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  #101  
Old 09.08.2011, 12:44
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Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?

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Alas, no, sorry but I believe that the community is responsible for education.
Schools for academic, run at a community level.
Local leaders for civic/social education, once again at a community level.
Cultural groups for culture, at whatever level they are able to support.

I hesitate to allow central government or any higher authority control over anything. The Rütlischwur (or at least one of the most popular versions, from a play) sums it up very nicely for me, especially the last line.
"We shall be a single People of brethren,
Never to part in danger nor distress.
We shall be free, just as our fathers were,
And rather die than live in slavery.
We shall trust in the one highest God
And never be afraid of human power."

I also cannot trust government and although I may disagree with the use of the word "God" here, I would rather use a more perviasive non-religeous view of "everything", I still agree with the principle.

People need to take personal accountability for all of these things.
I would start by defining that:
Alas, no, sorry but I believe that the community is responsible for education
Because communities as it's currently applied it's a society divider, not anything for a...united kingdom!
Plus in current context it would means different educations... communities of Indians would have X education, communities of Easter Europe would have Y educations, etc... all conflicting more or less.

As one said we're talking about the United Kingdom, it's suppose to be fair, equal, etc... for every british citizen, no matter which "community" they come from.

In that respect I would ask you to clarify your comment on "community".

Plus those "divisions" are quite silly if you think of it.
It could be a "community of teachers" all over the UK, defining a program for the whole country, and applying it locally to every schools or education centers.


How to make that happen: "People need to take personal accountability for all of these things"?

I suggested random ideas such as the incentive reward program, which would lead to less expenses by the councils, and more visible effects + tax rebate.

Could that be a way to make people be more personal?

It would leave total freedom to any citizen: you don't want to do any of the suggested crap, it's ok. You just will stay with the normal tax rate, etc... You would still see the positive changes as other citizen would clean, etc...

You want to improve your environment? contribute little, get tax rebate, see the changes and have "better status" (because you'll be higher level citizens: your efforts won't be useless and you will feed less the passives because you would pay less taxes).
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  #102  
Old 09.08.2011, 12:54
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Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?

I think some of the run-down areas of the UK (such as Tottenham, Hackney, Croydon, Birmingham city centre etc.) should be burnt down and rebuilt.

As the UK is short of cash, they should offer surplus electrical goods to the unemployed to help.
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  #103  
Old 09.08.2011, 14:04
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Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?

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In that respect I would ask you to clarify your comment on "community".
A community is:
  1. Group of people sharing a common understanding.
  2. The condition of having certain attitudes and interests in common.
I have chosen my view from the definitions and would like to make the following point based on that. A community is what that community decides it should be.

A study of anthropology and psychology will quickly reveal that mature and healthy communities are inclusive and not exclusive. So by being part of a mature community, that in no way stops me being part of another or, infact, as many communities as I wish. Each is simply a group with common understanding. Within communities we often see "enterprises" arrising, i.e. one or more individuals with a common set of goals. These enterprises within the community will generally support the common understanding, attitude and interest of that specific community, and in healthy communities, not confilict with adjacent or parallel communities.

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Plus those "divisions" are quite silly if you think of it.
Yes, if they were divisions, yes, they would be silly but as pointed out above, mature and healthy communities create partnerships, collaboration and inclusivity. Immature and sick communities create segregations, divisions, have "black sheep" that always get the blame, use a lot of finger pointing and generally cannot integrate because they feel too insecure.

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It could be a "community of teachers" all over the UK, defining a program for the whole country, and applying it locally to every schools or education centers.
Yes, it could just as easily be allowing the Hindus or Buhdists to have thier own education system as well to support thier culture and ways of life as long as those do not violate the common sense views of what people need to know to be good members of the larger community and/or violate anybody's human rights.

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How to make that happen: "People need to take personal accountability for all of these things"?
I love where you are going with this whole thing and without re-inventing the wheel (as this and many ways to get people to take accountability have been very well written about before, take Skinner and Clease's "Life and How to survive it" as an example) I would suggest that getting rid of the nanny state, helping people stand on thier own two feet and making them feel as if they personally can make a difference, is the best way.

What are the steps..... Very hard but could be actioned quite quickly:
  1. Stop handouts. Completely, no exceptions.
  2. Fully support local business (all sectors) and community run business and possibly give them massive tax incentives.
  3. Provide people with resources to help establish self sufficient communities, local farming, local manufacutring, crafts, apprenticships.
  4. Help communities support thier own people that need help instead of fostering a wealfare state that has no understanding of local needs.
  5. Bring back some of the old skills. Stone masons, carpenters, etc. There is immense value, both in quality and in pride in artisanship.
  6. If you want to legislate about anything, outlaw planned and percieved obsolescence in manufacuting.

I like a lot of your ideas but I don't think they are drastic enough to drive the change that is nessessary.
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  #104  
Old 09.08.2011, 14:24
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Re: What to do so people stop hating the UK?

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Have you seen the kind of people who populate the United Kingdom these days?
You just watch yer lip, mate.
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