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  #41  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:10
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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I am always amazed to see how a speech becomes double depending of the position of the one doing it.

Don't mock my religion and his spiritual chief but I am going to draw funny picture of Mohammad to mock him. Oh! You muslim, get over it!

I am respecting other people's religion but don't make me sit down with them and have an open discussion, because I am going to take every single worst exemple to prouve to you that your religion is the ''wrong'' one.

And to do so, I'll make sure to have as much desinformation as possible to prouve my point.

But don't mock my beliefs!
What will you do if a non religious person does the mocking? You won't have any negative examples to point out then lol
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  #42  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:14
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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You see, this is wrong. Because in Islam, for exemple, the Christianity and Jewish are both recognised and respected. Islam share the same God, Angels and Saint. For the believers, Islam is the last and final version of the 3 books.
Not really, jesus isn't revered as a god (or part of a god, trinity and all that) by jews or muslims, making one side technically atheists to the other, and blasphemous the other way.
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  #43  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:14
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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What will you do if a non religious person does the mocking? You won't have any negative examples to point out then lol
That is not going to change something. If you don,t believe in something, it doesn't give you more rights to mock others who do. As much as the believers to mock those who don't.
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  #44  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:16
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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Believers are the one having a problem with accepting what is different to their beliefs. And that, my friend, it is a different story.
Makes no sense to me. Who else is supposed to have problems if not the believers?
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  #45  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:17
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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Not really, jesus isn't revered as a god (or part of a god, trinity and all that) by jews or muslims, making one side technically atheists to the other, and blasphemous the other way.
Depends, I can't talk for Jews, but for muslims, it is a fact that Jesus came on earth from the virgin Mary and was one of the biggest figure in all religions, like Ibrahim and Mohammed, he was a prophet.

The only difference is that he isn't the son of God. And I don't think all christian have their beliefs on this one either....
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  #46  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:18
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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That is not going to change something. If you don,t believe in something, it doesn't give you more rights to mock others who do. As much as the believers to mock those who don't.
If your holy books mock and threaten me and if you willingly hold such books in high esteem then don't be shocked if I mock you.
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  #47  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:18
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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Makes no sense to me. Who else is supposed to have problems if not the believers?
Of course it doesn't make sense to you....

The believers are having the problems not the religions.
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  #48  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:20
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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If your holy books mock and threaten me and if you willingly hold such books in high esteem then don't be shocked if I mock you.
I am sorry, I don't have an Holy book.... Didn't write mine yet. But show me a book that mock an other one (Holy to Holy) and we can talk.
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  #49  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:21
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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That is not going to change something. If you don,t believe in something, it doesn't give you more rights to mock others who do. As much as the believers to mock those who don't.

Letís put mockery to one side, we've all heard it before and all it does is create a smoke cloud - it is up to the individual with the outlandish claims to prove, deduce or reasonably argue the veracity of his or her strange ideas.
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  #50  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:21
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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The only difference is that he isn't the son of God. And I don't think all christian have their beliefs on this one either....
Isn't that the defining point of being Christian? If you don't belive the Jesus is the son of god, then I don't think you can actually be a christian.

Could a muslim be a muslim if they didn't think Muhammed was a prophet?
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  #51  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:22
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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But surely the Corollary must follow that neither Islam nor Christianity can both be mutually acceptable, and surely the level of understanding of each others faith is that of believing (at least in some way) that the other is deluded.
You've made a lot of good points throughout. Doesn't this thread remind you of that interview with Hitchens and Stephen Fry where they talk about religious people complaining about their feelings being hurt? "That's offensive." lol "so bloody what," they say.

Faith should not be respected. It should be ridiculed. As you point out, it's inherently divisive. It's dangerous too. It would be okay if they kept it to themselves but they don't. Reasonable people in a democracy have the right and duty to make fun of religion (in a perhaps vain attempt to kill it) because it has a very real and harmful affect on politics. The AIDS crap in Africa is a great example. Not to mention George Bush.

And yes, he probably would love to be a saint.
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  #52  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:23
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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I am sorry, I don't have an Holy book.... Didn't write mine yet. But show me a book that mock an other one (Holy to Holy) and we can talk.
Well, doesn't having one holy book from an inerrant source that says something different to another book from an inerrant source make a mockery of both?
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  #53  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:23
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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Of course it doesn't make sense to you....

The believers are having the problems not the religions.
What is a religion without a believer? Did not know religion was a living organism with feelings.
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  #54  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:28
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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Letís put mockery to one side, we've all heard it before and all it does is create a smoke cloud - it is up to the individual with the outlandish claims to prove, deduce or reasonably argue the veracity of his or her strange ideas.
No, no one has to prove anything. That is the whole point of believing. The guy who does believe doesn't give a crap if you do or not and he certainly doesn't have to prouve to you why he does so.

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Isn't that the defining point of being Christian? If you don't belive the Jesus is the son of god, then I don't think you can actually be a christian.

Could a muslim be a muslim if they didn't think Muhammed was a prophet?
It would be impossible to believe that Mohammad wasn't a prophet since the definition of prophete itself is to be the one who brings the news, the ideas, the illumination...

For the Christian part, isn't the protestants who reject the power of the pope? And which branch are rejecting the virginity of Maria again?
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  #55  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:29
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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Isn't that the defining point of being Christian? If you don't belive the Jesus is the son of god, then I don't think you can actually be a christian.

Could a muslim be a muslim if they didn't think Muhammed was a prophet?
Exactly, and surely such deep rooted conflicts indicate that you have to stick to one camp and completely disregard the other, or disregard them all equally. you can't logically be a true 'multi faithist'.
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  #56  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:33
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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Well, doesn't having one holy book from an inerrant source that says something different to another book from an inerrant source make a mockery of both?
No

Because if you put 2 persons face to face in one situation, you'll have 2 differents view of one situation, does one is more real than the other one? Is one perception has more truth than the other one? And if so, how do you prove it? How and who decide what is the real one, the truth one and what is not.

I am not a believer, but I can't prove that the believers are wrong. Who am I to tell them that they are stupid to believe in something....
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  #57  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:33
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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No, no one has to prove anything. That is the whole point of believing.
No shit Sherlock.
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  #58  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:34
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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It would be impossible to believe that Mohammad wasn't a prophet since the definition of prophete itself is to be the one who brings the news, the ideas, the illumination...
Well apparently, it is possible, as the whole world isn't Muslim. So he's not a prophet from god to all. If you mean a broader definition, then we're all prophets.

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For the Christian part, isn't the protestants who reject the power of the pope? And which branch are rejecting the virginity of Maria again?
Don't ask me, I think there are thousands of sects of christianity but pretty sure they all think jesus was the son of god.
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  #59  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:35
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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Exactly, and surely such deep rooted conflicts indicate that you have to stick to one camp and completely disregard the other, or disregard them all equally. you can't logically be a true 'multi faithist'.
Wrong! Someone can believe in one religion but maybe not every little part of it and believe in the next religion with not every little part in it. What makes this person? I believe a multi-faithist.

You can believe in something and use your brain to try to makes sense of what is for you acceptable to believe or not.
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  #60  
Old 18.01.2011, 15:40
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Re: Pope on Fast Track to Sainthood

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Wrong! Someone can believe in one religion but maybe not every little part of it and believe in the next religion with not every little part in it. What makes this person?
I believe the word you are looking for is "dumb"
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