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  #41  
Old 20.10.2012, 17:59
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

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Makes no difference with regard to AI, pension, etc- I have a Swiss passport, as did my parents, grand-parents, great-great.... etc - still not entitled- as I did not contribute for more than 6 months here.
You are right, but this person wants social services money. They are not asking about a pension, AI, etc...As a Swiss citizen a person is allowed social services if they can prove that they really need it.
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  #42  
Old 20.10.2012, 18:03
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

AI assurance invalidité = disability allowance. I am Swiss, with a Swiss passport, and Swiss for many many generations, forever.... still not entitled.
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  #43  
Old 20.10.2012, 18:05
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

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Makes no difference with regard to AI, pension, etc- I have a Swiss passport, as did my parents, grand-parents, great-great.... etc - still not entitled- as I did not contribute for more than 6 months here.
You would however be entitled to social security benefits if you income & capital is below a certain threshold, possibly subsidised health insurance as well.
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  #44  
Old 20.10.2012, 18:07
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Re: Told I'm not entitled to a disability allowance - how is this 'equal treatment'?

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OK, King Arthur...but do you have a physical Swiss passport is the question.
Answer is Yes.

And the thread is not about me. I was just answering to Odile.
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  #45  
Old 20.10.2012, 18:10
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

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AI assurance invalidité = disability allowance. I am Swiss, with a Swiss passport, and Swiss for many many generations, forever.... still not entitled.
AI is something different than social services money. For example, a person may have no money to pay their rent, for food, etc..They have no job prospects, no money in the bank, or very little. Their situation is dire. This is where social services helps. It is not claiming disability, or a pension etc..Or maybe the term "welfare" rings a bell? That is what social services is. It's basically "free money, and you don't need to "pay into it" in order to collect it and you don't have to pay it back either. However, I am not disagreeing with you about AI, pensions, etc...

Last edited by ProsperityJoy; 20.10.2012 at 18:21.
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  #46  
Old 20.10.2012, 18:19
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

Our daughter was born with a serious disability - she is a Swiss citizen. We spent several years fighting at the Tribunal des Assurances to get the "prestations" she should have been entitled to - without a fight. She finally got a disability pension.

I'm afraid you are being overly optimistic when it comes to how Swiss social services work - and don't work. I was surprised when a (foreign) student who worked (temporarily) at the organization I work for did get an AI pension - and relatively quickly, too. But then she was diagnosed with Stage IV renal cell carcinoma and was only given 6 months to live.

With regard to psychiatric diagnoses - very, very few Swiss people with mental illness ever get admitted to AI.

People are being thrown off AI right and left, people who are incapable of earning their living for "visible" reasons (cerebral palsy, etc.). Don't expect them to be understanding about "invisible" disorders - they really don't care and don't want to know.

Switzerland is the country of the "riche et bien portant" - they don't want poor people and they don't want sick people - especially not people suffering from chronic mental illness.

Honestly, all my sympathy, but go back to the UK. This is NOT the place to be sick and vulnerable.
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  #47  
Old 20.10.2012, 18:20
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

PJ, the OP has in earlier threads made no secret about her receiving SKOS Grundbedarf Sozialhilfe / social welfare payments.

I am inclined to agree with Odile that this is all about disability payments / claim unless my near non-existent French is worse than I had envisioned.
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  #48  
Old 20.10.2012, 18:22
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

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It's basically "free money, and you don't need to "pay into it" in order to collect it and you don't have to pay it back. .
Not quite, in CH you have to pay it back if you inherit some money or your situation changes. Your direct blood relatives are also liable to pay, that being your parents or children.
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  #49  
Old 20.10.2012, 18:23
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

Including if one has won the Lotto
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Old 20.10.2012, 18:30
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

I have a Chilean colleague ( long term C permit holder ) with bowel cancer and he is fighting the Behörde for recognition after 3 years. His plan: go back to Chile once he gets his claim approved - still waiting. Until then, he works for IZU payments of CHF300 a month.
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Old 20.10.2012, 18:32
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Re: Told I'm not entitled to a disability allowance - how is this 'equal treatment'?

I presume that here they give disability allowance to people with disabilities, not to "any waster". Or are you saying the two groups are the same? Which subset of people given disability allowance do you feel are the "wasters"?



Truly and breathtakingly ignorant.



Substitute "can't" for "don't" in that sentence, and you might get closer to the truth.



Have you ever had any extensive contact with people with mental illness? If people with depression were that easy to cure, do you think we just leave them uncured just to stop the Samaritans getting lonely?
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  #52  
Old 20.10.2012, 18:33
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

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Not quite, in CH you have to pay it back if you inherit some money or your situation changes. Your direct blood relatives are also liable to pay, that being your parents or children.
You definitely have to pay back if you start working again or if you inherit some money, as my brother found out to his dismay!


The title of the thread is definitely about disability allowance AI, NOT about the Social (a HUGE difference in the amounts, and eligibility- rules for which are stringent and getting stricter all the time). Fact is, Swiss citizens who would not have contributed for the minimum time, like me for instance, would no more be entitled than the OP - and I take no pleasure in saying that.

Last edited by Odile; 20.10.2012 at 19:03.
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  #53  
Old 20.10.2012, 18:37
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

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You definitely have to pay back if you start working again or if you inherit some money, as my brother found out to his dismay!
Which is totally fair & that's what Switzerland is all about!
Of course the normal understanding of fair is rich people paying more!
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  #54  
Old 20.10.2012, 18:48
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

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I have a Chilean colleague ( long term C permit holder ) with bowel cancer and he is fighting the Behörde for recognition after 3 years. His plan: go back to Chile once he gets his claim approved - still waiting. Until then, he works for IZU payments of CHF300 a month.
The (young) husband of the Swiss daughter of a friend had pancreatic cancer. He survived (astonishingly enough, already) but was left with severe physical disabilities and severe psychological issues. The friend's daughter didn't work (the couple had married while still at school), they had two small children and the husband (the only breadwinner) was hospitalized for months on end.

They had NO revenue coming in except for what family and friends would give them. The AI kept the case blocked for over a year - my friend suspected it was because the young husband is Tunisian - not the Swiss' most popular 'guest' nationality. Finally after a year they started getting a modest AI allowance.

OP says she came here because her parents are here. Unless she can rely on her parents financially and otherwise, she is going to find herself in an untenable situation.
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Old 20.10.2012, 20:14
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

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Not quite, in CH you have to pay it back if you inherit some money or your situation changes. Your direct blood relatives are also liable to pay, that being your parents or children.
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Including if one has won the Lotto
I have a friend who is a musician and worked for social services. Yes, if you hit the lottery or run into a HUGE inheritance you have to pay the money back. Other than that, a person is not obligated to pay money back to social services, ever. That is why they make it difficult for a person to receive it. And yes, they will help you look for work. They are very, very, strict about that. Switzerland has the lowest amount of welfare dependents in Europe. You are not allowed any extra money either. For example, if a single mother is receiving child support and on welfare, the money will go to welfare and not her. In fact, along with the expelling foreign criminals law, cheating the welfare system is part of that law as well. Switzerland will check EVERY avenue first before giving a person welfare. If a person can receive money from family and friends they will not receive welfare payments.

However, a person can make certain arrangements with social services. For example, if you have a job that has not started yet and you need emergency help then the social services can arrange to "loan you the money" so to speak, until you start working and you can pay the money back. And no, it is not true that your blood relatives etc..will be responsible to pay back the money for someone receiving social services under dire conditions.

Check the social services information. Social services is for people who are down on their luck financially. But they have to be really down...LOL
Social services and disability, AI, is something very, very, different which is what I tried to explain earlier. In fact the Social services came into this thread when SR mentioned they were going to see if they can collect it.
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Old 20.10.2012, 20:21
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

Maybe in practice it is not so, but there is a duty to repay.

Link in DE

Another link ( there are many when searched under Sozialhilfe rückzahlung verpflichtet )

And another in DE

DRS in DE

But this is social welfare / security ( the lowest safety net by virtue of Art 12 of the Constitution, in CH ) , not quite the Disability which is thought to be the topic.

OP's other thread ( where she lives on the absolute minimum amount aka SKOS Grundbedarf and has been involved in a program or two).
Attached Thumbnails
entitlement-disability-allowance-non-swiss-eu-szpayback.png   entitlement-disability-allowance-non-swiss-eu-sozi02.png  

Last edited by jrspet; 20.10.2012 at 20:46.
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  #57  
Old 20.10.2012, 20:32
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Re: Told I'm not entitled to a disability allowance - how is this 'equal treatment'?

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As I said my situation is very special.

I won't go into the details, it's not interesting.

Now, my only solution is to find a room to rent in Geneva, so I can make a request for social help again.

But without incomes, with my parents living in Spain (they are retired) every try is a fail...

I had my precedent flat with the help of my uncle who accepted to sign the lease with me.

But I can't do it again, he died two years ago....
The way i read this is you are trying to screw the system, get Swiss money to live in France. You want just a "roomn" to rent in Geneva, not even a stdio or an appartement......
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Old 20.10.2012, 20:49
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

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And no, it is not true that your blood relatives etc..will be responsible to pay back the money for someone receiving social services under dire conditions.
They will do their best to make blood relatives pay in the first place rather than social services. If the person has been 'disowned' by the family they can get out of paying.
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Old 20.10.2012, 21:01
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Re: Entitlement to disability allowance for a non-Swiss (EU)?

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They will do their best to make blood relatives pay in the first place rather than social services. If the person has been 'disowned' by the family they can get out of paying.
That's what I wrote in my post. If you can receive money from relatives or even friends, they won't give you social help...Thanks anyways for the tip
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Old 20.10.2012, 21:33
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Re: Told I'm not entitled to a disability allowance - how is this 'equal treatment'?

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The way i read this is you are trying to screw the system, get Swiss money to live in France. You want just a "roomn" to rent in Geneva, not even a stdio or an appartement......
you don't know what is my situation, so don't do hazardous and false guess.

thank you.
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