Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Off-Topic > Off-Topic > International affairs/politics  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 31.05.2011, 08:31
AmericanGotWorkVisa's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Zug
Posts: 363
Groaned at 51 Times in 30 Posts
Thanked 380 Times in 157 Posts
AmericanGotWorkVisa has slipped a little
Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

You can read more about it here. The military says they didn't want any rape allegation and they knew these were "bad girls" because they camped out overnight with men. Oh the horror. In any case they found not one of the girls detained was a virgin after subjecting them to forced medical exams and repeated stun-gun attacks.

So does the Egyptian military mean that a girl who is not a virgin, but not married, cannot be raped? That seems to be the implication of the comments.

I know, the reality is that they just wanted to terrorize and shame the women, but damn, at least make a public statement that is remotely logical to a moron.

While this is shocking and disgusting, Mubarrak was a light weight dictator. Around the same time in Ivory Coast a rather large group of women protesters (many with children) were shot down in the street with machine guns. :-( Assad in Assyria is fond of this method too. Sudan just does the "rape and enslavement thing"...sigh...
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 31.05.2011, 08:34
Upthehatters2008's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2010
Location: In the kitchen at parties.
Posts: 4,540
Groaned at 204 Times in 120 Posts
Thanked 6,078 Times in 2,378 Posts
Upthehatters2008 has a reputation beyond reputeUpthehatters2008 has a reputation beyond reputeUpthehatters2008 has a reputation beyond reputeUpthehatters2008 has a reputation beyond reputeUpthehatters2008 has a reputation beyond reputeUpthehatters2008 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women in Tahrir Square Protests Subjected to Virginity Tests

Got any happy stories to start Tuesday off with?
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank Upthehatters2008 for this useful post:
  #3  
Old 31.05.2011, 08:39
lost_inbroad's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Town or region
Posts: 11,491
Groaned at 655 Times in 417 Posts
Thanked 16,388 Times in 6,379 Posts
lost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women in Tahrir Square Protests Subjected to Virginity Tests

Quote:
View Post
Got any happy stories to start Tuesday off with?
Geico saved me a whole lotta money on my car insurance...how's that one for a starter?
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank lost_inbroad for this useful post:
  #4  
Old 31.05.2011, 08:43
AmericanGotWorkVisa's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Zug
Posts: 363
Groaned at 51 Times in 30 Posts
Thanked 380 Times in 157 Posts
AmericanGotWorkVisa has slipped a little
Re: Women in Tahrir Square Protests Subjected to Virginity Tests

Quote:
View Post
Got any happy stories to start Tuesday off with?

Why yes...not sure this counts but I was mildly traumatized by a prime-time tv does of a Naked-Cult in Germany. haha

Although my fiancee was disgusted, I found it amusing.

Okay back to the topic.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 31.05.2011, 08:55
Nil's Avatar
Nil Nil is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Basel
Posts: 10,356
Groaned at 428 Times in 333 Posts
Thanked 16,045 Times in 6,322 Posts
Nil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

It is with this kind of news that I find it difficult to argue with someone who accuse Middle Eastern countries to be a bunch of barbarians...



Still so much work to do and the question I can ask is: Will we achieve it? Will we be able to see real and true respect of the Human rights?

Those women who have been raped during the Revolutions have been raped again with this disgusting statement from the army.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Nil for this useful post:
  #6  
Old 31.05.2011, 08:59
lost_inbroad's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Town or region
Posts: 11,491
Groaned at 655 Times in 417 Posts
Thanked 16,388 Times in 6,379 Posts
lost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

I think this is not necessarily an issue solely pertaining to the middle east. I've noticed similar idiocy, wherever religion has a stronghold of society. These people simply lost the ability to sit down and cogigate about what's best for society...but much rather prefer to rest on old principles and cultural standards. We should abolish all religions I say.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank lost_inbroad for this useful post:
  #7  
Old 31.05.2011, 09:06
Nil's Avatar
Nil Nil is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Basel
Posts: 10,356
Groaned at 428 Times in 333 Posts
Thanked 16,045 Times in 6,322 Posts
Nil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

Quote:
View Post
I think this is not necessarily an issue solely pertaining to the middle east. I've noticed similar idiocy, wherever religion has a stronghold of society. These people simply lost the ability to sit down and cogigate about what's best for society...but much rather prefer to rest on old principles and cultural standards. We should abolish all religions I say.
I agree with you Buddy!

But Middle East is an easy target when it comes to pass judgements. And with statements like this, it doesn't help to grow a better image!
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 31.05.2011, 09:08
lost_inbroad's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Town or region
Posts: 11,491
Groaned at 655 Times in 417 Posts
Thanked 16,388 Times in 6,379 Posts
lost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

Quote:
View Post
I agree with you Buddy!

But Middle East is an easy target when it comes to pass judgements. And with statements like this, it doesn't help to grow a better image!
Certainly, but you could easly point a finger at Christian Africa..the only difference is, that the media spotlight is not necessarily directed at that IMO.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank lost_inbroad for this useful post:
  #9  
Old 31.05.2011, 09:24
AmericanGotWorkVisa's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Zug
Posts: 363
Groaned at 51 Times in 30 Posts
Thanked 380 Times in 157 Posts
AmericanGotWorkVisa has slipped a little
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

Although Christian Africans are pretty fundamentalist on average (compared to Western Christians) I see patterns, and you are right it is not necessarily the Middle East.

It is more like North Africa, Middle East, Horn of Africa, Caucasus (maybe parts of them), South Asia (including Hindus in India) tend to have this honor culture, and women are see as another extension of the lead males honor. How they act matters.

Virginity test, honor killings, etc this common trend of objectifying women as an object, usually in relation to the honor of men seems very very prevalent in these areas.

You don't see this in East Asia, Southeast Asia, the Pacific Islands, nor in most of Africa that is not Muslim. I don't think it is specific to muslims, it is probably pre-Islamic, since there are cases where you see this in non-Muslims in India or Christians in Palestine/Lebanon.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 31.05.2011, 11:54
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 14,954
Groaned at 295 Times in 199 Posts
Thanked 19,026 Times in 8,002 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women in Tahrir Square Protests Subjected to Virginity Tests

Quote:
View Post
Got any happy stories to start Tuesday off with?
Does that fit in with the Tragic Tuesday theme?
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 31.05.2011, 13:04
Pashosh's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Baden
Posts: 449
Groaned at 222 Times in 158 Posts
Thanked 1,823 Times in 1,002 Posts
Pashosh is considered a nuisancePashosh is considered a nuisancePashosh is considered a nuisance
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

I brought this treatment of Women already here.

There is a reason for the "women only" carriages in the Cairo metro - but it's not politically correct to discuss it.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Pashosh for this useful post:
  #12  
Old 31.05.2011, 13:16
NotAllThere's Avatar
Modulo 2
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Baselland
Posts: 15,046
Groaned at 307 Times in 263 Posts
Thanked 23,226 Times in 9,433 Posts
NotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

The attitude to women is not a religious thing, as such. Religion can be used either against or for women. Where there Christians and Muslims living in the same area, many of the local attitudes to women are identical regardless of religion. Communism has a slightly better record when it comes to the treatment of women. But only slightly. Consider what happened to women in the Gulags, for example.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank NotAllThere for this useful post:
  #13  
Old 31.05.2011, 13:38
Castro's Avatar
ŕ la mod
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: ZG
Posts: 5,730
Groaned at 126 Times in 102 Posts
Thanked 17,262 Times in 5,480 Posts
Castro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

Quote:
View Post
There is a reason for the "women only" carriages in the Cairo metro - but it's not politically correct to discuss it.
I followed the accompanying blog to that picture from Lisa Goodman and she had this to say:

By the way, I took the photo of the subway route map while riding in a carriage reserved for women only. In general, sexual harassment in Egypt is annoying and a bit oppressive, but not nearly as bad as I had expected – and certainly no worse than the harassment I experienced while traveling in India, where I used to travel in the “ladies’ compartment” during long inter-urban train journeys.

It’s remarkably relaxing to travel in a women-only compartment.


Am I missing something?
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 31.05.2011, 13:47
Pashosh's Avatar
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Baden
Posts: 449
Groaned at 222 Times in 158 Posts
Thanked 1,823 Times in 1,002 Posts
Pashosh is considered a nuisancePashosh is considered a nuisancePashosh is considered a nuisance
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

Quote:
View Post
I followed the accompanying blog to that picture from Lisa Goodman and she had this to say:

By the way, I took the photo of the subway route map while riding in a carriage reserved for women only. In general, sexual harassment in Egypt is annoying and a bit oppressive, but not nearly as bad as I had expected – and certainly no worse than the harassment I experienced while traveling in India, where I used to travel in the “ladies’ compartment” during long inter-urban train journeys.

It’s remarkably relaxing to travel in a women-only compartment.


Am I missing something?
Nope, you got it right - Sexual harassment is rife in Egypt.

"we were never harassed on the Metro like we were on the buses.''

Hence it's relaxing for Lisa Goldman (not goodman), who is a good looking western women to be away from it for a while.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 31.05.2011, 13:52
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

Quote:
View Post
It is with this kind of news that I find it difficult to argue with someone who accuse Middle Eastern countries to be a bunch of barbarians...



Still so much work to do and the question I can ask is: Will we achieve it? Will we be able to see real and true respect of the Human rights?

Those women who have been raped during the Revolutions have been raped again with this disgusting statement from the army.
Well only if they ban religion, as we all know bad people do bad things, religion is the only thing that makes otherwise good people do bad things.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank for this useful post:
  #16  
Old 31.05.2011, 13:57
hoppy
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

Quote:
View Post
The attitude to women is not a religious thing, as such. Religion can be used either against or for women. Where there Christians and Muslims living in the same area, many of the local attitudes to women are identical regardless of religion. Communism has a slightly better record when it comes to the treatment of women. But only slightly. Consider what happened to women in the Gulags, for example.
There were also the virginity tests instituted by Margaret Thatcher's government mainly on Indian brides for immigration purposes.

What I find abhorrent is rape as a weapon of war. There are reports of mass rape in Libya with girls from the age of 13. The soldiers had been reportedly been given Viagra to aid the process.

However, others allege that the stories are not true and are being used excuse upping the ante by claiming war crimes

Quote:
However, a report from NBC News states that diplomats questioned about the allegations indicated that Rice provided no evidence for the Viagra allegation, which they said "was made in an attempt to persuade doubters the conflict in Libya was not just a standard civil war but a much nastier fight".
http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2011/04/3...rape-campaign/

Quote:
And on Friday, military and intelligence officials, speaking anonymously, said there was no evidence that that was true.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42824884...deastn_africa/

So the claims are being investigated by the ICC.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 31.05.2011, 14:07
MrVertigo's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CH
Posts: 3,200
Groaned at 86 Times in 70 Posts
Thanked 5,788 Times in 2,254 Posts
MrVertigo has a reputation beyond reputeMrVertigo has a reputation beyond reputeMrVertigo has a reputation beyond reputeMrVertigo has a reputation beyond reputeMrVertigo has a reputation beyond reputeMrVertigo has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

Tokyo metro is well known also for all types of sexual harrasment like groping (chikan). The women only passenger car is not specific to Cairo.

But I guess there are some people who are addicted to arab/muslim bashing when they find the opportunity to do it.
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank MrVertigo for this useful post:
  #18  
Old 31.05.2011, 14:08
Nil's Avatar
Nil Nil is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Basel
Posts: 10,356
Groaned at 428 Times in 333 Posts
Thanked 16,045 Times in 6,322 Posts
Nil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond reputeNil has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

Quote:
View Post
Well only if they ban religion, as we all know bad people do bad things, religion is the only thing that makes otherwise good people do bad things.
Religion doesn't do anything on people, it is people who do something on the name of religion.

Religion help also bad people to do good things and good people to do good things too.

Religion is not an excuse for being bad. It is too easy to put bad behavior on religion but the only one who do bad things and act badly is the person, not the religion.

You have more people doing good things from the religion than bad things. What is their excuse?
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Nil for this useful post:
  #19  
Old 31.05.2011, 14:15
hoppy
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

Quote:
View Post
Nope, you got it right - Sexual harassment is rife in Egypt.

"we were never harassed on the Metro like we were on the buses.''

Hence it's relaxing for Lisa Goldman (not goodman), who is a good looking western women to be away from it for a while.
I have been sexually harassed and molested in every country except Iran. London packed tubes were the worst, French metro, Italy, Spain US work, clubs..... Women everywhere just put up with it for years, even though we teach our daughters not to. Things must be improving it hasn't happened to my daughter yet. She is tall, incredibly physically and mentally strong and has martial arts training. She has a very powerful and accurate kick.

There is no such thing as a truly accurate virginity test- it's a load of bunk.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 31.05.2011, 14:16
lost_inbroad's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Town or region
Posts: 11,491
Groaned at 655 Times in 417 Posts
Thanked 16,388 Times in 6,379 Posts
lost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Women Victimized in Revolutions: a Tahrir Square Virginity Test Experience

Quote:
View Post
Religion doesn't do anything on people, it is people who do something on the name of religion.

Religion help also bad people to do good things and good people to do good things too.

Religion is not an excuse for being bad. It is too easy to put bad behavior on religion but the only one who do bad things and act badly is the person, not the religion.

You have more people doing good things from the religion than bad things. What is their excuse?
You definitely have more people doing harm because of religion than actual good. Look at all the wars, slavery, random segregation etc. all based on religions.
Reply With Quote
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Student protests London hoppy International affairs/politics 148 14.12.2010 21:45
Protests escalating in Suttgart prof. taratonga International affairs/politics 3 30.09.2010 19:55
UK Election Day and Protests rrs International affairs/politics 10 30.04.2010 16:15
I lost my virginity * Joke alert * Phil_MCR General off-topic 27 10.11.2009 23:20
Why are there always protests in Zurich??? cremebrulee Complaints corner 91 19.05.2009 10:55


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 04:07.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0