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Old 05.06.2019, 16:38
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Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

I'm shopping around for liability and contents insurance. I asked a couple of insurers whether they insure for replacement value and they all said they insure for the value at the time of the event.


What I understand from this is that if my TV burns down and I bought it five years ago for 1000 CHF, and a new comparable one today costs 1100 CHF, then the insurance will pay me a fraction of the original 1000 CHF (because it's five years old) rather than the 1100 CHF it would cost to replace that TV today and I'm out of pocket on the difference between the deprecated value the insurance paid out and the cost of a replacement TV today.


Am I misunderstanding? Are there any policy that insure for replacement value or is that unheard of in Switzerland?
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Old 05.06.2019, 16:43
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

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What I understand from this is that if my TV burns down and I bought it five years ago for 1000 CHF, and a new comparable one today costs 1100 CHF, then the insurance will pay me a fraction of the original 1000 CHF (because it's five years old) rather than the 1100 CHF it would cost to replace that TV today and I'm out of pocket on the difference between the deprecated value the insurance paid out and the cost of a replacement TV today.
Doesn't depreciated value imply that that is a fair value for a second hand device. If you want to replace a five-year old device by a new one that's not a like for like replacement but an upgrade.

I'm sure there are insurances who can offer such plans but just be prepared to pay through the nose.
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Old 05.06.2019, 16:49
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

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Doesn't depreciated value imply that that is a fair value for a second hand device. If you want to replace a five-year old device by a new one that's not a like for like replacement but an upgrade.

I'm sure there are insurances who can offer such plans but just be prepared to pay through the nose.

Where I'm from, replacement value is the norm so I was curious if it's the same in Switzerland.


The reasoning is not that it's an upgrade but rather that you had a TV yesterday so the insurance has to replace it so you have a TV again tomorrow. If your five year old model is till for sale new, then the insurance will pay for that but if it isn't it will find the closest replacement (size, quality, etc) and pay for that.



If you have to trawl ricardo etc to buy back everything used (if you can find it at all) after your place burnt down, it kinda defeats the purpose of insurance which is peace of mind IMHO.
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Old 05.06.2019, 17:20
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

I deprecate those kind of policies but it stops or limits people taking advantage. Oh dear my 20 year old TV burned down now give me a 55" OLED model.
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Old 05.06.2019, 17:32
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

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I deprecate those kind of policies but it stops or limits people taking advantage. Oh dear my 20 year old TV burned down now give me a 55" OLED model.

Well, I don't know. You paid the premiums for 20 years, and if the TV burned down you'd have the burned down TV to show that you're not making it up. There are already deductibles to avoid abuse, why should you get 5 CHF to replace your 20 year old TV when a similar TV costs 500 CHF today?


If your TV was an entry level 10" TV and you're replacing it with a 55" OLED TV, surely the insurance would object. But if your 20 year old TV was average when you bought it and you replace it by an average one today, why should the insurance under-pay you?


You buy the insurance to replace your apartment contents, not to have a yard sale at used price when disaster strikes. When the airline loses your luggage, they let you buy replacement toiletries and clothes while they're looking for the luggage; they don't discount the clothes based on how old were the ones they can't find. Or if I broke your phone, you'd expect me to replace it with the same or a similar phone, not to pay you 2 CHF because you bought it subsidized two years ago and a phone's lifespan is 3 years (allegedly).
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Old 05.06.2019, 18:05
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

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Well, I don't know. You paid the premiums for 20 years, and if the TV burned down you'd have the burned down TV to show that you're not making it up. There are already deductibles to avoid abuse, why should you get 5 CHF to replace your 20 year old TV when a similar TV costs 500 CHF today?


If your TV was an entry level 10" TV and you're replacing it with a 55" OLED TV, surely the insurance would object. But if your 20 year old TV was average when you bought it and you replace it by an average one today, why should the insurance under-pay you?


You buy the insurance to replace your apartment contents, not to have a yard sale at used price when disaster strikes. When the airline loses your luggage, they let you buy replacement toiletries and clothes while they're looking for the luggage; they don't discount the clothes based on how old were the ones they can't find. Or if I broke your phone, you'd expect me to replace it with the same or a similar phone, not to pay you 2 CHF because you bought it subsidized two years ago and a phone's lifespan is 3 years (allegedly).
It's called 'betterment', you should not be advantaged by the loss.
TV's are way cheaper than 5,10 or 30 years ago, if you are happy with a 20 year old TV by a used one, rather than a new one. TV's were very small & only standard definition 20 years ago.
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Old 05.06.2019, 18:18
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

Normally you insure the replacement value, so if your TV is worth 50,- it is estimated that you can buy a sort of equal TV for that 50,-

Tho, we are insured at Zürich and of everything that we still had a receipt we got the amount we paid for it, camera's, lenses, laptops, telly, gameconsoles, etc..(rather long list and a chaos at home) of the rest they made an estimate of what we paid for it.

I don't know the exact name/T&C of our insurance since my wife dealt with the insurance, while I dealt with the police, landlord, plumber, window replacement etc..
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Old 05.06.2019, 18:38
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

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You buy the insurance to replace your apartment contents, not to have a yard sale at used price when disaster strikes. When the airline loses your luggage, they let you buy replacement toiletries and clothes while they're looking for the luggage; they don't discount the clothes based on how old were the ones they can't find. Or if I broke your phone, you'd expect me to replace it with the same or a similar phone, not to pay you 2 CHF because you bought it subsidized two years ago and a phone's lifespan is 3 years (allegedly).
You can't compare stuff in your home to stuff an an airplane. On an airplane you trust them to look after your stuff, they fail, so they need to make amends.

In your home, its your job to look after your stuff. The insurance is not making amends for their own incompetence but is protecting you against undue hardship.

That said, I very much doubt that if the airline loses your 20 year old laptop, that they will buy you a brand new one.
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Old 05.06.2019, 18:51
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

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When the airline loses your luggage, they let you buy replacement toiletries and clothes while they're looking for the luggage; they don't discount the clothes based on how old were the ones they can't find. Or if I broke your phone, you'd expect me to replace it with the same or a similar phone, not to pay you 2 CHF because you bought it subsidized two years ago and a phone's lifespan is 3 years (allegedly).



Airlines sometimes will depreciate older items.
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Old 05.06.2019, 18:52
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

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You can't compare stuff in your home to stuff an an airplane. On an airplane you trust them to look after your stuff, they fail, so they need to make amends.

Up to a (relatively low) limit.
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Old 23.08.2019, 07:44
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

For those wondering: contents insurance offer replacement value.


If your 20 years old average quality 24" TV burns (the average available size at the time), you're going to get an average quality 55" LCD in replacement (the average size right now)


It doesn't matter how much you paid at the time, how much your old TV is worth now, or how much a new one costs. You lost an average sized and quality TV for the market 20 years ago, you're getting an average sized and quality for the market today.


Value only matters in respect to total value of your belongings and under-insurance.



It's not "betterment" as someone else said, just common sense.
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Old 23.08.2019, 10:00
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

A 20 year old Standard Definition 24" TV can in no way be compared to a 55" 4k / HD TV today.
If you chose not to upgrade you will be able to replace your old TV for free or very little with a similar or even newer model.

Your are not insuring against technical advances, redundancy. After 20 years you have had full value from your TV just the same as with a normal car.

If such a policy existed the premiums would be about 25% a year of sum insured so 50-100 times what you would be paying for insurance today. Can you imagine getting an 80 year old house, that had never been updated renovated for free, just because the owner managed to let the fire get out of control.


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For those wondering: contents insurance offer replacement value.


If your 20 years old average quality 24" TV burns (the average available size at the time), you're going to get an average quality 55" LCD in replacement (the average size right now)


It doesn't matter how much you paid at the time, how much your old TV is worth now, or how much a new one costs. You lost an average sized and quality TV for the market 20 years ago, you're getting an average sized and quality for the market today.


Value only matters in respect to total value of your belongings and under-insurance.



It's not "betterment" as someone else said, just common sense.
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Old 23.08.2019, 10:17
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

From Comparis:

https://en.comparis.ch/hausrat-versi...atversicherung

What does contents insurance cover?

Contents insurance covers damage that occurs to household goods. This includes furniture, clothes and appliances such as TVs. You are covered for any damage to household goods caused by fire, water, burglary and vandalism. Household goods are usually insured for their replacement value (what you would pay if you were to buy the same, new product now). Your insurer may also pay out for any disruption and inconvenience caused by the damage, including the cost of replacing locks, an overnight stay in a hotel, or furniture cleaning, for example.



(my bold)



As always, read the mice type carefully.
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Old 23.08.2019, 10:18
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

You can't make such general statements since they simply are not true in all situations and it all depends.

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It doesn't matter how much you paid at the time,
Yes it did, actually this was very important.
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how much your old TV is worth now
Nobody cared and this was not of any interest.
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or how much a new one costs.
Nobody cared and this was not of any interest.

We got refunded the amounts we paid for our things this regardless of their age and regardless what those things cost today. I don't know why they did it like this, I don't now our exact insurance (OH handles insurances), but this is how it went for us last year so stop telling otherwise. There are different outcomes and it all just depends on your type of insurance.

Last edited by EdwinNL; 23.08.2019 at 10:38.
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Old 23.08.2019, 10:34
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

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From Comparis:

https://en.comparis.ch/hausrat-versi...atversicherung

What does contents insurance cover?

Contents insurance covers damage that occurs to household goods. This includes furniture, clothes and appliances such as TVs. You are covered for any damage to household goods caused by fire, water, burglary and vandalism. Household goods are usually insured for their replacement value (what you would pay if you were to buy the same, new product now). Your insurer may also pay out for any disruption and inconvenience caused by the damage, including the cost of replacing locks, an overnight stay in a hotel, or furniture cleaning, for example.



(my bold)



As always, read the mice type carefully.
I would take 'usually' with a pinch of salt, new for old policies do exist however there are exceptions in the small print.
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Old 23.08.2019, 10:38
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

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A 20 year old Standard Definition 24" TV can in no way be compared to a 55" 4k / HD TV today.
If you chose not to upgrade you will be able to replace your old TV for free or very little with a similar or even newer model.

Your are not insuring against technical advances, redundancy. After 20 years you have had full value from your TV just the same as with a normal car.

If such a policy existed the premiums would be about 25% a year of sum insured so 50-100 times what you would be paying for insurance today. Can you imagine getting an 80 year old house, that had never been updated renovated for free, just because the owner managed to let the fire get out of control.

Look, I'm not going to argue with you. Call your contents insurer and ask them what happens if your 20 year old average TV is destroyed in a house fire and what they'll replace it with (or at what conditions)


I called mine, and what's in my post is what they said. My premium was one of the lowest on Comparis for my address etc.
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Old 23.08.2019, 10:42
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Re: Contents and liability insurace: replacement value policy rather than deprecated?

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Look, I'm not going to argue with you. Call your contents insurer and ask them what happens if your 20 year old average TV is destroyed in a house fire and what they'll replace it with (or at what conditions)


I called mine, and what's in my post is what they said. My premium was one of the lowest on Comparis for my address etc.
As your premium is one of the lowest, you will be getting basic cover which is why you were told what you were told,

Insurance premiums are higher than the actual risk due to a huge amount of inflated & fraudulent claims.
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