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  #1601  
Old 13.06.2016, 18:37
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

Isn't it that the fully automatic AR15 must not be sold to civilians?

Ah, sort of:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AR-15


I've actually got trouble with this being labeled as "an act of terrorism".
First of all, that label gets used and misused so often that it has had an almost numbing effect. On everybody. Once it's an act of terror, people generally stop asking question.
Then, the circumstances are really peculiar (as detailed above).

IMO, if it weren't for all the funding the war on terror gets, this might well be "just" a hate-crime where somebody used the opportunity to make sure it got the headlines.
And headlines it got.
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  #1602  
Old 13.06.2016, 18:48
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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"Investigation"... and I bet you were thinking "Intelligence" in an embarrassing blond moment.

You got that wrong too
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  #1603  
Old 13.06.2016, 18:50
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I just edited my previous post. Yes, semi-automatic, which as you probably know, means that it can be set to fire continuously (à la automatic) at the rate of 45 rounds per minute.
That seems to be factually incorrect. The semi rate of fire at 45 would that at your fastest trigger pull you would be able to fire 45 bullets. The sustained rate of fire on ar-15 is somewhat between 12-15 rpm.
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  #1604  
Old 13.06.2016, 18:52
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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That seems to be factually incorrect. The semi rate of fire at 45 would that at your fastest trigger pull you would be able to fire 45 bullets. The sustained rate of fire on ar-15 is somewhat between 12-15 rpm.
Lol, I just corrected that post, too. You're correct, the rifle fires as rapidly as the user can pull the trigger.
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Old 13.06.2016, 18:52
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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You got that wrong too
What did I get wrong?
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  #1606  
Old 13.06.2016, 18:58
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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What did I get wrong?

I in FBI , in this case stands for Idiots not intelligence
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  #1607  
Old 13.06.2016, 19:01
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I in FBI , in this case stands for Idiots not intelligence
Great. Whoooooooosh.
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  #1608  
Old 13.06.2016, 19:56
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

Idiot is also wrong.

It stands for Inspector

as in Female Body Inspector.

saw it on a "funny" shirt once

the more you know
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  #1609  
Old 13.06.2016, 20:52
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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My gay Muslim friends probably wouldn't agree with you. Hmmm....
Your gay muslims friends might not agree but it seems the shooters father would though.

He has expressed sadness and disbelief at what his son has done - but then added that ''it's up to god to punish homosexuals''

https://www.yahoo.com/news/god-punis...131627726.html
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  #1610  
Old 14.06.2016, 00:50
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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I just edited my previous post. Yes, semi-automatic, although it can fire at the rate of 45 rounds per minute.

Nobody can reasonably justify the use of an AR-15 (of which there are around 3.5 million in the US) for hunting, self-defence, or any other peaceful purpose. You simply don't need to to spray 45 bullets around in 60 seconds to defend yourself. AR-15s have one purpose and only one purpose: causing as much destruction as a lightweight rifle possibly can, in the shortest time possible.
45 per minute is incredibly slow unless you are taking and making a real effort at well aimed shots. It will fire as quickly as you pull the trigger so somewhere in real life of 100-120 if you can keep up that long.

As for the hunting... you said it, light weight is the key. For "home deeeeeefence" close enclosed environments it's also apparently an ideal weapon due to any combination of stock and barrel lengths.

I'm not pro or anti firearm though I am a firearms owner. I keep a neutral stance on the topic and if someone spouts shite that I know is incorrect then I will put a correction forward.
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  #1611  
Old 14.06.2016, 01:57
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Isn't it that the fully automatic AR15 must not be sold to civilians?

Ah, sort of:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/AR-15


I've actually got trouble with this being labeled as "an act of terrorism".
First of all, that label gets used and misused so often that it has had an almost numbing effect. On everybody. Once it's an act of terror, people generally stop asking question.
Then, the circumstances are really peculiar (as detailed above).

IMO, if it weren't for all the funding the war on terror gets, this might well be "just" a hate-crime where somebody used the opportunity to make sure it got the headlines.
And headlines it got.
The issue here is that that guy was actually a licensed security officer, so harsher controls for civilians wouldn't have had much effect on preventing this tragedy, either.
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  #1612  
Old 14.06.2016, 02:42
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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45 per minute is incredibly slow unless you are taking and making a real effort at well aimed shots. It will fire as quickly as you pull the trigger so somewhere in real life of 100-120 if you can keep up that long.

As for the hunting... you said it, light weight is the key. For "home deeeeeefence" close enclosed environments it's also apparently an ideal weapon due to any combination of stock and barrel lengths.

I'm not pro or anti firearm though I am a firearms owner. I keep a neutral stance on the topic and if someone spouts shite that I know is incorrect then I will put a correction forward.
Are you suggesting that I was spouting shite? Firstly, the Bushmaster XM15 manual states that the maximum effective rate of fire is 45 rounds/minute. It's impossible to sustain 120 rounds /min. with an AR-15 on semi-automatic. Squeezing a trigger multiple times is not the same as waggling your index finger around in the air. Secondly, show me any self-respecting hunter who uses a SLR or who thinks that firing 120 rounds per minute is sport, or even a good way to hunt.
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The issue here is that that guy was actually a licensed security officer, so harsher controls for civilians wouldn't have had much effect on preventing this tragedy, either.
Just because someone is a security guard doesn't mean they should be permitted to buy almost any gun they want. They are provided with a gun at work. They don't need to buy one.

Last edited by 22 yards; 14.06.2016 at 13:39. Reason: Typo
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  #1613  
Old 14.06.2016, 07:21
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Your gay muslims friends might not agree but it seems the shooters father would though.

He has expressed sadness and disbelief at what his son has done - but then added that ''it's up to god to punish homosexuals''

https://www.yahoo.com/news/god-punis...131627726.html
Umm, wow. I've seen his other pictures - before (obviously) being mentally ill (no relatively sane person would have done that, we all agree, right) he was such a narcissistic twat!
They can't be funny today, but think of seeing these pictures of him a couple of months ago.....he was in love with himself.
(a seemingly Middle Eastern version of a macho)
Here, another one

Last edited by greenmount; 14.06.2016 at 07:37.
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  #1614  
Old 14.06.2016, 10:50
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

Never underestimate the power of self-hate: http://finance.yahoo.com/news/report...222620444.html

Quote:
The man police say killed 49 people at a gay nightclub in Orlando early Sunday morning had visited the club at least a dozen times before carrying out his attack, a witness told the Orlando Sentinel on Monday.

The suspected shooter, 29-year-old Omar Mateen, may have also used several different gay dating apps, according to reports from MSNBC and the Los Angeles Times.

And a former classmate of Mateen's told The Palm Beach Post he believed Mateen was gay, and that Mateen once asked him out romantically.

Three additional witnesses confirmed that they had seen Mateen at the gay nightclub more than once before.
Surely he was just staking out the place.
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  #1615  
Old 14.06.2016, 11:01
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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It would be interesting to know who the respondents were -- self-identified "Muslims"? Regular mosque-attending Muslims? The general populace of predominantly Muslim countries?

The figure for Thailand (99% say homosexuality is "morally wrong") is particularly suspect, since Thailand is the most gay-tolerant country in Asia. Anyone who has been there would have seen widespread, open acceptance of homosexuality. The footnote in the table shows that the data is skewed, anyway.

If you were to survey committed born-again Chrsitians in the United States, I suspect you'd get the same results.
But how many committed born-again Christians make up the entire population of the United States? Here lies the problem. If a few isolated individuals believe that Gays should be killed then very little is likely to happen. When a whole culture, feel that Gays should be killed, that's when actions against them manifest themselves.
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  #1616  
Old 14.06.2016, 11:40
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

Strict gun law prevents mass shooting
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  #1617  
Old 14.06.2016, 12:10
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

Florida law http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-36522570

If you have no convictions on domestic violence, or serious felony, or insanity, you can buy the non automatic rifle immediately. The hand gun requires a cooling off period of 3 days.

Even though he was employed as a security guard, he lived 200 miles away, and I don't think he worked at that club.

Don't US clubs check their members for side arms when they come in? In the cowboy films they sometimes did, so when was that rule dropped?
.

Last edited by Sbrinz; 14.06.2016 at 12:50. Reason: changed from "automatic" after reading '22 yards' post
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  #1618  
Old 14.06.2016, 12:14
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

That's a very odd link you just provided, in support of your pro- (or is it anti-anti-)gun stance.

From that report:

"The man stabbed the officer to death": this is your clue that NO GUNS were involved. Nobody shot anyone to death (except the police, when they killed the assailant, I assume). And there was NO MASS SHOOTING.

So in conclusion: yes, strict gun laws prevented a mass shooting in Paris.
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  #1619  
Old 14.06.2016, 12:17
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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If you have no convictions on domestic violence, or serious felony, or insanity, you can buy the non automatic rifle immediately. The automatic weapon requires a cooling off period of 3 days.
The three-day cooling-off period is for purchasing handguns, not for automatic weapons. I don't think you can buy automatic weapons easily, even in Florida (someone please correct me if I'm wrong).
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Old 14.06.2016, 12:20
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Re: A shooting just happened in ( *fill in the blank * )

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Are you suggesting that I was spouting shite? Firstly, the Bushmaster XM15 manual states that the maximum effective rate of fire is 45 roimds/minute. It's impossible to sustain 120 rounds /min. with an AR-15 on semi-automatic. Squeezing a trigger multiple times is not the same as waggling your index finger around in the air. Secondly, show me any self-respecting hunter who uses a SLR or who thinks that firing 120 rounds power minute is sport, or even a good way to hunt.


Just because someone is a security guard doesn't mean they should be permitted to buy almost any gun they want. They are provided with a gun at work. They don't need to buy one.
I wasn't suggesting you were spouting shite, don't be so pedantic or defensive, it was a general statement.

However as you brought it up your Oz gun ban statement earlier was not entirely correct and 45rpm is what the manufacturer classes as "effective rate" which is extremely low compared to possible rates but as we all know effective, sustained and possible are different things... don't we?

120rpm and higher is perfectly possible using the bump recoil .. totally inaccurate but possible but fairly irrelevant as the largest magazines I am aware of are 100.

I know all about the differences of wiggling in the air and on a trigger.. I shoot weekly.

"spray and pray" hunting... I certainly hope not but I guess it happens with redneck Johnny hayseed. A normal magazine capacity is 5 to 10.

In general the ar of which there are thousands of combinations are lightweight and highly accurate and can be cheap. Prices range from around 600usd to upwards of 2000 that's why it's gained popularity as a hunting and target rifle.

As for SLR, I assume you refer to semi automatic as SLR can mean semi or fully automatic. I prefer to stick to the one term of semi automatic to avoid any potential confusion. ... many 2 round shot guns are semi automatic as are normal centre fire rifles so there are millions of self respecting hunters and sport shooters out there.
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