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-   -   What to do so people stop hating the UK? (https://www.englishforum.ch/international-affairs-politics/121339-what-do-so-people-stop-hating-uk.html)

Guest 06.08.2011 11:58

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
'Castro' for PM now.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Castro (Post 1290272)
Re-nationalise the railways
Confiscate passports from Brits who behave badly abroad
Bring back prison chain gangs and hard labour
1 year National Service (military or social work)
Massive tax breaks for manufacturing industries
Regulate the rental housing market
Escalating tax rates for multiple property ownership
Abolish Mickey Mouse University degrees and make apprenticeships more attractive
Make politicians criminally culpable for wasting public money (e.g. £1billion spent on an obsolete IT system :mad:)
Ban 600% APR loan sharks
Ban no-win-no-fee ambulance chasers
Introduce a junk food tax but gym membership subsidies

When do I start?


AbFab 06.08.2011 12:57

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Britain has to realise the empire is gone, the EU is on a corrupt hiding to nowhere, her manufacturing-base is all but gone. Post-industrial Britain needs to rethink everything. Here's a few suggestions:

- leave the EU
- dismantle the National Health Service and the nanny state make people responsible for their own welfare, rather than the government.
- dismantle the armed forces
- abandon the treadmill of economic growth v. inflation and return to a self-sufficient lifestyle where people grow vegetables instead of lawns
- nationalise the banking system with a non-profit constitution people's bank
- make house speculation subject to swinging capital gains tax
- likewise the stock exchange should be made so that shares can only be sold after they have been held for 5 years

I feel that this is what is going to happen anyway over the next 25 years...

07.08.2011 01:36

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by AbFab (Post 1290508)
Britain has to realise the empire is gone, the EU is on a corrupt hiding to nowhere, her manufacturing-base is all but gone. Post-industrial Britain needs to rethink everything. Here's a few suggestions:

- leave the EU
- dismantle the National Health Service and the nanny state make people responsible for their own welfare, rather than the government.
- dismantle the armed forces
- abandon the treadmill of economic growth v. inflation and return to a self-sufficient lifestyle where people grow vegetables instead of lawns
- nationalise the banking system with a non-profit constitution people's bank
- make house speculation subject to swinging capital gains tax
- likewise the stock exchange should be made so that shares can only be sold after they have been held for 5 years

I feel that this is what is going to happen anyway over the next 25 years...

I think you will achieve a Cuba with Chavs! Abolishing greed would be a good start.

07.08.2011 03:49

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quit paying out social security for the unemployed. Instead all able-bodied must commit to 40 hours a week as community employed a portion of which of which would include basic education and training in conjunction with the private industry. The work must be both physically and mentally challenging and include mentoring. There should also be a component to allow them to make use of any talent that they might have. e.g. performing arts, science, sports, engineering or literacy skills to provide free shows and services for the local community. The 'Community employed' are paid according to progress made. The time spent in community service must be split between city and country. There would also be a peace corps type commitment. The program would include women with young children, whose children will be cared for and educated in a local creche. All participants must vote in publicly held elections. the UK should adopt a two-child only policy.

Police should live in the communities that they police.

The program should be properly funded and participants treated with respect.

The NHS is for nationals only, those who do not produce a passport or health insurance for treatment should be held and forced to work until payment is made.
Massive input into community housing and planning.
Companies should be given tax incentives to train and employ.
Cigarettes-Alcohol and Petrol should be heavily taxed. Community workers will be provided with bicycles. Safe Playgrounds and parks should be within everyone's reach, these must be supervised and aesthetically pleasing.

Schools should teach basic life economics and politics,-life costs, wage slip, bank accounts, mortgage, investments, voting systems, etc.

Schooling should include participation in nature starting with nature walks and culminate in outward bound courses. School meals should be nutritional and free. Schooling should include the playing of a musical instrument.

All libraries should provide free internet access, and basic computer skills training.

Big brother/ sister and grandparent programs should be encouraged.

All university education should be free for all on the proviso that a percentage of that time is spent post study in volunteer activities donated towards educational institutions in mentoring, teaching or research. Any person accepting free education and leaving the country without repaying would be fined.

All produced through university research should be patented.

Banks should adopt Swiss banking rules.

Union membership should be independently monitored.

The House of Lords and royalty should be abolished.

The transport system should be nationalized and subsidized. A comprehensive bike path system built.

Jimmy Bee 07.08.2011 08:09

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
I believe this thread is called "What to do so people stop hating the UK?" not "Lets take back the UK to the grand old 1950's/Young people are ruining my lawn" :msntongue:

KeinFranzösisch 07.08.2011 08:29

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
I'm surprised nobody mentioned doing away with the monarchy...

Dack Rambo 07.08.2011 10:19

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hoppy (Post 1291228)
Quit paying out social security for the unemployed. Instead all able-bodied must commit to 40 hours a week as community employed a portion of which of which would include basic education and training in conjunction with the private industry.

state sponsored make work schemes? sounds like communism to me

Terry Concorde 07.08.2011 11:44

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Wow, I've never come across so much sub-Top Gear, reactionary bile as on this thread and the accompanying threads. If it's not suggesting that regulatory control of police power is "pc gone mad", then it's "humorous" quips about nuking Brixton, which I assume is a coded attack on multi-culturalism in the same vein as Disco Demolition Night. Why choose Brixton and not, for example, Hull or Slough or Kilmarnock? Does nobody remember the numerous miscarriages of justice and judicial corruption that led to the introduction of current policing practices?

Acute solipsism has thus far prevented an answer to the question. The question that has been attempted so far is, "What to do so UK expats that left because of litter/unfashionable tracksuits at bus stops/perceived too tightly regulated justice system stop hating the UK?" I would say that, statistically at least, most people that hate the UK do so because they are the innocent victim of some aspect of British foreign policy and/or business interests. Clearing that up will do more to reduce the number of UK haters than any number of attempts to reanimate Lord Denning.

btw A rather northern perspective but most people that live in the UK and profess to hate it would hate it less if the weather was better.

higgybaby 07.08.2011 13:29

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Assassin (Post 1289968)
The only thing I'd miss if England sank was the rock music scene and the Avro Vulcan.

Too late. dinosaur music's all but dead in the UK, thankfully.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-11212418

07.08.2011 23:50

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by KeinFranzösisch (Post 1291254)
I'm surprised nobody mentioned doing away with the monarchy...

I did- second line from the bottom. Attitudes have to change, those with jobs look down on the jobless and the jobless sometimes react by playing up to that image by saying if you can't beat the system then play it for all it's worth, when they get the chance. It is an increasingly divided society.- the 'have jobs' and the 'have no jobs'.
The jobless need to be respected by giving them jobs. To me it's an easy equation; there is so much that needs to be done in the UK and so many unemployed. The devil makes work for idle hands.

colinwheeler 08.08.2011 00:47

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Bring back:
- Respect
- Manners
Introduce
- Social Education
- Cultural Education (Note, these things do no occur in schools...lol.)
Get Rid of:
-Overweight government
-The ability to live on the dole when you are to lazy to work.
-The ability for your dole children to inherit your council house.
Reform
-Electoral system reform for a local community driven direct democracy
-The NHS for a better system
Things that stand in the way that I have no idea how to change:
-The idea that national infrstructure should be owned by private companies and allowed to profit off the citizens that paid for it to be established in the first place. Run it like a private company by all means, but the citizens should not allowed to be profited from and they must the shareholders.
-Corruption in government and corporates....a lot of which I believe comes from the above problem.
-Apathy amongst the masses.
-An education system that has as it's vision statement "To make good employees." Simply evil if you ask me.
-The idea that prohibition is better than education, or even that prohibition works in any way.
-Peter Mendelson:msntongue:

colinwheeler 08.08.2011 00:53

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hoppy (Post 1291228)
The House of Lords and royalty should be abolished.

So no system of checks and balances at all? I don't care what it is, as long as it is there and works....the current one could do with an overhaul or some balls but checks and balances are needed for this Utopian Big Brother style country that you are proposing.
Quote:

Originally Posted by hoppy (Post 1291228)
The transport system should be nationalized and subsidized. A comprehensive bike path system built.

The bike paths are getting much better and the transport system is already heavily subsidised.
The infrastructure has already been re-nationalised but to little or no effect because it is now run like a government department again rather than like the citizen's company.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Ittigen (Post 1289841)
Britain needs one more law

And right off that breaks the whole thing....oh look the law that broke the nation's back. How some personal responsiblity, social and cultural understanding and education and a little bit of a community spirit would work better than having more laws.
Quote:

Originally Posted by AbFab (Post 1290508)
- nationalise the banking system with a non-profit constitution people's bank

Wow, I don't trust the governments with my money in the first place, now you want them to have complete control over it.....nope, sorry, no chance.

I am not sure about the stock market suggestion but........I don't know. Neutral so would not like too much interferance.

Otherwise, I am pretty much completely with you! Good ideas.

cannut 08.08.2011 01:08

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hoppy (Post 1291228)
Quit paying out social security for the unemployed. Instead all able-bodied must commit to 40 hours a week as community employed a portion of which of which would include basic education and training in conjunction with the private industry. The work must be both physically and mentally challenging and include mentoring. There should also be a component to allow them to make use of any talent that they might have. e.g. performing arts, science, sports, engineering or literacy skills to provide free shows and services for the local community. The 'Community employed' are paid according to progress made. The time spent in community service must be split between city and country. There would also be a peace corps type commitment. The program would include women with young children, whose children will be cared for and educated in a local creche. All participants must vote in publicly held elections. the UK should adopt a two-child only policy.

Police should live in the communities that they police.

The program should be properly funded and participants treated with respect.

The NHS is for nationals only, those who do not produce a passport or health insurance for treatment should be held and forced to work until payment is made.
Massive input into community housing and planning.
Companies should be given tax incentives to train and employ.
Cigarettes-Alcohol and Petrol should be heavily taxed. Community workers will be provided with bicycles. Safe Playgrounds and parks should be within everyone's reach, these must be supervised and aesthetically pleasing.

Schools should teach basic life economics and politics,-life costs, wage slip, bank accounts, mortgage, investments, voting systems, etc.

Schooling should include participation in nature starting with nature walks and culminate in outward bound courses. School meals should be nutritional and free. Schooling should include the playing of a musical instrument.

All libraries should provide free internet access, and basic computer skills training.

Big brother/ sister and grandparent programs should be encouraged.

All university education should be free for all on the proviso that a percentage of that time is spent post study in volunteer activities donated towards educational institutions in mentoring, teaching or research. Any person accepting free education and leaving the country without repaying would be fined.

All produced through university research should be patented.

Banks should adopt Swiss banking rules.

Union membership should be independently monitored.

The House of Lords and royalty should be abolished.

The transport system should be nationalized and subsidized. A comprehensive bike path system built.

Hoppy! do you have relatives in Germany ,a uncle named Adolph ? :rolleyes:

colinwheeler 08.08.2011 01:13

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cannut (Post 1292102)
Hoppy! do you have relatives in Germany ,a uncle named Adolph ? :rolleyes:

I think you will find he was Austrian though. :D

08.08.2011 01:45

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cannut (Post 1292102)
Hoppy! do you have relatives in Germany ,a uncle named Adolph ? :rolleyes:

I am a bit of a Tartar, see you thought I was perfect because I don't like to shop. All that glitters is not gold even if the packaging is good. Could you imagine being married to me or having me as a mother? DB and Shorrick do not answer this.
I was going to go further- have you seen the obesity figures in the UK? They should tax junk food more and subsidize fruit and veg.

And fine posers; they are ruining the pubs!

cannut 08.08.2011 01:55

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by hoppy (Post 1292117)
I am a bit of a Tartar, see you thought I was perfect because I don't like to shop. All that glitters is not gold even if the packaging is good. Could you imagine being married to me or having me as a mother? DB and Shorrick do not answer this.
I was going to go further- have you seen the obesity figures in the UK? They should tax junk food more and subsidize fruit and veg.

And fine posers; they are ruining the pubs!

Send some pictures , and I will answer your question;)

phdoofus 08.08.2011 08:42

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Always go with the classics: Get them to hate some other country even more. :D

Louis Wu 08.08.2011 09:10

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by phdoofus (Post 1292183)
Always go with the classics: Get them to hate some other country even more. :D


Yep, we even have the 'enemy' bogey man all ready, it currently goes under the guise of "International Terrorism" and creates a perfect excuse for a more or less permanent state of war. George Orwell would be proud.

glinaa 08.08.2011 09:31

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
I used to think Polish were the most self-bashing nationality, but seeing you people go on, I see we stand no chance :-).

Still, not having to see Britain with all its political problems in perspective, I think you people have good attitude, culture, and all the British I've met around in my life were simply great people.
Why hate the UK?

CorsebouTheReturn 08.08.2011 09:46

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by glinaa (Post 1292224)
I used to think Polish were the most self-bashing nationality, but seeing you people go on, I see we stand no chance :-).

Still, not having to see Britain with all its political problems in perspective, I think you people have good attitude, culture, and all the British I've met around in my life were simply great people.
Why hate the UK?

Because if you would have lived there long time, as opposed to "meet nice people and be happy" you would see that there's situations not acceptable in a modern society.

Such as letting free criminals who do it again and again; Suing people who defended themselves while being robbed by armed men, paying lot of benefits to people who won't make any efforts toward the society, etc...


So I initially said to be rude when necessary, i'm tempted to be rude toward your nice utopic version and your "everyone is nice" comments...

And in the spirit of being open minded, i'd love you to meet those nice British and confirm if they are nice people:*

http://www.penguinsix.com/images/chav.jpg.

*although they might really be nice people, they just behave like assholes.

bigblue2 08.08.2011 09:50

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CorsebouTheReturn (Post 1292241)

*although they might really be nice people, they just behave like assholes.


no, they really are arseholes

CorsebouTheReturn 08.08.2011 09:50

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by cannut (Post 1292102)
Hoppy! do you have relatives in Germany ,a uncle named Adolph ? :rolleyes:

So great list of possible positive changes by the other poster.
Your comment is intriguing:

Beside the Nazi's system reference- Do you think it's wrong to implement in UK some cultural or society...aspects from other countries?

For example seeing from the states that ghettos are bad for everyone; UK could avoid doing them-


I don't think it will change the "soul" of the UK if those changes are made.

glinaa 08.08.2011 09:52

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CorsebouTheReturn (Post 1292241)
Such as letting free criminals who do it again and again; Suing people who defended themselves while being robbed by armed men, paying lot of benefits to people who won't make any efforts toward the society, etc...


So I initially said to be rude when necessary, i'm tempted to be rude toward your nice utopic version and your "everyone is nice" comments...

And in the spirit of being open minded, i'd love you to meet those nice British and confirm if they are nice people:*

*although they might really be nice people, they just behave like assholes.

Believe it or not, Poland (and most likely lots of other countries) have word by word EXACTLY the same problems.

poor law enforcement? check
overcrowded prisons? check
judical system failing? check
hooligans? oooh yeah, check

But seeing a nationality, as a sum of its countrys' political and organizational problems is a miss. You'll struggle to find a country which has none of them. In fact, most are actually common to all.

CorsebouTheReturn 08.08.2011 09:54

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bigblue2 (Post 1292245)
no, they really are arseholes

Yes i'm definitely not defending them- Especially the one who have been actually done crimes- I'm also against the stupid one who keep the look to be "group idiot follower".

But I don't want to judge them only from their crappy look- Or I don't want to target negative comments only towards them.

I'd also like to shoot their parents, or the one responsible for them.
And maybe the idiots from the education system who doe not make appropriate measures to adapt to that situation: after all "nedism" is spreading or has spread; maybe some education can be made early to make that not happen.

CorsebouTheReturn 08.08.2011 09:59

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by glinaa (Post 1292252)
Believe it or not, Poland (and most likely lots of other countries) have word by word EXACTLY the same problems.

poor law enforcement? check
overcrowded prisons? check
judical system failing? check
hooligans? oooh yeah, check

But seeing a nationality, as a sum of its countrys' political and organizational problems is a miss. You'll struggle to find a country which has none of them. In fact, most are actually common to all.

But no one hate the nationality. People hate the "UK" as "living there" for the negative things we have listed. And this topic is about suggesting solutions to those problem (because UK's government is too busy pocketing expenses money so they don't have time to look for solutions).

You are right all countries have problems, so let's do nothing about them.

Let's keep the law (a set of rules being written by human beings for regulating a specific context), let's tolerate that people who have been hitting a robber can go to jail, etc....

I'll start to love everything and everyone from now on.


Ha I had my bike stolen, I love the guy! Thank you, i will be able to use public transport from now on. Thaaaaanks! And if I was in another country, maybe they'll have rob me some organs. So it's good to live here!
Love forever!


:hippy:

bigblue2 08.08.2011 10:02

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CorsebouTheReturn (Post 1292254)
Yes i'm definitely not defending them- Especially the one who have been actually done crimes- I'm also against the stupid one who keep the look to be "group idiot follower".

But I don't want to judge them only from their crappy look- Or I don't want to target negative comments only towards them.

I'd also like to shoot their parents, or the one responsible for them.
And maybe the idiots from the education system who doe not make appropriate measures to adapt to that situation: after all "nedism" is spreading or has spread; maybe some education can be made early to make that not happen.


you can't really blame the schools etc, there hands are just as much tied as the polices (this makes me sound and feel old :( ) in my day if you misbehaved in school then the teachers would give you a swift backhander, do it again and your in detention, again and your out, expelled. now all the kids "know there rights" teachers can't do anything, letter home to the parents and they couldn't give a toss, schools have to concentrate on exam results and league tables to prove they are good or bad, its bollocks.

I remember one geography lesson, with the strictest teacher in the school, one annoying kid shouted out a crap joke, the teacher went ape, dragged him over the table, outside and gave him a bit of a beating, what happend? nothing, the kid was too scared to tell his parents, as he'd have probably got another beating from them, and our class never messed around again, the kid in question went on to win a place in grammer school and did very well for himself.

glinaa 08.08.2011 10:02

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CorsebouTheReturn (Post 1292261)
Ha I had my bike stolen, I love the guy! Thank you, i will be able to use public transport from now on. Thaaaaanks! And if I was in another country, maybe they'll have rob me some organs. So it's good to live here!
Love forever!
:hippy:

Hate breeds hate -you know that, don't you? ;-)

CorsebouTheReturn 08.08.2011 10:12

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by glinaa (Post 1292270)
Hate breeds hate -you know that, don't you? ;-)

That's why I made a topic called "What to do so people stop hating the UK?"

Bring realistic possible solutions/suggestions...

As opposed to say "yeah it's worse somewhere else, British are nice, etc..."
There's 61,838,154 people in the UK (officially because they must be more due to the counting techniques).

Are they all nice?

Problem is utopia people like your kind, who keep spreading "positive" toward anything.

There's some criminals- It's ok, I met them they are nice
There's horrible laws- It's ok it's worse in Singapore
There's crime in Manchester- it's ok it's worse in Nigeria
There's some stabbing issue in London- it's ok they use guns in Nigeria


:hippy:...:piss:

mirfield 08.08.2011 10:32

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by bigblue2 (Post 1292268)
you can't really blame the schools etc, there hands are just as much tied as the polices

As Frankie Boyle says;

What's it coming to when a teacher can't hold a pupil down and hit him with a dumbell, shouting "Die, die, die!".

It's political correctness gone mad.

Guest 08.08.2011 10:38

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Perhaps the United Kingdom needs some marketing consultants to come up with some rebranding?

http://www.housetohome.co.uk/image/5...door-mat-3.jpg

VISIT COOLIA!
WE DID GIV U DA BEACKLES, DA SEXY PISTOLS AND DA WOMBLES! WE IS DA COOOOOLIST COUNTRY IN DA WORLD! COME HANG WIV US INNIT!

AN JUS IN CASE U WORRID, WE DON AV NO CHAVS. ONIST.

greenmount 08.08.2011 11:09

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CorsebouTheReturn (Post 1292281)
That's why I made a topic called "What to do so people stop hating the UK?"

Bring realistic possible solutions/suggestions...

As opposed to say "yeah it's worse somewhere else, British are nice, etc..."
There's 61,838,154 people in the UK (officially because they must be more due to the counting techniques).

Are they all nice?

Problem is utopia people like your kind, who keep spreading "positive" toward anything.

There's some criminals- It's ok, I met them they are nice
There's horrible laws- It's ok it's worse in Singapore
There's crime in Manchester- it's ok it's worse in Nigeria
There's some stabbing issue in London- it's ok they use guns in Nigeria


:hippy:...:piss:

You seem the type who would enjoy a long stay in Saudi Arabia, I guess you'd find there an orderly society..:D

So, yeah, go there. And report us about your happy staying.:rolleyes:

CorsebouTheReturn 08.08.2011 11:14

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by greenmount (Post 1292406)
You seem the type who would enjoy a long stay in Saudi Arabia, I guess you'd find there an orderly society..:D

So, yeah, go there. And report us about your happy staying.:rolleyes:

I've been there, along with many other places (Singapore, etc...).
I'm not talking about an orderly society.

And if you would read carefully, you would have noticed i'm talking about changing some stupid laws (which is questioning the authorities, the rules, which is far from being allowed in the countries we quoted).

And I'm just helping with "suggestion" or collecting the "UK hater's" suggestions.

Is that any wrong?

greenmount 08.08.2011 11:51

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CorsebouTheReturn (Post 1292427)
And I'm just helping with "suggestion" or collecting the "UK hater's" suggestions.

Is that any wrong?

No, that is no wrong..

Suggestions
Skip the word "great" in the country's denomination :p
Use the social welfare more carefully, as there are people who abuse this.
Encourage people to not think they're failures if they don't work in an office.
Encourage youth to make sports, as opposed to hanging out with the boys.
Stop chasing the Middleton sisters and presenting them as a model to follow for the girls..
Cut the subsidies for useless NGO's.
Increase the taxation for the rich and use it to develop community facilities - youth and senior clubs etc.

and hey, if you'd excuse me, I have to finish my coffee now.:):p:msnblush:

CorsebouTheReturn 08.08.2011 12:18

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by greenmount (Post 1292488)
No, that is no wrong..

Suggestions
Skip the word "great" in the country's denomination :p
Use the social welfare more carefully, as there are people who abuse this.
Encourage people to not think they're failures if they don't work in an office.
Encourage youth to make sports, as opposed to hanging out with the boys.
Stop chasing the Middleton sisters and presenting them as a model to follow for the girls..
Cut the subsidies for useless NGO's.
Increase the taxation for the rich and use it to develop community facilities - youth and senior clubs etc.

and hey, if you'd excuse me, I have to finish my coffee now.:):p:msnblush:

That's great! Thanks for the suggestions.
They look very reasonable and adapted to social issues in the UK.
I'd also add about the "failures if they don't work in an office." something about the crappy reality shows: show the kids that being a "star" (or a crappy public person" is not proof of success. Well it seems to be because they are loaded and everything but I believe in more worthy values like being scientist, doctor, office worker, carpenter, etc... Those are more important than being a stupid prick behind a camera.


I was actually thinking of a "social experiment" based on your comment:
"Encourage.." How do you encourage someone on a society scale?
Punishment/repression?
Education? (but then it takes ages, and it's too late for generations)
Reward? (as you said our reward values are really limited to being in an office...or being loaded).
etc...

A possible "experiment" (probably looks "funny"): based on the video games:
a system of levels/ experience.

We have public money, we more or less agree it's often spend like stupid. In any case it's 1 way process: out of your pocket -> gone (spend like crappy).

That "system" could engage citizens to feel more responsible, engage, and feel reward to it:

Define a list of worthy social actions and create social activities. Provide a number of experience for each of them. Check completion by a special officer (or judge). Every lot of experience gain a "social level". Possible reward: Citizen level 5 for example would get a very little rebate on their tax. For example
You are +5 you pay 1% less on your tax as opposed to a level 0... Because in any case you've prove worthy to the society, they dont need to invest so much public money for than than for the ned who pollutes, etc...


Example of activities:
- teaching anything you know (carpenter, office, cooking, whatever) to migrants or anyone= integration, feeling of worthyness, etc...
- attending teachings (1 hour a week or something not heavy)
- Cleaning the trains sessions (easy way to get experience; showing cleaning is not reserved to lower class, etc...)
- Recycling collections (help cleaning, easy way, etc...).
-Working!! YES by default you work, you pay taxes. it's good enough for the society



So I don't think it would be too much "government regulation" (as saoudians countries) but more citizenship involvment and a real reward system to make citizen happy.

PS: it's just an IDEA and I don't think it has ever been applied in any countries. Maybe that's a possible "new society model"?

I would think it would help migrants, locals etc...

greenmount 08.08.2011 14:08

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Well, you said it yourself, encourage like in educate and reward (through taxation? better wages for workers, public attention as in "employee of the month"), it seems it will take ages, but Rome wasn't built in a day, as they say...Would be actually quite an idea to involve celebs in A day of cleaning type of activities, ha ha, can you imagine Peppa M. helping with the cleaning of a train?:msnsarcastic: So yeah, citizenship involment is the key, but we all know that everything is easier said than done, we're all reluctant to get out of our own safety net..;)

Guest 08.08.2011 14:11

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Brilliant: A Rumanian and a Frenchman discussing how to put the United Kingdom right.

I love the EF! :D

CorsebouTheReturn 08.08.2011 14:18

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Brilliant: A Rumanian and a Frenchman discussing how to put the United Kingdom right.

I love the EF! :D
Right, only that I mentionned it should not impact UK "traditional Culture" (unless chavism or nedism is part of UK culture and should be left untouched? :D)

I only based the discussions on what we defined as reasons to "hate the UK"- comments posted by English.

Also some people have lived in the UK long enough to be able to comment on the British society :D

Unless we were "welcomed" just to be politically correct and that we never had a chance to be "equals" as other "native british citizen"?

I though UK was all about migration and integration :rolleyes:

Anyway, what do you think about the suggestions, besides our "origins"?
Do you think it would ruin UK culture? (it might, just collecting thoughts)
Do you think it would bring solutions to most reported problems?

Guest 08.08.2011 14:20

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CorsebouTheReturn (Post 1292768)
Anyway, what do you think about the suggestions, besides our "origins"?

I live in Switzerland. ;)

CorsebouTheReturn 08.08.2011 14:22

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by greenmount (Post 1292740)
Well, you said it yourself, encourage like in educate and reward (through taxation? better wages for workers, public attention as in "employee of the month"), it seems it will take ages, but Rome wasn't built in a day, as they say...Would be actually quite an idea to involve celebs in A day of cleaning type of activities, ha ha, can you imagine Peppa M. helping with the cleaning of a train?:msnsarcastic: So yeah, citizenship involment is the key, but we all know that everything is easier said than done, we're all reluctant to get out of our own safety net..;)

So to "get out of our safety net" how about a system that rewards your current society efforts (working, recycling, etc...) and encourage any citizen to do more in exchange of a "level" to recognize your efforts, value them in the society, and financial outcome (reducing your tax percent contribution)?

That seems fair: it lives freedom to those who don't want to contribute actively (still they will be rewarded by working); it will bring real advantages for those doing a bit more (less taxes) and remove the current issues (dirts, recycling, etc...).

It does not remove some of our system (like fines for polluters, etc...).

simon_ch 08.08.2011 14:49

Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?
 
Ok, here are my suggestions, strictly from an outsider's perspective.

Unemployment/Immigration:
- To combat unemployment you need to a) have jobs that pay more than benefits and b) regulate immigration so that there's always an artificial shortage in jobseekers. Therefore the UK should introduce minimum benefits that are not comfortable to live on, anything extra only through community work, proven time spent with applications, training etc. And force the industry to swallow the bitter pill; reintegrate unwilling locals into the workforce instead of hiring motivated foreigners. In order to properly regulate immigration, the UK would need to leave Schengen, define the average (not median) salary in each industry as the minimum salary a foreigner can be employed for (based on taxes paid, gov stats), thus ensuring that only the most required and proficient workers/expats come. A bit more controversial but also necessary, deport all illegal immigrants, no benefits for foreigners (but also no payments into the social systems), family cannot automatically move. Further ease employment laws to make the labour market more dynamic and liberal.

All this won't work without a competitive economy of course, therefore:
-Leave the EU and refuse any transfer payments
-FTAs with major trading partners
-Adopt EU norms and product declarations as well as metrics to integrate well into the European economies and avoid bureaucracy.
-Stop subsidies to weak regions, but allow federalised taxation
-Encourage FDI and provide assistance for new businesses
-Trim NHS to its essentials instead of abandoning the system
-Cut red tape and regulations in all areas
-Stop overreliance and tax cuts for banking sector, encourage knowledge and technology intensive industries to settle (there's a reason Google HQ is not in the UK, and that reason is not just taxes)
-Counter heavy cuts in non-productive areas (defense, health-care, social security, public employees) with more spending in productive areas (education, infrastructure)

The overarching idea is that a country cannot be succesful in the long term without being competitive on the global level. High salaries and a large middle class are only possible with global economic champions, regulated immigration, great education on all levels and a strong incentive to be a productive member of society.

All short-term efforts to kick-start the economy, soften the pain, bail-out the failed or failing will only prolong the misery.

And last but not least: Get rid of your monarchy and introduce a foreign (read: Swiss) dictator. Me? Oh well.. since you're asking..


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