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-   -   Health insurance increases for 2012 (https://www.englishforum.ch/insurance/127213-health-insurance-increases-2012-a.html)

jenny 30.09.2011 18:20

Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Ok, it's my last semi-peaceful day before the madness begins on Monday when the new official and approved premiums for 2012 come out.
*breathes deeply*...

In the meantime, the rumours are that the increase will not be that bad for next year which will come as a nice change for us that have been here for a few years and have endured big increases especially the last 2-3 years.

"Premiums 2012: 2,2% average increase according to the Government.

For BE, GR, NE, OW, TG, TI and VD, the increase is between -1 and 2%.
This is relatively good news as the average increase in the past years was 5.3% and in 2011 was 6.5%.

Statistically, this is the second lowest increase since the LAMal/KVG system was put in place in 1996."

I have heard that Zürich has been hit quite hard though and I know a lot of you are in that canton so just to warn you...

We'll see what happens on Monday I suppose.

Have a good weekend everyone :)

30.09.2011 18:38

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
So wait...there might be a reduction?

jenny 30.09.2011 18:40

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by porsch1909 (Post 1359286)
So wait...there might be a reduction?

Possibly.... though if there is it won't be by much but even so, it's better than an increase!

I think it mainly depends on your postcode but also your deductible, the company you're with etc. etc.

I guess we'll find out on Monday...

Guest 30.09.2011 20:13

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Actually we were informed by Innova a month or so ago that our premiums would go down by about 1-2% (this is in Bern). Unfortunately for us, we expect to be living in Zurich next year. Oh well.

jenny 30.09.2011 20:19

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Actually we were informed by Innova a month or so ago that our premiums would go down by about 1-2% (this is in Bern). Unfortunately for us, we expect to be living in Zurich next year. Oh well.
Maybe you should check that Innova are competitive in Zürich too then?
If you're definitely moving there, then the 2012 Zürich premiums will be the ones that will affect you the most.

A lot of companies have been announcing their premiums the last few weeks but the official approved ones won't be out until Monday.

Some companies didn't want to increase but when they submitted their premiums to the OFSP in Berne, Berne refused and said they had to increase them anyway so we won't get the definitive ones until Monday.

(Not saying that that will directly affect Innova, just saying :) )

twinkletinker 30.09.2011 22:07

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Time to Start shopping around..

Guest 01.10.2011 09:00

I'm not really worried about it. I'll check on the price, but unless it's drastically higher than what we paid in Bern, we probably won't bother. I've had craploads of claims this year as I've gone through chemo, rads, and many many doctor's visits and Innova has dealt with all of this efficiently.

jenny 03.10.2011 10:32

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by porsch1909 (Post 1359286)
So wait...there might be a reduction?

Haven't had time to read the whole 1220 page document yet but it looks like the premiums in Tessin have gone down, not sure for the rest of the country yet but that seems to be the only place to have received a reduction.

Guest 05.10.2011 16:30

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
I just checked for Innova - telmed model, 2 adults 300 franchise

In Bern (actually outside of the city of Bern) the reduction was about 1.5, almost 2 %.

For Winterthur, where we're moving to, the increase is more than 10%, maybe 12%

Other insurers are less expensive, so I'll have to do some checking about, thought i've been really happy with Innova, and I have a lot of medical stuff right now.

Does anyone place any stock in the ratings of the various companies on Comparis?

jenny 05.10.2011 16:36

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

I just checked for Innova - telmed model, 2 adults 300 franchise

In Bern (actually outside of the city of Bern) the reduction was about 1.5, almost 2 %.

For Winterthur, where we're moving to, the increase is more than 10%, maybe 12%

That is properly Murphy's Law.... :msnsad:

jenny 05.10.2011 16:47

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Does anyone place any stock in the ratings of the various companies on Comparis?
Personally, no....

Well, let's say I take them with a pinch of salt.

Several reasons really.

Sometimes people sign up for insurance companies with different ways of working (e.g. the pharmacy card with companies like Assura and Intras) just because they've seen low premiums on the Comparis website.
Although the information is on there somewhere, not many people read it properly and sign up before realising they have to pay for the medication upfront, for example.

Or maybe you ticked a GP method or a restrictive list or a phone method without realising it.

Then, when people get annoyed six months down the line when they have to pay upfront at the pharmacy or don't get reimbursed because they didn't go through their gateway doctor / phone the number etc. they go on Comparis and give that company a negative rep (or however it works).

I also think it's human nature to complain about things that have really rattled us but to not praise people when they've really helped us.

If you eat in a restaurant and the food comes late and cold and is awful, you're likely to tell everyone you know to never go in there.
If the food is exceptionally excellent then you're also likely to tell people.
If the food is fine, service is fine and you got what you were expecting, for the price you were expecting to pay, you're probably not going to talk about that restaurant unless you get specifically asked about it.
And yet they totally lived up to your expectations.

It's quite sad really when you think about it.

Guest 05.10.2011 17:05

Good point. Far more likely to complain than praise.

So between the end of last December and the last week of September, I have seen a doctor or had a medical procedure every single week, sometimes multiple times per week. My claims have been paid within 3 weeks after submission, I can scan in and email them, and I've had no crap from the insurer. This is why, despite a more than 10% increase, I may not change plans.

jenny 05.10.2011 17:07

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Good point. Far more likely to complain than praise.

So between the end of last December and the last week of September, I have seen a doctor or had a medical procedure every single week, sometimes multiple times per week. My claims have been paid within 3 weeks after submission, I can scan in and email them, and I've had no crap from the insurer. This is why, despite a more than 10% increase, I may not change plans.
Sounds like a good reason to stay with them then :)

Phil_MCR 05.10.2011 17:07

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
how can i get the cheapest health insurance? i've never even registered with a doctor since being here for the last 2.5 years and for me it's just a waste of money, so i'd like to spend as little as possible on it.

jenny 05.10.2011 17:10

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Phil_MCR (Post 1365782)
how can i get the cheapest health insurance? i've never even registered with a doctor since being here for the last 2.5 years and for me it's just a waste of money, so i'd like to spend as little as possible on it.

I've sent you a PM Phil.

One thing you should consider is the deductible. If you're never ever using it and highly unlikely to, then you should go for the highest deductible available.

I had a client once who told me he'd like a 10'000.- deductible and pay 20.- a month, looool.
He looked genuinely upset when I told him that it didn't exist!

jam1 05.10.2011 19:15

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jenny (Post 1365788)
I've sent you a PM Phil.

One thing you should consider is the deductible. If you're never ever using it and highly unlikely to, then you should go for the highest deductible available.

I had a client once who told me he'd like a 10'000.- deductible and pay 20.- a month, looool.
He looked genuinely upset when I told him that it didn't exist!

Hi Jenny, I would be interested in the same thing as Phil. Looking for insurance for my wife and I.

blitzkrieg 05.10.2011 19:33

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
^^ same here.

Assuming I can get out of my current insurance in case they increase it.

naza 05.10.2011 21:08

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
If i remember well our curent insurance companies should send us an estimate of the new expected cost at which point we can shop around and change insurance company - is this correct? When is this supposed to happen?

jenny 06.10.2011 18:10

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by naza (Post 1366064)
If i remember well our curent insurance companies should send us an estimate of the new expected cost at which point we can shop around and change insurance company - is this correct? When is this supposed to happen?

It isn't an estimate, it's the following years actual premium.

By law they have to send you this in October at some point. You could get it tomorrow or on the 31st.

As the official premiums are already out, you can already start shopping around if you like.

jenny 06.10.2011 18:11

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Blitzkreig and Jam1 - I have PMed you :)

halc3 06.10.2011 19:31

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Jenny is the woman in the know! Sought her advice to try and reduce my premiums for next year and Bob's your uncle, she puts several interesting offers on the table.

Would highly recommend her services.

* From the owners of Bonanza the cat. *

international 06.10.2011 20:53

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
This year was lovely, next year is going to be hell!

Be sure to compare your premiums well, as sometimes the highest and second highest deductible have the same premium.

The ministry of health has made a proper website in order to compare, not like comparis.ch which only compares insurances that pay for the service, www.priminfo.ch

I am afraid it does not exist in English... however it is fairly straightforward.

jenny 07.10.2011 19:35

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by international (Post 1367444)
This year was lovely, next year is going to be hell!

I don't think the increase has been that bad at all to be honest?

Yes priminfo is a good thing. Unlike Comparis it is a government thing so you know it's completely impartial.

international 07.10.2011 20:34

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Sorry mea culpa, i meant 2012 is fine, 2013 will be hell :msnshock:

jenny 08.10.2011 14:46

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by international (Post 1368918)
Sorry mea culpa, i meant 2012 is fine, 2013 will be hell :msnshock:

What makes you think that?

international 09.10.2011 21:48

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Gut feeling, SwissDRG's starting from 1.1.12, etc. do you think they are stable now Jenny?

meloncollie 10.10.2011 10:19

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Well, got the new premium - and nearly fainted from shock - the increase (ca 25%) is far higher than the numbers I've heard discussed in the media.

Do premiums rachet up with age? Just had one of the significant birthdays; is the fact that I am now officially a doddering old fool reflected in my premium?

Also, I've exceeded my deductable for the first time ever - but only by about CHF 100. Would that also account for the increase?

jenny 10.10.2011 11:16

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by international (Post 1370270)
Gut feeling, SwissDRG's starting from 1.1.12, etc. do you think they are stable now Jenny?

Don't know if they're stable or not, it's really hard to say, we'll have to wait another 12 months to know about 2013 but for the DRG business, as far as I'm aware the majority of companies have already taken that into account for 2012.

Some people were saying that some companies were going to increase a lot for 2012 because of this and also the "compensation des risques" (risk compensation between companies) but they haven't as a lot of insurance companies have been proactive with their reserves etc. to account for it all.

jenny 10.10.2011 11:21

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by meloncollie (Post 1370591)
Well, got the new premium - and nearly fainted from shock - the increase (ca 25%) is far higher than the numbers I've heard discussed in the media.

Do premiums rachet up with age? Just had one of the significant birthdays; is the fact that I am now officially a doddering old fool reflected in my premium?

Also, I've exceeded my deductable for the first time ever - but only by about CHF 100. Would that also account for the increase?

25%?! That is huge and way above the average.

The premiums for the basic insurance are not affected by age other than the 3 basic categories - 0-18, 19-15, 26+. So once you're over 26, that's it. If you're 27 or 107, you pay the same premium.

For the supplementary insurance, it's different.
A lot of companies increase every 5 or 10 years (depends on the company) but the increase is usually a few francs, not 25%.
Some may increase every year depending on your age and the products you have but this is more rare.

Some companies offer discounts on the supplementary, kind of like a no-claims bonus, so if you've claimed on your supplementary this year then that may account for the increase too.

Some companies have an age guarantee so once you've signed up for them, you remain in that age category for life. That doesn't mean to say that they won't ever increase (inflation etc.) but you will pay the premium of someone that age for life.

The fact that you've gone over your deductible won't affect the basic premiums.

PaddyG 10.10.2011 11:37

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Are Innova reducing in Fribourg too? I've not received anything. Then again, I throw away a lot of the gumpf that comes from them.

jenny 10.10.2011 11:41

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by PaddyG (Post 1370708)
Are Innova reducing in Fribourg too? I've not received anything. Then again, I throw away a lot of the gumpf that comes from them.

If you tell me your deductible, with accident or not, whether you have an alternative method or not, I'll let you know :)

meloncollie 15.10.2011 14:23

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jenny (Post 1370689)
25%?! That is huge and way above the average.

An update: I called my insurer to question the premium rise - and apparently there has been an error; I should get a new statement soon. Don't know what the new premium will be, but it won't be so high.

So a big thanks for the info, Jenny - your knowledge and the time you give to EF are invaluable.

blackbird 15.10.2011 17:15

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Try the HMO Model (your are only allowed to go into a HMO Clinic from your health insurance company, if you have to see a doctor), it is cheap compared
to other insurance models, i can recommend the atupri.

The_Love_Doctor 15.10.2011 17:44

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Hi Jenny,

that website www.priminfo.ch says that the following is the cheapest health insurance for me.

Progrès Dübendorf http://www.priminfo.ch/images/vmod_bl.gif BeneFit PLUS 17% 145.00 1740.00
I have already sent a letter to cancel my insurance. Could you give me some more info?

I can give you all my details if that gets you commision ;)

Edit: I've put 2000 deductible and Hausarzt Model.

some_randomer 17.10.2011 00:46

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Love_Doctor (Post 1377538)
Hi Jenny,

that website www.priminfo.ch says that the following is the cheapest health insurance for me.

Progrès Dübendorf http://www.priminfo.ch/images/vmod_bl.gif BeneFit PLUS 17% 145.00 1740.00

Hi I relocated to Switzerland (Basel Stadt) in August and I believe I have to get Swiss health insurance after 3 months, which means I need it by Nov 1st.

However the cheapest I can find on Comparis is 252.70 / 3,032.40 (GP model) and an even higher 318.90/3826.80 (HMO model) on priminfo.ch. These are both 2000 deductible and no accident coverage. (I don't understand those models by the way as I've only started researching all this).

Love doctor how did you manage to get 145.00/1740.00?

Jenny I'd be very grateful for any advice and also be happy to sed you my details if it gets you commission :)

Edit: Just searched progres.ch which is coming in at 291.55

some_randomer 17.10.2011 00:50

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by blackbird (Post 1377529)
Try the HMO Model (your are only allowed to go into a HMO Clinic from your health insurance company, if you have to see a doctor), it is cheap compared
to other insurance models, i can recommend the atupri.

Hi blackbird, I'm in Basel Stadt and I searched Comparis with 2000 deductible and no accident cover. The cheapest for me was the GP model at 252.70 / 3,032.40. The cheapest HMO is Sana24 at 289.30 / 3,471.60. Maybe it's because I'm in a different canton to you...do the costs vary much by canton?

blackbird 17.10.2011 05:08

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
I live in zurich an pay right now (with 500 sfr deductable) incl. Mivita, Comforta and Denta around 339 sfr per Month,which seems pretty cheep.

The_Love_Doctor 17.10.2011 16:43

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by some_randomer (Post 1378594)

However the cheapest I can find on Comparis is 252.70 / 3,032.40 (GP model) and an even higher 318.90/3826.80 (HMO model) on priminfo.ch. These are both 2000 deductible and no accident coverage. (I don't understand those models by the way as I've only started researching all this).

Love doctor how did you manage to get 145.00/1740.00?


Postcode had something to do with it... I think health insurance premiums are fairly low in Zug

jenny 17.10.2011 19:25

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by The_Love_Doctor (Post 1379294)
Postcode had something to do with it... I think health insurance premiums are fairly low in Zug

Yes, the premiums change not only on which canton you're in but whereabouts in that canton you are.

Cantons can have maximum 3 tarif zones (these are not necessarily geographical).
e.g. Zürich, Berne and Lucerne have 3 zones, Zug and Geneva have 1, Vaud and Valais have 2.

Premiums can vary massively from canton to canton with BS and GE being the more expensive and AI and VS being amongst the least expensive.

Nyonais 17.10.2011 19:34

Re: Health insurance increases for 2012
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by jenny (Post 1367253)
It isn't an estimate, it's the following years actual premium.

By law they have to send you this in October at some point. You could get it tomorrow or on the 31st.

As the official premiums are already out, you can already start shopping around if you like.

If one gets the notice of increased premium on the 31st Oct, can than person still shop around and look for anything cheaper or the deadline for giving a notice to the present insurer is already over?


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