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  #2701  
Old 05.10.2017, 11:27
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Do they do a "Glarnerland" edition, I wonder?

EDIT: Ha!
it says women aren't allowed to play this version
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  #2702  
Old 05.10.2017, 11:33
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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it says women aren't allowed to play this version
In that version you have to pay CHF 200 when passing go. And there's no free parking.
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  #2703  
Old 05.10.2017, 11:33
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Why was slave ownership abolished?
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Another ban that hasn't worked. What's your point?
Oh, so you're suggesting that the ban on the colonial slavery trade and later on slave ownership in the US was not a good thing? Do you think that, even globally (as you veer off in that direction despite its irrelevance to the US-focussed discussion) there would be more or fewer people living in slavery if it were still legal?

Regardless, no-one's suggesting that a US ban on any sort of weapon ownership would reduce gun crime in Russia or stop wars in Asia and Africa, so your argument falls apart anyway.
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  #2704  
Old 05.10.2017, 11:38
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Shall I cut the legs off the coffee table I inherited off my grandmother? Maybe melt down my grandad's medals and turn them into Monopoly pieces?

You really don't have a clue what you're talking about, do you?


Obviously, youre very emotional about this, so i'll let the straw man argument (and the accompanying hysteria) you seem to be indulging slide.


Considering that coffee tables and medals arent instruments of death, im confident that you dont need to cut the legs off or melt them down.
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  #2705  
Old 05.10.2017, 11:42
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Obviously, youre very emotional about this, so i'll let the straw man argument (and the accompanying hysteria) you seem to be indulging slide.


Considering that coffee tables and medals arent instruments of death, im confident that you dont need to cut the legs off or melt them down.
Emotional? I've never owned a gun. I'm just trying to demonstrate how little traction your "logical" arguments will have on actual, breathing, human gun owners.

Have you ever tried putting yourself into someone else's shoes?
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  #2706  
Old 05.10.2017, 11:43
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Emotional? I've never owned a gun. I'm just trying to demonstrate how little traction your "logical" arguments will have on actual, breathing, human gun owners.

Have you ever tried putting yourself into someone else's shoes?


I did, but they werent as comfortable as my bourgeoisie suede loafers.
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  #2707  
Old 05.10.2017, 11:47
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

I should perhaps point out that deactivating a gun only involves machining certain parts of it so that it cannot fire. Its doesnt actually involve destroying the gun or surrendering it. From appearence, nothing changes. As far as sentimental value goes, nothing changes.


If its really an heirloom, and not going to be used for firing, i dont see the problem with making it safer.


Of course if the whole heirloom angle is just a deflection from the fact that people have a phallic fetish for guns, then its a different matter entirely.
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  #2708  
Old 05.10.2017, 12:10
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I should perhaps point out that deactivating a gun only involves machining certain parts of it so that it cannot fire. Its doesnt actually involve destroying the gun or surrendering it. From appearence, nothing changes. As far as sentimental value goes, nothing changes.


If its really an heirloom, and not going to be used for firing, i dont see the problem with making it safer.


Of course if the whole heirloom angle is just a deflection from the fact that people have a phallic fetish for guns, then its a different matter entirely.
Pah! What good is a gun you can't take out back and fire at tin cans now and then?

We have a British car meet in Glarus every year. The proud owners bring their shiny, leaky vehicles to show off in a field - but more importantly, to take for several spins round the canton, preferably wearing a flat cap and goggles. Reduce that to a few hundred cars sitting in a field, going nowhere, and you'd ruin it.

A gun is a wonderfully engineered bit of kit. Take away its ability to fire and you ruin it.

Good luck selling that idea to the gun collectors of America!
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  #2709  
Old 05.10.2017, 12:12
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

a 18th century musket as an heirloom is slightly different to an AK47
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  #2710  
Old 05.10.2017, 12:12
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Oh, so you're suggesting that the ban on the colonial slavery trade and later on slave ownership in the US was not a good thing? Do you think that, even globally (as you veer off in that direction despite its irrelevance to the US-focussed discussion) there would be more or fewer people living in slavery if it were still legal?

Regardless, no-one's suggesting that a US ban on any sort of weapon ownership would reduce gun crime in Russia or stop wars in Asia and Africa, so your argument falls apart anyway.
How about you put this in the full context of what was said? Here, let me help.


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Did any of your ancestors own slaves? I bet they were irked by the loss of their heritage and property.
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As far as crap analogies go, that’s about as good as it gets.
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Says the man desperately clutching for non-comparable statistics and anecdotes to defend his support for firearm ownership, in the face of overwhelming evidence that thousands of people die every year as a result.
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I've come up with numerous examples to support my argument that bans per se don't work. You've just gone and compared giving up slaves to giving up guns.
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Why was slave ownership abolished?
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Another ban that hasn't worked. What's your point?
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its obvious to those with even the meanest intelligence, that 22yards was referring to the slavery ban in the US, considering he was replying to a post about owning guns in the US, and the fact that this discussion is about a shooting in the US, and that the current topic is stricter gun laws in the US.


Sorry to have blown your straw man over.
See above. You really don't get this straw man thing, do you?
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  #2711  
Old 05.10.2017, 12:16
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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a 18th century musket as an heirloom is slightly different to an AK47
You'd need more cans to have any decent fun with the latter.
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  #2712  
Old 05.10.2017, 12:26
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Of course if the whole heirloom angle is just a deflection from the fact that people have a phallic fetish for guns, then its a different matter entirely.
What about people who have a phallic power trip about wanting to decide what other people may or may not own?

Same but different?

Pettle Kot Black?
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  #2713  
Old 05.10.2017, 12:27
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Oh, so you're suggesting that the ban on the colonial slavery trade and later on slave ownership in the US was not a good thing? Do you think that, even globally (as you veer off in that direction despite its irrelevance to the US-focussed discussion) there would be more or fewer people living in slavery if it were still legal?

Regardless, no-one's suggesting that a US ban on any sort of weapon ownership would reduce gun crime in Russia or stop wars in Asia and Africa, so your argument falls apart anyway.
I'm not suggesting anything. What I am saying is that a ban on slaves is not comparable to a ban on guns. Nor are the reasons for banning slavery comparable with the reasons for banning guns.

I have used examples to show that around the world that gun controls don't necessarily result in less gun crime. And also that bans of other forms don't work. You can say this is US-focused as much as you want, but I've yet to see a single example from anyone that shows a gun ban would work there.
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  #2714  
Old 05.10.2017, 12:56
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Pah! What good is a gun you can't take out back and fire at tin cans now and then?

We have a British car meet in Glarus every year. The proud owners bring their shiny, leaky vehicles to show off in a field - but more importantly, to take for several spins round the canton, preferably wearing a flat cap and goggles. Reduce that to a few hundred cars sitting in a field, going nowhere, and you'd ruin it.

A gun is a wonderfully engineered bit of kit. Take away its ability to fire and you ruin it.

Good luck selling that idea to the gun collectors of America!
A gun is not at all a feat of engineering.


Its creating a small explosion, to force a small bit of metal through a tube pointed in a specific direction.


The concept is the same as the big black cannons that were used 300 years ago.


The technology may have become more refined since then, but a magificent feat of engineering it aint.


And once again, cars are not designed to be efficient killing machines. How many times did an old car kill 59 people?
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  #2715  
Old 05.10.2017, 12:57
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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What about people who have a phallic power trip about wanting to decide what other people may or may not own?

Same but different?

Pettle Kot Black?

...you mean the government?


yeah, they are on a massive phallic power trip. Perhaps those crazy left-wing anarchists had a point after all.
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  #2716  
Old 05.10.2017, 13:01
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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You can say this is US-focused as much as you want, but I've yet to see a single example from anyone that shows a gun ban would work there.
Just answer this one question:

If access to guns in the US were severely curtailed, due to a ban on the sale, purchase and possession of guns, how would guns be used to kill people?

That's all. No strawman arguments. No waffling. Just answer my question logically.

(And yes, it would take considerable time for the effects of a ban to trickle through to the firing line, so to speak. That's why no politician would put his neck on the block to vote in a ban, because he wouldn't reap any glory for himself: the benefits would be for future generations.)
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  #2717  
Old 05.10.2017, 13:05
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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How about you put this in the full context of what was said? Here, let me help.


See above. You really don't get this straw man thing, do you?
Christ almighty.


Considering the number of slaves in the US has dropped from several hundred thousand to a miniscule number, it is clear that the ban did work.


Now, human nature might dictate that a few people will still illegally own slaves, but compared to 388,000, the number of slaves in the US at the moment is indeed negligible.


Now, when you start bringing up maps about slavery in the rest of the world, and bleat on about how bans havent worked, you are creating a straw man.


For your assistance, a straw man argument is when you wilfully ignore the actual point being made, make your own point up (that isnt the point being argued), and then proceed to argue against that made up point.


Actual point: Slavery ban in the US reduced slavery to much better levels.
Your made up point: Slavery bans in the world reduced slavery to zero.
Your counter to the made up point - the ridiculous graphic of slavery across the whole world.


Relevancy of your counter-point to the original point: Negligible.


I cannot make it any easier to understand.
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  #2718  
Old 05.10.2017, 13:15
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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If access to guns in the US were severely curtailed, due to a ban on the sale, purchase and possession of guns...
Impossible to implement. There would be riots, standoffs, sieges. Old guns would not be melted down into monopoly pieces - rather old monopoly pieces would be melted down into bullets.
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  #2719  
Old 05.10.2017, 13:26
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

"Alarmingly spot on..."


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"How about we treat every young man who wants to buy a gun like every woman who wants to get an abortion — mandatory 48-hr waiting period, parental permission, a note from his doctor proving he understands what he's about to do, a video he has to watch about the effects of gun violence, an ultrasound wand up the ass (just because). Let's close down all but one gun shop in every state and make him travel hundreds of miles, take time off work, and stay overnight in a strange town to get a gun. Make him walk through a gauntlet of people holding photos of loved ones who were shot to death, people who call him a murderer and beg him not to buy a gun.
It makes more sense to do this with young men and guns than with women and health care, right? I mean, no woman getting an abortion has killed a room full of people in seconds, right?"
- Unknown.
The paradox is remarkable, isn't it?
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  #2720  
Old 05.10.2017, 13:35
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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"Alarmingly spot on..."




The paradox is remarkable, isn't it?
No, it isn't. In some states abortion is more accessible than others. Same with guns.

Buying a gun is not a serious medical procedure, which involves taking an unborn life by default.

I'm not 'pro-gun' or 'pro-life' personally, but the analogy is weak.
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