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Old 30.05.2012, 20:45
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Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

This is just a friendly reminder: the Velo Vignette will not be valid anymore starting June 1st 2012 (in 2 days).

Make sure you are properly insured if you are riding a bike!
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Old 09.06.2012, 11:31
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

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This is just a friendly reminder: the Velo Vignette will not be valid anymore starting June 1st 2012 (in 2 days).

Make sure you are properly insured if you are riding a bike!
That's it!
The "vignette" is officially over in Switzerland.

Here's some good infos on how to replace it:
http://translate.google.ch/translate...n-vignette.php
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Old 09.06.2012, 11:52
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

If i'm someone who rides my bike only on occasion, what is your recommendation that I get the bike insurance?
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Old 09.06.2012, 11:55
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

Yes. Ride into a car, bike or someones house and you are liable for damage to property or people including if someone else uses your bike and causes the same.

The insurance is cheap and check you home contents insurance you might already have cover
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Old 09.06.2012, 12:06
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

You're right i think my home insurance covers it. Thanks !
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Old 09.06.2012, 16:22
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

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If i'm someone who rides my bike only on occasion, what is your recommendation that I get the bike insurance?
It's simple. You don't need it.
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Old 09.06.2012, 16:31
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

You are covered under your personal liability insurance if you have one, there is no such thing as a bike insurance, except theft of course...

If you don't have a liability insurance, which you really should have, then you can get a tcs cover as stated.
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Old 09.06.2012, 16:54
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

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If you don't have a liability insurance, which you really should have
I'd love to be able to ignore this, but I can't - what has happened to the world that so many people feel they need personal liability cover?

There seems to be a general belief that you can be sued in any situation where an accident occurs, and of course this belief is encouraged by the "where there's blame there's a claim" legal industry, but I've yet to hear about an individual being successfully sued for liability in that sort of scenario.

If it were normal, or even common, then yes, maybe it might be worth insuring against, but it's not.
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Old 09.06.2012, 18:21
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

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It's simple. You don't need it.
Wow, I didn't even think I would get a groan for trying to be nice. There's no law forcing people to take private liability insurance; the pros and cons about it have already been discussed several times in the forum, for instance here. Bottom line is that it may be expensive NOT to have it.
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Old 09.06.2012, 18:44
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

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This is just a friendly reminder: the Velo Vignette will not be valid anymore starting June 1st 2012 (in 2 days).

Make sure you are properly insured if you are riding a bike!
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Wow, I didn't even think I would get a groan for trying to be nice. There's no law forcing people to take private liability insurance; the pros and cons about it have already been discussed several times in the forum, for instance here. Bottom line is that it may be expensive NOT to have it.
Switzerland has this bizarre cuture of virtually compulsory insurance -- and sometimes, actually compulsory. The good news is that the velo vignette is no longer compulsory. I find it odd that a country with a relaxed approach to health and safety (e.g. no barriers on the edges of cliffs) should be so uptight about insuring for every possible outcome -- or maybe that's why!?

Insurance should be a personal decision. If you choose not to insure, you accept the consequences. A very high percentage of the time, there are no consequences, except that your wallet will be a little fatter. Insurers make money on people's fear.

I'm glad the velo vignette has gone. It's ridiculous to single out bicycles for compulsory insurance. What about skateboards? Inline skates? Prams? Dogs? Ferrets? Children's shoes with wheels built into them?
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Old 09.06.2012, 18:51
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

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If it were normal, or even common, then yes, maybe it might be worth insuring against, but it's not.
Most will drive a car for several years without causing accidents, but once in a while a poor chap might crash into a Veyron or cause a pile-up involvig a Ferrari fanclub. Do you also advocate against liability insurance for drivers?

The statistics are always in favor of the insurance companies and not for their clients, however it makes a lot of sense to have private liability insurance in Switzerland. It's good that it's no longer compulsory, but is still a smart thing to have for whichever reason.

Are you aware you'd have to pay compensation till the end of your (or the other persons) life if you had caused a permanent injury to someone?
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Old 10.06.2012, 10:40
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

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Are you aware you'd have to pay compensation till the end of your (or the other persons) life if you had caused a permanent injury to someone?
Where did you get this from?
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Old 10.06.2012, 12:06
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

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I'd love to be able to ignore this, but I can't - what has happened to the world that so many people feel they need personal liability cover?

There seems to be a general belief that you can be sued in any situation where an accident occurs, and of course this belief is encouraged by the "where there's blame there's a claim" legal industry, but I've yet to hear about an individual being successfully sued for liability in that sort of scenario.

If it were normal, or even common, then yes, maybe it might be worth insuring against, but it's not.
Whilst I fully understand and agree with your point about the demise of ethics in the world of blame legal, wether you have heard of a case or not being successfully won or not is a moot point. Switzerland however, unlike the US and now the UK, is not an ambulance chasing state, you cannot claim for more than you lost and claim millions in "trauma" and "there was no sign telling me not to jump into that IC's on coming path"

If however you damage someone's property or injure them the Swiss want you to put it right. This ethos works exactly the same way as the liability on a motor insurance.

Having personal liability insurance is not about the fact that everyone will sue, more on the points that most commonly it covers bodily or property damage to third parties. For example in decreasing claim orders: damage to a rented apartment on the move out, injury to persons on the ski slope and injuries to persons or property with summer sports including bike use. Additional covers are there for people wishing to rent horses, hunt or have the urge to go into a field and twang a pointy stick at a bale of hay.

As it is such a cheap and wide ranging cover, for most people it is a no brainer ...they have it, especially if they are partaking in activities that could harm others through running out of skill.

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Where did you get this from?
If a person is deemed responsible to have caused an accident that harms another or causes damage to property they will be pursued for the costs and in the event of not possessing suitable cover it will be recovered directly from the responsible party. If they are unable to pay the amount immediately an enforced payment plan will be set in place and in some cases taken directly at source.
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Old 10.06.2012, 12:12
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

Great post...Ace1...why don't you quietly remove your groan from the OP


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Whilst I fully understand and agree with your point about the demise of ethics in the world of blame legal, wether you have heard of a case or not being successfully won or not is a moot point. Switzerland however, unlike the US and now the UK, is not an ambulance chasing state, you cannot claim for more than you lost and claim millions in "trauma" and "there was no sign telling me not to jump into that IC's on coming path"

If however you damage someone's property or injure them the Swiss want you to put it right. This ethos works exactly the same way as the liability on a motor insurance.

Having personal liability insurance is not about the fact that everyone will sue, more on the points that most commonly it covers bodily or property damage to third parties. For example in decreasing claim orders: damage to a rented apartment on the move out, injury to persons on the ski slope and injuries to persons or property with summer sports including bike use. Additional covers are there for people wishing to rent horses, hunt or have the urge to go into a field and twang a pointy stick at a bale of hay.

As it is such a cheap and wide ranging cover, for most people it is a no brainer ...they have it, especially if they are partaking in activities that could harm others through running out of skill.



If a person is deemed responsible to have caused an accident that harms another or causes damage to property they will be pursued for the costs and in the event of not possessing suitable cover it will be recovered directly from the responsible party. If they are unable to pay the amount immediately an enforced payment plan will be set in place and in some cases taken directly at source.
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Old 10.06.2012, 12:54
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

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There seems to be a general belief that you can be sued in any situation where an accident occurs, and of course this belief is encouraged by the "where there's blame there's a claim" legal industry, but I've yet to hear about an individual being successfully sued for liability in that sort of scenario.
Well, Ace1, open you ears:

Last year my child caused an accident, where a second child was hurt.
The second child went to hospital and got treated and thankfully all turned out well.
A number of months later, the bill for all of the above arrived in my mailbox.

Without the personal liability insurance, I would have to pay the bill 100%
With the personal liability insurance, I only had to pay the first 200 CHF.

Was I sued? No, because I did not dispute the claim. But I accepted full responsibility for my child's actions (as I must under local law) and consequently had to pay the damages claim. Luckily, my liability insurance covered the situation.

I can only recommend to ALL readers that if you live in this country, you get personal liability insurance. You never know when something will happen, and if you are responsible, then the chances of being sent a bill for the resultant damages are, in this country, nigh on 100%.
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Old 10.06.2012, 13:21
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

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Well, Ace1, open you ears:

Last year my child caused an accident, where a second child was hurt.
The second child went to hospital and got treated and thankfully all turned out well.
A number of months later, the bill for all of the above arrived in my mailbox.

Without the personal liability insurance, I would have to pay the bill 100%
With the personal liability insurance, I only had to pay the first 200 CHF.

Was I sued? No, because I did not dispute the claim. But I accepted full responsibility for my child's actions (as I must under local law) and consequently had to pay the damages claim. Luckily, my liability insurance covered the situation.

I can only recommend to ALL readers that if you live in this country, you get personal liability insurance. You never know when something will happen, and if you are responsible, then the chances of being sent a bill for the resultant damages are, in this country, nigh on 100%.
Glad all were OK and exactly right.

As a head of part of one of the biggest insurance companies I can categorically state such claims do often occur and most cover companies here, be it a health or other insurer, WILL come after the individual in the event of an accident or damage and will per-sue the individual personally in the event of coverage not being present.
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Old 10.06.2012, 13:39
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

Quote:
I'd love to be able to ignore this, but I can't - what has happened to the world that so many people feel they need personal liability cover?

There seems to be a general belief that you can be sued in any situation where an accident occurs, and of course this belief is encouraged by the "where there's blame there's a claim" legal industry, but I've yet to hear about an individual being successfully sued for liability in that sort of scenario.

If it were normal, or even common, then yes, maybe it might be worth insuring against, but it's not.
YOU will be held liable for any damages to a third party in CH. Do not delude yourself or others. People do not normally get sued because they have Liability insurance which covers the claim.

In your specific case (you are not insured), there is a federal fund that will cover the costs of the person who is injured. Then this fund will turn to you for compensation plus costs. If you are not able to pay cash for the money that has been advanced, they will go as far as seizing any assets you have in CH (your home will be a good target). Yes, this will go in front of the courts, but be aware, you will not win against the CH federal government.

So as the others have said, liability insurance is cheap and pain free compared to the other options.

My specific example from last year. Junior does not yield the priority. Hit by a Land Rover Defender. Ten days in intensive care. Defender needs new radiator. CHF 5'500. Paid for by the velo vignette (now to be replaced by personal liability insurance).



Links to discussion on the Federal fund that will cover the damage to people/things damaged or injured by uninsured riders. They will want their money back.

Link FR: http://www.pro-velo.ch/fr/themes-et-...vignette-velo/

"Pour les personnes ne possédant pas de RC, elles devront porter les frais d’accidents dont elles sont responsables. Il existe un fonds spécial qui vient en aide aux personnes ne possédant pas de RC ou dans les cas de fuite du responsable, le Fonds National Suisse de Garantie. Toutefois, les frais doivent être remboursés si il s’avère que la personne est responsable."

Link DE: http://www.pro-velo.ch/de/themen-und.../velovignette/

"Personen, die keine Haftpflichtversicherungen abgeschlossen haben, haften persönlich für die von ihnen verursachten Schäden. Der sogenannte Schweizerische Garantiefonds kann Zahlungen für Personen leisten, welche beispielsweise durch einen Unfall mit Fahrerflucht geschädigt werden, oder für Personen, die keine Versicherungsdeckung haben. Im zweiten Fall wird der Garantiefonds aber Regress auf die unfallverursachende Person nehmen, d.h. die Kosten bei ihr einfordern."
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Last edited by Verbier; 10.06.2012 at 16:09. Reason: Added links for reference to Federal Fund
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Old 10.06.2012, 14:45
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Re: Velo Vignette valid till May 31 2012

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It's ridiculous to single out bicycles for compulsory insurance. What about skateboards? Inline skates? Prams? Dogs? Ferrets? Children's shoes with wheels built into them?
(My bold)

Just an FYI: many cantons do indeed make liability insurance compulsory for dog owners - some up to 1mio coverage, many 3 mio.

In most cases this is simply part of your Privathaftpflicht - but every dog owner must know the cantonal rules, and check one's policy to ensure that one is appropriately covered.

(In SZ, I had to give a copy of my policy to the Gemeinde when registering my dogs.)
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