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View Poll Results: Why are these riots happening (vote for the closest to your beliefs)
The Duggan shooting is the primary cause of the riots 4 4.12%
The riots are caused because of social injustice 9 9.28%
The riots are caused because of too much "justice"/benefits etc 5 5.15%
The riots are spontaneous/opportunistic, just criminals seeing an opportunity. 75 77.32%
The riots are caused by too much immigration 4 4.12%
Voters: 97. You may not vote on this poll

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  #681  
Old 11.08.2011, 13:59
hoppy
 
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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So, like.... Mr Hoppy is more than welcome to join the EF.
He blames most of it on the loss of manufacturing jobs, and is concerned about the loss of manufacturing in the US.

Philip Levne- the new US poet laureate.

An Abandoned Factory, Detroit

The gates are chained, the barbed-wire fencing stands,
An iron authority against the snow,
And this grey monument to common sense
Resists the weather. Fears of idle hands,
Of protest, men in league, and of the slow
Corrosion of their minds, still charge this fence.

Beyond, through broken windows one can see
Where the great presses paused between their strokes
And thus remain, in air suspended, caught
In the sure margin of eternity.
The cast-iron wheels have stopped; one counts the spokes
Which movement blurred, the struts inertia fought,

And estimates the loss of human power,
Experienced and slow, the loss of years,
The gradual decay of dignity.
Men lived within these foundries, hour by hour;
Nothing they forged outlived the rusted gears
Which might have served to grind their eulogy.

http://www.poemhunter.com/poem/an-ab...ctory-detroit/
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  #682  
Old 11.08.2011, 14:13
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

Here is what Altstetten's poet-in-residence makes of it...

There once was a poster named hoppy,
whose logic was quite often sloppy,
she thought it was fine,
to loot all the time,
'cos the government had made gangsters stroppy

Last edited by StirB; 11.08.2011 at 14:56. Reason: Edited for gender
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  #683  
Old 11.08.2011, 14:25
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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He blames most of it on the loss of manufacturing jobs, and is concerned about the loss of manufacturing in the US.

Philip Levne- the new US poet laureate.

An Abandoned Factory, Detroit

The gates are chained, the barbed-wire fencing stands,
An iron authority against the snow,
And this grey monument to common sense
Resists the weather. Fears of idle hands,
Of protest, men in league, and of the slow
Corrosion of their minds, still charge this fence.

Beyond, through broken windows one can see
Where the great presses paused between their strokes
And thus remain, in air suspended, caught
In the sure margin of eternity.
The cast-iron wheels have stopped; one counts the spokes
Which movement blurred, the struts inertia fought,

And estimates the loss of human power,
Experienced and slow, the loss of years,
The gradual decay of dignity.
Men lived within these foundries, hour by hour;
Nothing they forged outlived the rusted gears
Which might have served to grind their eulogy.

http://www.poemhunter.com/poem/an-ab...ctory-detroit/
Thats a rubbish poem, it doesnt even rhyme !
  #684  
Old 11.08.2011, 14:33
hoppy
 
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

11 August 2011 Last updated at 06:45 ET


The competing arguments used to explain the riot

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-14483149
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  #685  
Old 11.08.2011, 14:39
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

Quote:
Here is what Altstetten's poet-in-residence makes of it...

There once was a poster named hoppy,
whose logic was quite often sloppy,
he thought it was fine,
to loot all the time,
'cos the government had made gangsters stroppy
So much hidden talent (extremely well hidden). However, I think you will find that he is a she
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  #686  
Old 11.08.2011, 14:41
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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So much hidden talent (extremely well hidden). However, I think you will find that he is a she

given hoppy's recent history, I'm sure he/she would even argue that all day long
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  #687  
Old 11.08.2011, 14:45
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

Seriously the only way to survive these forums is to read sarcasm into every word.
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  #688  
Old 11.08.2011, 14:47
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

Quote:
Here is what Altstetten's poet-in-residence makes of it...

There once was a poster named hoppy,
whose logic was quite often sloppy,
he thought it was fine,
to loot all the time,
'cos the government had made gangsters stroppy
But if you stop to think about it, it is highly unlikely that all of the people in the streets are were gangsters. I mean that train of thought implies an amazing amount unpleasantness in a certain demographic.

Do you actually think there are that many worthless human beings out there?
  #689  
Old 11.08.2011, 14:48
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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Seriously the only way to survive these forums is to read sarcasm into every word.
Are you being sarcastic?
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  #690  
Old 11.08.2011, 14:52
porsch1909
 
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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Seriously the only way to survive these forums is to read sarcasm into every word.
I'm not sure I appreciate that tone
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  #691  
Old 11.08.2011, 14:58
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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But if you stop to think about it, it is highly unlikely that all of the people in the streets are were gangsters. I mean that train of thought implies an amazing amount unpleasantness in a certain demographic.

Do you actually think there are that many worthless human beings out there?
I certainly do, there seems to be plenty of video evidence.

I went with gangsters, as a lot of the people consider themselves 'G's. No, I don't think they are really gangsters, just oxygen-thieves.
  #692  
Old 11.08.2011, 14:59
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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11 August 2011 Last updated at 06:45 ET


The competing arguments used to explain the riot

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-14483149
That is very interesting.

I would only argue with the rap music, I actually do not think it sends to do evil. Their parents listened to crazy hippie druggy stuff, and didn't do such extreme evil. I feel those words are often chants that might start certain train of thoughts, if other things (see the other arguments) are in place...

On the other hand...we go all crazy over extreme vandalism. Not much bloodshed. And in the meantime, millions of people starve to death. We are only allert when somebody breaks our window and are willing to finally get our heads of our butts just because it hits home, coz the bus to work is late now coz of rioters or we are afraid of our own kids being hit by cobble stones at the moment. There are gazillions of current victims of official looting due to tragic events, like everyday Somalia, and other places, and it does not make so many people worried. Social injustice, vandalized economies and broken homes, be if fixed in our homelands, will still cause riots, just because it is not fixed on the other side of the world. If it's just cash that matters and everyone buys from cheap producers million miles away, we will save cash but will have unemployed drinkers and dads who leave families. I think we are finally facing the most depressing bit of globalization, not so easily fixable.
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  #693  
Old 11.08.2011, 15:08
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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I think we are finally facing the most depressing bit of globalization, not so easily fixable.
I was with you all the way until that.... Care to expand?
  #694  
Old 11.08.2011, 15:13
hoppy
 
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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That is very interesting.

I would only argue with the rap music, I actually do not think it sends to do evil. Their parents listened to crazy hippie druggy stuff, and didn't do such extreme evil. I feel those words are often chants that might start certain train of thoughts, if other things (see the other arguments) are in place...

On the other hand...we go all crazy over extreme vandalism. Not much bloodshed. And in the meantime, millions of people starve to death. We are only allert when somebody breaks our window and are willing to finally get our heads of our butts just because it hits home, coz the bus to work is late now coz of rioters or we are afraid of our own kids being hit by cobble stones at the moment. There are gazillions of current victims of official looting due to tragic events, like everyday Somalia, and other places, and it does not make so many people worried. Social injustice, vandalized economies and broken homes, be if fixed in our homelands, will still cause riots, just because it is not fixed on the other side of the world. If it's just cash that matters and everyone buys from cheap producers million miles away, we will save cash but will have unemployed drinkers and dads who leave families. I think we are finally facing the most depressing bit of globalization, not so easily fixable.
I blame Walmart and China- but I still shop there and buy Chinese goods. there is some sense behind buy Swiss.
  #695  
Old 11.08.2011, 15:15
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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I blame Walmart and China- but I still shop there and buy Chinese goods. there is some sense behind buy Swiss.
I'd agree with you, but...not if Swiss rip each other off. Then I buy French
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  #696  
Old 11.08.2011, 15:29
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

Libyan state television said today Cameron was using "Irish and Scottish mercenaries" to tame riots in England.

Thank the Lord he is not using the Welsh
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  #697  
Old 11.08.2011, 15:42
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I was with you all the way until that.... Care to expand?
If people outsource elsewhere, it only helps now, not in the future. If everything gets outsourced elsewhere to maximize profit, we might save cash shortspan, but not invest in our communities. It is more expensive to solve deep problems now, instead handing things out, but training kids, schooling them, etc. saves the community and cash in the long span. How to make kids want to learn and train? Not give them any means of survival for free, they will have to. They will have to start investing in themselves.

Looting kids are maximizing profit.They could care less we disapprove since they have their audience they look to and try to please. We are not definitely this street cred they do it for. Sometimes formal authority is a good thing. And state does have formal authority, it's ok to not be pc and use it sometimes, like, deprive kids in order to jump start their survival skills that will save them in the long span.
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  #698  
Old 11.08.2011, 16:13
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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But if you stop to think about it, it is highly unlikely that all of the people in the streets are were gangsters. I mean that train of thought implies an amazing amount unpleasantness in a certain demographic.

Do you actually think there are that many worthless human beings out there?
I used to live in London and "yes".
  #699  
Old 11.08.2011, 16:14
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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Libyan state television said today Cameron was using "Irish and Scottish mercenaries" to tame riots in England.

Thank the Lord he is not using the Welsh
They would sing the rioters to death.
  #700  
Old 11.08.2011, 16:23
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Re: The Tottenham Riots....

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If people outsource elsewhere, it only helps now, not in the future.
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Globalization refers to the increasing unification of the world's economic order through reduction of such barriers to international trade as tariffs, export fees, and import quotas. The goal is to increase material wealth, goods, and services through an international division of labor by efficiencies catalyzed by international relations, specialization and competition. It describes the process by which regional economies, societies, and cultures have become integrated through communication, transportation, and trade.
Globalization is not just about oursourcing, or indeed insourcing, or nearsourcing. It is about removing the barriers for those things to happen.

It is very important for us to remember that this is just a tool. Globalization, just like Democracy or Capitalism or Communism is just a political or economical tool. These tools themselves cannot be accountable for good or bad and by themselves have no impact.

It is only through the ethical or non-ethical implementation of these tools that we can judge the people that used the tools.

Clearly globalisation has been used for much wrong. But clearly it has been used for much good. There would be no International Space Station, CERN, Live Aid, potential cure for AIDS and many other wonderous things in this world if it were not for globalisation being used for good.

I feel that people will far too quickly blame a tool than the person that implemented something of great evil with that tool.

Yes, we should buy local to show that we can be independent but when we can't source locally we should have the ability to source somewhere else. Imagine there being a cancer drug in the US that would save your life but they would not sell it in Switzerland becuase there was no globalization. We would not be having this conversation right now if it were not for globalization.
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