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  #21  
Old 11.04.2011, 12:23
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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Simply because of geographical locality, shared borders and commercial synergy.

Iceland is an isolated, small , relatively poor community. The possible consequences of paying are far greater.

The UK investors were insured against collapse. At best, the UK could demand the premiums back, but it appears to me they are trying to profit from Icleland's misfortune.
Nothing to do with the above, they all (except Spain so far) enjoyed a bailing out with EU funds that saved a collapse of their economies.

Iceland allowed its banks to behave they way they did and guaranteed deposits, if the Icelandic people have a beef, its with their own government for mismanagement. Something we all know a lot about.

The UK Depositors have been covered by the UK Govt (your tax pounds which you didnt want to be spent) the UK and Dutch govt are trying to recover that tax payers money (that you didnt want to be spent) and the Icelandic people gave them the finger. Have a think about it lunchtime when youre squeezing your ketchup out
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  #22  
Old 11.04.2011, 12:25
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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Now that the suggested repayment terms have been rejected by Icelands voters, the UK and Netherlands are pursuing legal avenues to recover their own taxpayers monies, that has already been paid out to compensate the defaults of an Icelandic bank - which seems fair to me.
Let them pursue all legal avenues. Landsbanki was a listed entity, owned by shareholders. The UK/NL governments and depositors have valid claims only against the bank, which is currently in receivership. I see no reason the Icelandic taxpayer should pay a penny.
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  #23  
Old 11.04.2011, 12:29
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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Let them pursue all legal avenues. Landsbanki was a listed entity, owned by shareholders. The UK/NL governments and depositors have valid claims only against the bank, which is currently in receivership. I see no reason the Icelandic taxpayer should pay a penny.
Indeed - and this is where the dispute lies - the UK and NL taxpayer don't see why they should pay a penny either, but they already have.

As Nev pointed out above, Iceland already compensated their own resident depositors with their own taxpayers funds - but refused to do the same for overseas depositors.

As Begga pointed out, the legal question is where the responsibility for this lies - and I still think that it seems fair to pursue legal avenues to establish that.
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  #24  
Old 11.04.2011, 12:32
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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I can't speak for the legal strengths, but each Government should protect it's own people.
Perhaps. The problem is government sponsored deposit guarantee funds are underfunded as it is.
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Old 11.04.2011, 12:39
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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Let them pursue all legal avenues. Landsbanki was a listed entity, owned by shareholders. The UK/NL governments and depositors have valid claims only against the bank, which is currently in receivership. I see no reason the Icelandic taxpayer should pay a penny.
I don't think that's right Dino. This dispute is over Iceland's commitments, not Icesave's. The UK/NL governments are claiming that Iceland failed to honour it's commitments under their deposit guarantee fund and were discriminatory in not offering overseas depositors the same protection as domestic depositors. Iceland interprets it's commitments differently.
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  #26  
Old 11.04.2011, 12:40
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

There is an argument to say why should any person be bailed out? I.e. there should be no government backed guarantees for savings.

I know this is harsh but why as private companies are these banks allowed to get away with this? It would put pressure on them to act more responsibly with peoples money in the first place. If they lose it they would get the attention they really deserve.

Bailing out ANY private company is not the role of any Government.

Again I would like to see UK taxpayers paying Zero towards the banks directly, their dodgy investments or CEO's wage packets.
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  #27  
Old 11.04.2011, 12:42
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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Nothing to do with the above, they all (except Spain so far) enjoyed a bailing out with EU funds that saved a collapse of their economies.

Iceland allowed its banks to behave they way they did and guaranteed deposits, if the Icelandic people have a beef, its with their own government for mismanagement. Something we all know a lot about.

The UK Depositors have been covered by the UK Govt (your tax pounds which you didnt want to be spent) the UK and Dutch govt are trying to recover that tax payers money (that you didnt want to be spent) and the Icelandic people gave them the finger. Have a think about it lunchtime when youre squeezing your ketchup out
So, perhaps you are saying that the government of the country that the bank is HQ'ed in , should refund all international customers/investors that lost money ?

Shouldn't our attention be turning more West ?
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  #28  
Old 11.04.2011, 12:53
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

I almost recommended Kaupthing to my brother at some point (without investing myself).
They offered a very high interest rate at the time - and as such, topped all lists on financial websites.

The problem was that a lot of people signed up with Kaupthing, Glitnir and Landesbanki without asking themselves: "How does this work?".
I remember, I really didn't think about it myself - beyond "Hey, cool.".

It was a dangerous mixture of greed and stupidity.

Personally, I think the British and Dutch governments should write-off those couple of billions and bill them to the "education" department or wherever.
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  #29  
Old 11.04.2011, 13:16
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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So, perhaps you are saying that the government of the country that the bank is HQ'ed in , should refund all international customers/investors that lost money ?

Shouldn't our attention be turning more West ?
no we shouldnt because all deposits in the US are guaranteed up to 250,000 regardless of the citizenship of the account holder and to date this pledge has not been broken.

"Any person or entity can have FDIC insurance coverage in an insured bank. A person does not have to be a U.S. citizen or resident to have his or her deposits insured by the FDIC." http://www.fdic.gov/deposit/deposits...ed/basics.html

thanks for trying twice but i'm here today
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  #30  
Old 11.04.2011, 13:44
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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no we shouldnt because all deposits in the US are guaranteed up to 250,000 regardless of the citizenship of the account holder and to date this pledge has not been broken.

"Any person or entity can have FDIC insurance coverage in an insured bank. A person does not have to be a U.S. citizen or resident to have his or her deposits insured by the FDIC." http://www.fdic.gov/deposit/deposits...ed/basics.html

thanks for trying twice but i'm here today
I see nothing about citizenship in that link.
Also, that applies to US banks operating in the US.
"The FDIC protects depositors of insured banks located in the United States"

So , if a bank has an HQ in the US, and it's Icelandic subsidiary goes bust, you are saying thet Icelandics would be covered right ? I see nothing in the article to suggest that. I see nothing to suggest any parallels with the Icelandic Bank operating a schema in the UK.

Are you sure you are here
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  #31  
Old 11.04.2011, 13:53
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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Iceland allowed its banks to behave they way they did and guaranteed deposits, if the Icelandic people have a beef, its with their own government for mismanagement.
I can assure you, that has happened already.
Not only have most of the CEO's of the banks been prosecuted, but also the former prime minister. Icelanders are in general very pieceful nation, there haven't been many demonstrations that I can remember. But the wreath over the last 2 1/2 year, is beyond everything I could ever imagine. Loud and ugly demonstration after demonstration.
I can tell you, I'd NEVER heard a word about Icesave before 8. October 2008, and I was absolutely furious learning about it. I hope Icelanders will NEVER forget who put us into this situation. I have some difficulties about forming my decision with Icesave because I simply doubt the integrity of the politicians so much when they give their special opinion about it. Now of course, the loudest group against the Icesave agreement is the former government - the one who put us into this mess. It's a shame that they dare to open their mouth about it and hear them call the current government incompetent. Makes me question if voting now is really the nation's best interest or the desperat vote hunting party interest.
I am SO sick and tired of Icesave, I really hope we can just take this to a court as soon as possible and close this case.
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  #32  
Old 11.04.2011, 13:53
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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I don't think that's right Dino. This dispute is over Iceland's commitments, not Icesave's. The UK/NL governments are claiming that Iceland failed to honour it's commitments under their deposit guarantee fund and were discriminatory in not offering overseas depositors the same protection as domestic depositors. Iceland interprets it's commitments differently.
Fair point Nev. I am not well versed with the applicable law, but purely from a common sense perspective, shouldn't banking regulators in UK and NL have done their due diligence before allowing the 3 Icelandic banks to operate in their jurisdictions and take deposits from their citizens?
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  #33  
Old 11.04.2011, 14:02
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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I see nothing about citizenship in that link.
Also, that applies to US banks operating in the US.
"The FDIC protects depositors of insured banks located in the United States"

So , if a bank has an HQ in the US, and it's Icelandic subsidiary goes bust, you are saying thet Icelandics would be covered right ? I see nothing in the article to suggest that. I see nothing to suggest any parallels with the Icelandic Bank operating a schema in the UK.

Are you sure you are here
what are you reading? citizenship is covered in the 2nd paragraph.

deposit bank insurance is the local country's responsibility. the US covers deposits of all persons regardless of nationality if they make it in a US bank. if iceland didn't want to insure the deposits of foreign nationals who deposited money into iceland's bank, then it's their choice and the responsibility of the depositors to know and understand the risk they're taking (which wasn't without reward, since interest rates were in the double digits during the boom); however, it isn't clear whether foreign nationals were covered under the deposit insurance at the time or whether they were made aware of this, which gives rise to the present case.
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  #34  
Old 11.04.2011, 15:08
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

Bad timing of the Dutch government to cut heavily on Defence now that they seem to get a little bit of extra land overseas to train on.
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  #35  
Old 11.04.2011, 15:49
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

They the Icelanders can vote however they like at the end of the day the money has to be paid back and any short term gains, by coming accross all aggresive towards the Netherlands and the Uk will only end up in defeat if they want to remain in the EU they will have to pay up!
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  #36  
Old 11.04.2011, 15:53
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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They the Icelanders can vote however they like at the end of the day the money has to be paid back and any short term gains, by coming accross all aggresive towards the Netherlands and the Uk will only end up in defeat if they want to remain in the EU they will have to pay up!
Well, if the international court finds in their favour, no they won't...
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Old 11.04.2011, 15:57
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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They the Icelanders can vote however they like at the end of the day the money has to be paid back and any short term gains, by coming accross all aggresive towards the Netherlands and the Uk will only end up in defeat if they want to remain in the EU they will have to pay up!


When did they join ???
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  #38  
Old 11.04.2011, 15:59
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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They the Icelanders can vote however they like at the end of the day the money has to be paid back and any short term gains, by coming accross all aggresive towards the Netherlands and the Uk will only end up in defeat if they want to remain in the EU they will have to pay up!
They aren't in the EU to start with.
They have asked to join - but that's a very slow process.
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  #39  
Old 11.04.2011, 16:15
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

EU is very controversial in Iceland.
I'd guess it's around 50/50 if we'd vote for it.
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  #40  
Old 11.04.2011, 16:20
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Re: Iceland votes "NO!"

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EU is very controversial in Iceland.
I'd guess it's around 50/50 if we'd vote for it.
Even then, I wouldn't be surprised if GB and / or NL will now use their veto against Iceland entering the EU.
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