mistake I made when I came here was thinking if the Swiss can do 30% on a place to live then I must be Ok. I struggled for 2 years then went down to 20%. Now im having fun.

DC
We've never paid 30% either. It's too much. I've always heard 25% as the best figure. We've always paid under that. Otherwise how would you save for a down payment on your own place?

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Que?!?

You have just proved there are 951 empty apartments in that bracket...
I'm sure these apartments are "empty". There is someone living the flat what wants to move.

Also, of the ones advertised, I would guess that 30% are no longer available (maybe more). Also what is the number of people looking for a flat? 100 or 1000?
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Old 19.09.2008, 19:18
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

I never really considered budgeting a percentage of my salary for rent. I always had a limit. I am happy to pay 3k a month. Were I to adopt the Swiss model and pay say 25%, I would be paying considerably more for my rent. That just seems ludacrous!

Last edited by Conor; 20.09.2008 at 12:36.
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  #95  
Old 20.09.2008, 01:41
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

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I never really considered budgeting a percentage of my salary for rent. I always had a limit. I am happy to pay 3k a month. Were I to adopt the Swiss model and pay say 25%, I would be paying considerably more for my rent. That just seems ludacris.
No one is obliged to spend 25% (or 30%). The point is not to spend _over_ that amount. You will most likely not be approved for a flat as you will be more likely to get in financial trouble if you spend more than that on rent.

You fired your spell checker but you should quickly hire a new one!
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Old 21.09.2008, 08:43
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Re: Does offering to pay above the pricetag help?

For my first application, I offered to pay 15% over the asking price with a higher deposit and still I didn't get the apartment. It was given to someone else who offered the asking price.

In my case, it seems to be very subjective and they will nor are they required to give a reason why they chose someone else.

It's not an easy process to find an apartment here (at least for a non-EU), but continue your hunt, you will find something somewhere.
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  #97  
Old 20.01.2011, 23:04
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Open-air bribery in the rental market

It's so hard to find a flat in Lausanne (not to mention Geneva...) that some desperate people are ready to offer hundreds or thousands of Swiss Francs to the decision-makers (or anyone having some power in the matter), in order to get a flat.

Well, some leaving-tenants are even encouraging this trend, as one can read in the last line of the ad below. I'd call that open-air bribery. I wonder how much illegal this is, and what can be done.

http://www.anibis.ch/n/5653488
--------
Appartement de 3,5pc à louer dès le 1 Mars.
Loyer 1640
Environ 80m2

Une très grande chambre
Une petite chambre
Un grand salon
Salle de bain avec machine à laver
Cuisine non agencée
Hall d'entrée
Balcon
Cave

Dossier remis uniquement à la personne offrant la meilleure récompense.
----------


Translation of the last line: The candidate offering the best reward will get the info and papers for applying to this flat.

A bit disgusting, as corruption is always (and yes, I know as well that corruption has always existed and will always exist, but the more there is, the deeper it roots, so every bud should be fought). Isn't this ad crossing the line between "passive corruption" and "active corruption" (at least in intention)?

[Edit: it could be also a plain and basic crookery, and the person who put the ad will ask to get money before even showing the flat... a flat that does not "exist", of course]


/Paul

Last edited by Paulus Camillus; 20.01.2011 at 23:07. Reason: Added one line
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  #98  
Old 21.01.2011, 00:07
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Re: Open-air bribery in the rental market

Appalling I agree- but it just shows how much pressure there is on the system in some areas. I agree that people should be able to choose the size of their accommodation, but what chance have normal families got??
Those of us able to move further away from those areas are truly lucky.
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  #99  
Old 21.01.2011, 07:09
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Re: Open-air bribery in the rental market

It's called Schlusselgeld (Key money) in the German part and appears to be quite common, although I'm led to believe it's illegal. Most of the time, though, it isn't so blatant. It's normally disguised by having to buy some rubbish furniture or fixture at some stupidly inflated price in order to secure the application and recommendation.

Yeah it stinks
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Old 21.01.2011, 08:43
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Re: Open-air bribery in the rental market

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It's called Schlusselgeld (Key money) in the German part and appears to be quite common, although I'm led to believe it's illegal. Most of the time, though, it isn't so blatant. It's normally disguised by having to buy some rubbish furniture or fixture at some stupidly inflated price in order to secure the application and recommendation.

Yeah it stinks

LOL that would explain why the last renters of our place where so pissed off when we told them we didn't want there cheap nasty blinds and curtains that they seemed to think where worth thousands.
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