Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Help & tips > Housing in general  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #21  
Old 13.10.2010, 13:50
ljm ljm is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Geneva
Posts: 752
Groaned at 7 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 372 Times in 218 Posts
ljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputation
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Quote:
View Post
The interest and amortisation on 1.2m with minimum deposit are very different from that on 450,000 bought mostly with proceeds from another house sale.

nice place, BTW Bit remote....
Yes, thank you for pointing it out. Basically, our rent is 3,500 with charges and parking. If we bought a house for 1.2 million with 25% downpayment (because people often forget that the notary fees amount to another 5% of the transaction value), the total monthly cost (interest, tax, amortisation, maintenance costs, all those things that Karl mentioned and that many people don't think about when buying but start thinking about at some point) would be around 5,000. Not to mention the costs of commuting because for 1.2 million we would have to move out to the far reaches of the canton or further up the motorway in the direction of Lausanne.

So we prefer to stay in our comfortable, 3-bedroom flat in central Geneva, keep our 300,000 CHF in the bank and spend the extra 1,500 per month on skiing holidays.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank ljm for this useful post:
  #22  
Old 13.10.2010, 13:53
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 7,815
Groaned at 475 Times in 397 Posts
Thanked 13,484 Times in 5,371 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

a I understand it notary fee's vary from canton to canton
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 13.10.2010, 13:56
ljm ljm is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Geneva
Posts: 752
Groaned at 7 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 372 Times in 218 Posts
ljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputation
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Quote:
View Post
a I understand it notary fee's vary from canton to canton
You are right and I even heard (on this forum, no less) that in the German-speaking part of the country the fees are split between the buyer and the seller so the buyer does not bear the entire burden of the hefty fee. I can confirm that in Geneva and Vaud it does not work that way.

The bank tells you immediately to budget another 5% on top of the 20%and if the actual fee ends up being closer to 4,8%, you should consider yourself lucky.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 13.10.2010, 14:17
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Vaud
Posts: 1,765
Groaned at 87 Times in 54 Posts
Thanked 816 Times in 502 Posts
Charlie R. Soles has an excellent reputationCharlie R. Soles has an excellent reputationCharlie R. Soles has an excellent reputationCharlie R. Soles has an excellent reputation
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Quote:
View Post
You are right and I even heard (on this forum, no less) that in the German-speaking part of the country the fees are split between the buyer and the seller so the buyer does not bear the entire burden of the hefty fee. I can confirm that in Geneva and Vaud it does not work that way.

The bank tells you immediately to budget another 5% on top of the 20%and if the actual fee ends up being closer to 4,8%, you should consider yourself lucky.
In Vaud, the notary fees are between 4 to 5%, lets say 4.5% for arguments sake although you should be able to negotiate a small amount, 0.2-0.3% or request a reasonalbe and corresponding lump sum payment.

Of this, and is the same in other cantons, although the percentage maybe a little different, 3.3% (Vaud) is for cantonal and comunal taxes that are levied on purchasing property, as elsewhere in the world.

The notary actualy gets about 1% or Chf 10k on a Chf 1mio purchase. Sounds quite a lot but there is a fair bit of administration that goes on and if you have a problem and the notary hasn't done due dillegence.....Good morning Mr. Notary, would mind explaining/paying please.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Charlie R. Soles for this useful post:
  #25  
Old 13.10.2010, 14:19
jaudi's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: zurich
Posts: 529
Groaned at 4 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 452 Times in 212 Posts
jaudi has an excellent reputationjaudi has an excellent reputationjaudi has an excellent reputationjaudi has an excellent reputation
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

FWIW, I looked seriously this year at purchasing a 650,000 sfr place in ZH. The up front costs (incl. land registry, notary etc) were all within about 2.5k (50% share). Note, in other cantons there is a property transfer tax which can add quite a bit, but ZH does not levy this.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 13.10.2010, 14:35
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Geneva
Posts: 183
Groaned at 3 Times in 2 Posts
Thanked 22 Times in 14 Posts
alanmack has no particular reputation at present
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

We're also considering buying a reasonable priced apartment in La Cote within the next year or so.

It seems like a bit of a no-brainer as the interest payment is probably 1/3 of which the rent would be.

Obviously you need to pay the notary fee, but I heard somewhere if you live in your flat and dont sell it for 5 years then you get this (of partof) fee back? Can anyone confirm this?

So assuming we buy a reasonably new'ish flat, the maintenance costs shouldn't be too much. So for a young couple it could be the best investment they could make, without spending months reading investment books and wading through the mindfield of options.. any thoughts?
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 13.10.2010, 15:04
Nelly_Da_Hefferlump's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Zürich, Switzerland
Posts: 774
Groaned at 8 Times in 7 Posts
Thanked 876 Times in 356 Posts
Nelly_Da_Hefferlump has a reputation beyond reputeNelly_Da_Hefferlump has a reputation beyond reputeNelly_Da_Hefferlump has a reputation beyond reputeNelly_Da_Hefferlump has a reputation beyond reputeNelly_Da_Hefferlump has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Anybody have any idea what the floating mortgage rate is at the moment? Ball park figure.
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 13.10.2010, 15:11
wattsli1's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Basel Land
Posts: 732
Groaned at 3 Times in 3 Posts
Thanked 943 Times in 338 Posts
wattsli1 has a reputation beyond reputewattsli1 has a reputation beyond reputewattsli1 has a reputation beyond reputewattsli1 has a reputation beyond reputewattsli1 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Here's our buying a house story....

We bought our house 5 years ago having looked for about 2 years in and around Basel. At the time I wasn't driving so my criteria were basically "near public transport, not too far out in the sticks".

We paid 750K for our 4 bedroom house in Aesch ("6 rooms" in Swiss terms) and we borrowed an extra 50K for renovations - new kitchen and redoing the external render - the bank had no problem with that.

There was basically no negotiation or offers or anything - we were advised that the asking price is generally what you pay and the first person to say they will gets it. It was a very simple process - we saw it, thought about it, talked to the bank (obviously we had already talked to them about theoretical mortgages and what we could afford), made a kind of holding deposit - this was I think 10K - if the seller had then withdrawn from the deal we would get it back with interest. She didn't and so it went towards the cost of the house. We paid 15% deposit and the bank stumped up the rest.

We are very much better off with a mortgage than rent - rent on a place like ours in this area would be about twice what we pay on our mortgage. Our mortgage is with BLKB and to be honest I don't know all the details (my husband did all that stuff seeing as his German is a thousand times better than mine) but we looked at all the banks - from the coop to UBS - and BLKB was (at the time) a significantly better deal - so definitely worth shopping around for a mortgage. My husband pledged his third pillar and some of our shares to reduce the deposit to 15% otherwise it would have been 20%.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 13.10.2010, 18:13
ljm ljm is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Geneva
Posts: 752
Groaned at 7 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 372 Times in 218 Posts
ljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputation
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Quote:
View Post
...It seems like a bit of a no-brainer as the interest payment is probably 1/3 of which the rent would be...So assuming we buy a reasonably new'ish flat, the maintenance costs shouldn't be too much. So for a young couple it could be the best investment they could make, without spending months reading investment books and wading through the mindfield of options.. any thoughts?
The interest payment of course depends on the interest rate. The usual amortisation rate here is 1 percent per year and the system also allows you to have interest-only mortgages (under certain conditions). Which sounds good when the rates are low but also means that your interest payments may easily double.

I believe that the prices in Geneva and La Cote are unsustainably high at the moment, meaning that they are high primarily because the interest rates are so low and many people think that they can afford to buy houses for which they would quickly lose appetite if the interest rates jumped. I may be wrong, of course, perhaps buying a house in Geneva/La Cote is like winning a lottery. This is what it certainly looks like to people who bought in 2000 or even in 2005. But it is 2010 now and I am not so sure about it.

As to maintenance costs, flats are usually sold under a 'PPE regime' which means that all owners share common areas in the building (and around) and consequently proportionally share the maintenance costs thereof. While these depend on many things, it does not mean that maintenance costs for a new flat will necessarily be lower. They can in fact be very high if, for example, you buy a flat in a building with certain luxury facilities (such as a swimming pool) or with large grounds that need to be regularly maintained.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 13.10.2010, 18:47
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Location: Neuchatel
Posts: 22,869
Groaned at 544 Times in 416 Posts
Thanked 25,381 Times in 11,638 Posts
Odile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond reputeOdile has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Our old farm/vicarage dates from 1587, but we have had no problem with planners at all. It was VERY reasonable, and I can't bear to think what it would be worth near Geneva. If you want better value, drive to the foot of the Jura or even better t'over side towards Vallée de Joux/Vallorbe/StCroix- prices drop significantly. Yverdon is a bit more pricey, but much cheaper than between Lausanne-Geneva, with direct trains to Lausanne and Geneva.
Reply With Quote
  #31  
Old 13.10.2010, 19:46
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Vaud
Posts: 1,765
Groaned at 87 Times in 54 Posts
Thanked 816 Times in 502 Posts
Charlie R. Soles has an excellent reputationCharlie R. Soles has an excellent reputationCharlie R. Soles has an excellent reputationCharlie R. Soles has an excellent reputation
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Quote:
View Post
We're also considering buying a reasonable priced apartment in La Cote within the next year or so.

It seems like a bit of a no-brainer as the interest payment is probably 1/3 of which the rent would be.

Obviously you need to pay the notary fee, but I heard somewhere if you live in your flat and dont sell it for 5 years then you get this (of partof) fee back? Can anyone confirm this?

So assuming we buy a reasonably new'ish flat, the maintenance costs shouldn't be too much. So for a young couple it could be the best investment they could make, without spending months reading investment books and wading through the mindfield of options.. any thoughts?
Rubbish, the fe is for cantonal/comula taxes (3.3%) the rest is for notary, nothing comes back whatsoever !
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 14.10.2010, 08:14
ljm ljm is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Geneva
Posts: 752
Groaned at 7 Times in 4 Posts
Thanked 372 Times in 218 Posts
ljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputationljm has an excellent reputation
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Quote:
View Post
Rubbish, the fe is for cantonal/comula taxes (3.3%) the rest is for notary, nothing comes back whatsoever !
Thanks, Charlie R. Soles, this is exactly what I thought. You know how they teach you that information is power? Some of the threads here make me think that it is much easier to buy if you do not know much but only really want a house badly. Taking time to learn about the market here only made me more sceptical...
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 18.10.2010, 08:46
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 7,815
Groaned at 475 Times in 397 Posts
Thanked 13,484 Times in 5,371 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

first bank meeting this afternoon, will they lend to us dirty auslanders? will they ask for a silly deposit? stay tuned
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 18.10.2010, 09:59
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Ticino & London
Posts: 1,969
Groaned at 165 Times in 89 Posts
Thanked 1,132 Times in 622 Posts
Cashboy has a reputation beyond reputeCashboy has a reputation beyond reputeCashboy has a reputation beyond reputeCashboy has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Quote:
View Post
I was told property prices are stable in Switzerland, but I bought to live in rather to invest so didn't really have a problem with that. I was recently delighted to find that after 4 years my house has probably more than doubled in value - not that I'm selling!
I find that hard to believe in four years.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 18.10.2010, 11:27
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 7,815
Groaned at 475 Times in 397 Posts
Thanked 13,484 Times in 5,371 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Quote:
View Post
I find that hard to believe in four years.
I find that impossible to believe, sure some neighbours may have stuck there houses on the market at silly prices recently, that doesn't mean they have sold them. the house we rented sold for quite a few 100k's LESS then the price it was up for on homegate. and took over a year to sell.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 18.10.2010, 11:41
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Zurich
Posts: 4,099
Groaned at 113 Times in 71 Posts
Thanked 6,169 Times in 2,192 Posts
Kittster has a reputation beyond reputeKittster has a reputation beyond reputeKittster has a reputation beyond reputeKittster has a reputation beyond reputeKittster has a reputation beyond reputeKittster has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Quote:
View Post
I find that hard to believe in four years.
I've seen that happen in Zurich. Place selling for 330'000 in 2007, another place in the exact same building getting sold for 600'000 in 2010 (3 rooms, small, ugly old building, no own washer/dryer, third floor, no balcony, no lift, right next to a busy street/tram line). Have seen other places with the same price development, since 2007 prices have increased disproportionately. BUT, that doesn't mean its actual value has increased by that, it's just that some poor, uninformed people are paying fantasy prices for properties just so they can have them right away.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 18.10.2010, 11:45
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 7,815
Groaned at 475 Times in 397 Posts
Thanked 13,484 Times in 5,371 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

ah ok, to be fair I've not looked at prices in the city as we have no interest at all in living there.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 18.10.2010, 13:41
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 3,457
Groaned at 17 Times in 15 Posts
Thanked 1,984 Times in 1,180 Posts
CH_Me has a reputation beyond reputeCH_Me has a reputation beyond reputeCH_Me has a reputation beyond reputeCH_Me has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Quote:
View Post
ah ok, to be fair I've not looked at prices in the city as we have no interest at all in living there.
You should read the Credit Suisse report on their website. Single family houses are now 7.5 times the average swiss income and there is decreased demand for them, so they are building even fewer. There is something about how non-urban property can be effected more by the recession and job losses too. With the US trying to stop a double-dipped recession, it is certainly an interesting time to buy.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 20.10.2010, 16:55
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 7,815
Groaned at 475 Times in 397 Posts
Thanked 13,484 Times in 5,371 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

update

Been to some banks, all of them agreed to give us a mortgage no problem at all, then got into a mini bidding war over interest rates, family discounts, free first payment etc very unexpected and welcome

I think it helped that they could see we had done our homework and had all (in fact more then they wanted) documents they needed.

so next step is haggling with the owners and getting a quote for the work we want done. Which is happening tomorrow. At this rate it'll be ours by christmas (have I just jinxed this now??)

so far the process has been a million times easier then buying in the uk
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank bigblue2 for this useful post:
  #40  
Old 20.10.2010, 16:58
Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Geneva
Posts: 183
Groaned at 3 Times in 2 Posts
Thanked 22 Times in 14 Posts
alanmack has no particular reputation at present
Re: The "Buying a house in Switzerland" thread

Congrats! That sounds fantastic...

What percent of deposit did they require?

And what kinds of documentation do they require?
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Buying a house on B permit in Switzerland krati Housing in general 16 09.11.2011 16:44
Advice : Buying A House With My Boyfriend In Switzerland. carloncha Housing in general 39 20.10.2009 01:52
Buying a house in England when living in Switzerland - How? wibbotso General off-topic 8 27.07.2009 22:30
Your online identity in Switzerland (when buying a house) john_semour TV/internet/telephone 22 01.06.2008 20:37
New House! [My bragging thread!] monkeynut General off-topic 55 13.03.2008 09:12


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 22:28.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0