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Old 20.08.2021, 16:56
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Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

Hi folks,

A few of you might remember me, used to be active on here before life and 4 kids got in the way.

My OH has been fighting Long Covid since early April and signed off work 100%. For the first three months he got his full salary, after that 80% of full salary - in both cases paid by the employer and I guess they claimed it back from their insurance - other than a single phone call last week and a consent form back in April, we have not dealt directly with their insurance company at all.

Around that time, employer decided they would reduce his hours to 40% starting in August. The discussions happened a couple days before he got sick, contract was signed while he was sick. Now they are saying that from this month he is only 40% employed and therefore will receive only 80% of 40% = 32% salary.

Originally (back when we thought he'd be recovered long before now!) the plan was to sign on to RAV if necessary as a stopgap while he looks for full-time work, or additional part-time work, whichever. But the RAV isn't going to let him sign on at all if he's not able to work ("vermittlungsfähig") yet, correct?

Does his employer's insurance have a continued responsibility in this case, to cover 80% of his originally insured salary until he is well enough for the RAV to take him on? Does anyone? He is not Swiss but is on a C permit.

I feel like the bottom kinda fell out of the world here (not to mention out of our family's bank account...)

We have an email in to Pro Infirmis, first thing I did, but I don't suppose they'll see it until Monday. If anyone has advice to share in the meantime I'll be really grateful.
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Old 20.08.2021, 17:08
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

I'm afraid I don't know enough about employment law to be of help...

...but nonetheless I want to say I'm so sorry to hear that DB has been hit with this. Among the many tricky things about Long Covid is that it's uncharted territory - from the illness itself to how it fits in with the various support systems.

I hope that someone who knows more than I will be along soon.

My best wishes to your husband, to you, and to the family.



(And how nice to see you on the forum again! You and DB have been very much missed.)
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Old 20.08.2021, 17:13
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

What Meloncollie said. I also wish I knew anything about this….
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Old 20.08.2021, 17:13
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

Hang in there, guys. I think RAV should compensate, but am not sure. Hope somebody will chime in.
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Old 20.08.2021, 17:21
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

Hi,

You may get legal counseling. If you're living in Glarus there's free counseling next Wednesday Sep 1. A lawyer should be better suited to decide if something can be done http://www.glav.ch/unentgeltliche-rechtsauskunft.html

Hope you find an alternative soon.
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Old 20.08.2021, 17:34
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

Iam sorry to hear about your OHs situation

These guys might be able to help

Contact point association Covid long-term consequences:
Legal help throughout German-speaking Switzerland with regard to corona-related questions about occupational diseases, daily sickness benefits insurance, disability insurance, cost credit for rehabilitation stay, etc.
Contact:

https://www.covid-langzeitfolgen.ch/

Also there is Long Covid Switzerland

https://www.longcovidch.info/sprechstunden
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Old 20.08.2021, 17:38
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

This one doesn't work
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Old 20.08.2021, 17:42
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

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This one doesn't work
Fixed it
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Old 20.08.2021, 18:02
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

Talk to RAV straight away. I would call them today to request an appointment for next week - they will probably do it over the phone.


Also, talk to the insurance company that is handling the sick leave claim - your husband should know who it is.


I know the timeline is blurry,as to whether he agreed to the 40% contract before or after sick leave - it may also be really determined by whether his earlier contract had an end date when originally signed - but you can be on RAV and on sick leave - RAV becomes the "employer".



And the 'rahmenfrist' should have opened as soon as his contract was reduced - RAV may be annoyed that you did not contact them as soon as the employer offered the short contract....


Alternatively, as you say, he is actually insured and although he signed the contract he actually cannot do this whilst on sick leave. For that, you need to talk to the insurance and possibly a lawyer.


Personally, I would start with RAV. They may be pissed with you that you did not sign up sooner, but they certainly will want to deflect the financial liability to the sickness benefits insurance if they can....and they certainly will know if it was legal to ask him to reduce his contract whilst on sick leave, even with his consent.
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Old 20.08.2021, 18:03
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

Just in case.
Pro Infirmis will be able to advise you thouroughly & help with possible application.

"In the case of protracted incapacity for work: registering with the federal disability benefits authority
If there are indications that you will not be fit for work again for a long time, it’s important to register with the federal disability benefits authority (IV/AS) in good time. Contact the IV/AS office in your canton of residence. This early registration requires that you have been unfit for work for at least 30 days without interruption or have had repeated shorter absences in the last 12 months.

Immediately after you contact the IV/AS office they will consider a formal application and measures enabling you to keep your job or be integrated into a new workplace. These phases of early intervention last a maximum of 12 months. After that a decision will be made on possible further measures (for example resilience and rehabilitation training, a work trial, job coaching or retraining).

A claim for an IV/AS pension will be examined if the IV/AS authority's integration efforts do not result in the desired success. You can draw an IV/AS pension at the earliest after one year of at least 40% incapacity for work, and six months after your IV/AS application. When examining entitlement to a pension the authority assesses on a case-by-case basis what specific complaints have led to the restriction in earning capacity. It is not yet clear how the various effects of long-term COVID-19 will be classified for insurance and benefits purposes."

https://www.bag.admin.ch/bag/en/home...ong-covid.html
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Old 20.08.2021, 18:13
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

Lovely you are back. So sorry to read about DB…
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Old 20.08.2021, 18:20
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

Also can't help with any insight, but just wanted to say that I have been here 12 years and have never made the connection between MathNut and DB. Welcome back and nice to see an old face come out of the woodwork.
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Old 20.08.2021, 18:58
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

Hi and sorry to hear about your predicament.
If he is not able to work 100% for health reasons, I would have thought that the Invalidenversicherung would have kicked in.

https://www.ahv-iv.ch/en/Social-insu...y-insurance-DI

Might want to examine that angle.
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Old 20.08.2021, 21:07
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

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Hi,

You may get legal counseling. If you're living in Glarus there's free counseling next Wednesday Sep 1. A lawyer should be better suited to decide if something can be done http://www.glav.ch/unentgeltliche-rechtsauskunft.html

Hope you find an alternative soon.
Thanks, didn't know about that! I've put it in the calendar, if it isn't squared away by then I'll go down and talk to them.


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Hi and sorry to hear about your predicament.
If he is not able to work 100% for health reasons, I would have thought that the Invalidenversicherung would have kicked in.

https://www.ahv-iv.ch/en/Social-insu...y-insurance-DI

Might want to examine that angle.
As I understand it that's an option which comes into play further down the line - but yes, on our radar now and one of the things we hope to talk to Pro Infirmis about. Really really hoping another two or three months will see him right though. He's making progress toward healing - but it's week on week rather than day on day, and he has some necessary surgery at the end of this month which will ultimately help but in the short term is expected to set things back once again. (BTW he's reading over my shoulder, I would never post personal stuff like this without his permission )

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Talk to RAV straight away. I would call them today to request an appointment for next week - they will probably do it over the phone.


Also, talk to the insurance company that is handling the sick leave claim - your husband should know who it is.


I know the timeline is blurry,as to whether he agreed to the 40% contract before or after sick leave - it may also be really determined by whether his earlier contract had an end date when originally signed - but you can be on RAV and on sick leave - RAV becomes the "employer".



And the 'rahmenfrist' should have opened as soon as his contract was reduced - RAV may be annoyed that you did not contact them as soon as the employer offered the short contract....


Alternatively, as you say, he is actually insured and although he signed the contract he actually cannot do this whilst on sick leave. For that, you need to talk to the insurance and possibly a lawyer.


Personally, I would start with RAV. They may be pissed with you that you did not sign up sooner, but they certainly will want to deflect the financial liability to the sickness benefits insurance if they can....and they certainly will know if it was legal to ask him to reduce his contract whilst on sick leave, even with his consent.
Thanks a million for this. We're going to call (whichever of us has enough energy will call) the RAV first thing on Monday morning. I suspect you're right that he'll be scolded for not having approached them sooner but c'est la vie... at the time we were more concerned with keeping him off a ventilator. The new contract was literally given to him to sign the same day he came down with Covid - he brought it home in his briefcase and signed it over the weekend.

His old contract expired at the end of July - it's a yearly thing, and renewal at the same %/number of hours is never a given - and even if it had been an indefinite contract, we are now past the 3 months where sickness protects your job. The way I understand it, if he hadn't signed the new one, all that would have happened is he'd be totally unemployed right now rather than just partially... I reckon the RAV would be even less impressed by that. At this point it looks like we'll just have to take our scolding with good grace and move on.

What really scares me here is the prospect of falling between two stools - the idea that maybe the RAV won't take you on because you're sick (I notice queasily that all the examples on the Pro Infirmis site seem to start with "Frau B. is now healthy enough to look for work and registers with the RAV"), while the health insurance won't pay you more than 80%-of-40% because you aren't employed more than 40%.

Fingers and toes crossed, though, right? Nothing else I can do till Monday.

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Also can't help with any insight, but just wanted to say that I have been here 12 years and have never made the connection between MathNut and DB. Welcome back and nice to see an old face come out of the woodwork.
Well, I did try not to let it bias my moderating style too much. Happy to find that I was so successful
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Old 20.08.2021, 21:30
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

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Also can't help with any insight, but just wanted to say that I have been here 12 years and have never made the connection between MathNut and DB. Welcome back and nice to see an old face come out of the woodwork.
huh?! that was the big plot twist in season 4 of EF!

MN, sorry to hear about the situation. i can't really help but hope that you find a solution.
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Old 20.08.2021, 22:02
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

Hi OP,

I cannot provide any legal/insurance recommendations sadly. But, regarding Long Covid, I have done a lot of research and many doctors in the US have witnessed amazing effects with Ivermectin. Ivermectin is a drug used to treat malaria (among other things) and also, has significant anti-inflammatory benefits. I am not sure if this drug is available in Switzerland but the research I have done is compelling - particularly with Long Covid.

Here is a link to a website with more information:

https://covid19criticalcare.com/abou...cc-physicians/

It may be a long shot for your OH but worth investigating! I wish you both all the best .
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Old 20.08.2021, 22:06
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

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Hi OP,

I cannot provide any legal/insurance recommendations sadly. But, regarding Long Covid, I have done a lot of research and many doctors in the US have witnessed amazing effects with Ivermectin. Ivermectin is a drug used to treat malaria (among other things) and also, has significant anti-inflammatory benefits. I am not sure if this drug is available in Switzerland but the research I have done is compelling - particularly with Long Covid.

Here is a link to a website with more information:

https://covid19criticalcare.com/abou...cc-physicians/

It may be a long shot for your OH but worth investigating! I wish you both all the best .
Thanks for your good wishes! I'll pass that along in case it is something he wants to discuss with his medical team.
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Old 20.08.2021, 22:36
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

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Hi OP,

I cannot provide any legal/insurance recommendations sadly. But, regarding Long Covid, I have done a lot of research
Are you a scientist, immunologist or what not? Or by research, do you mean "read things on the net"?

Quote:
Here is a link to a website with more information:

https://covid19criticalcare.com/abou...cc-physicians/

It may be a long shot for your OH but worth investigating! I wish you both all the best .
Later news that on the FLCCC website suggests the jury is still out.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02081-w
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Old 20.08.2021, 22:51
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

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Hi OP,

I cannot provide any legal/insurance recommendations sadly. But, regarding Long Covid, I have done a lot of research and many doctors in the US have witnessed amazing effects with Ivermectin. Ivermectin is a drug used to treat malaria (among other things) and also, has significant anti-inflammatory benefits. I am not sure if this drug is available in Switzerland but the research I have done is compelling - particularly with Long Covid.

Here is a link to a website with more information:

https://covid19criticalcare.com/abou...cc-physicians/

It may be a long shot for your OH but worth investigating! I wish you both all the best .
Ivermectin is not available in Switzerland.
https://www.englishforum.ch/family-m...vermectin.html
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Old 20.08.2021, 22:58
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Re: Husband is sick, now his contract has been reduced

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Are you a scientist, immunologist or what not? Or by research, do you mean "read things on the net"?


Later news that on the FLCCC website suggests the jury is still out.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02081-w
Explain India to me then regarding Ivermectin... I am interested and then some .

You don't think Pharma has a vested interest in promoting Remdesivir, and other therapeutics which costs thousands - and Ivermectin costs pennies as it is off patent?

The jury may "still be out" but why not try all options available? After all, the jury is "still out" regarding the efficacy of vaccines - notwithstanding long term effects of vaccines. Just my thoughts...
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