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  #241  
Old 27.05.2020, 09:30
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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He is not going to resign.

If he is fired he will be back.
I think he will resign, but that he'll be back.
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  #242  
Old 27.05.2020, 09:32
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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I can't say I've followed every twist and turn of this story but re the first one, I have heard a Durham Police spokesperson on the radio confirm that they didn't speak to Dominic Cummings. And I'm not aware of anyone still saying that he made a second trip to Durham. I thought that one had been abandoned as it's easy enough to prove his whereabouts. As for any physical interaction with his parents, I've not heard anyone claim that this happened.

If you know different to this, then fair enough, but I'd be surprised if you have information that isn't publicly available.

For me, the story has gone beyond this rather silly forensic stuff about how we can prove that he did or didn't stop for a pee on the way back. We all know he made the trip -- he has not only admitted this but given far too much dull detail on it. The story is whether he should resign. Personally, I don't think so -- but there again, I'm not in favour of these media witch hunts, hounding people until they lose their livelihoods. And before I'm accused of blindly supporting Cummings, I said exactly the same thing when Stephen Kinnock and those two other Labour MPs were 'exposed' as travelling to attend social events. No harm in admonishing them but to lose their jobs over this sort of thing would be way over the top.

One difference though is that Cummings was genuinely ill. This was announced weeks ago, and there was a certain amount of "good, he deserves it" comment in The Guardian. That Scottish health advisor visiting her weekend home, and the London "Bonking Prof" (as the The Sun had it) voluntarily resigned, presumably because they didn't have much of an excuse. I find it hard to warm to Cummings normally but no one actually doubts that he was ill, and no one has called into question his claim about protestors shouting outside his house at all hours of the day and night. I've actually felt a bit of sympathy for the bloke when reading about some of the stuff he and his household have to put up with.

As far as I can see, there's a lot of Culture War Schadenfreude on display here. Cummings is usually described as the "Brexit Mastermind" and the bloke who won Boris Johnson his December landslide. He has a lot of enemies who want to punish him. So the sanctimonious outrage along the lines of "I'd never do what he did, regardless of my family" is just a little bit nauseating. There's a bigger story here.

The upshot is that the media will get their pound of flesh. He's very likely to resign IMO, and then they can switch their attention to their next target. The witch hunt must go on. I'll continue to hate this, regardless of which side of the political divide they focus on. Jeremy Corbyn was a political opponent but I thought the way he was treated was no less despicable than the current Cummings variety.
You are so right. Nothing sacred for the inquisition there, apparently. No human dignity, either. But he needs help not people saying "we agree with you but protect yourself and resign".
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  #243  
Old 27.05.2020, 09:38
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

The Law is not a moral compass.
The people who hid Anne Frank were breaking the law.
The people who killed her were following it.
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  #244  
Old 27.05.2020, 09:46
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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You are so right. Nothing sacred for the inquisition there, apparently. No human dignity, either. But he needs help not people saying "we agree with you but protect yourself and resign".
The corollary of that is that mob has the power to make anybody resign if only they kick up enough indignation .
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Old 27.05.2020, 09:46
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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Thats untrue, "You could be prosecuted if you drive without meeting the standards of vision for driving." That standard is 0.5 or 6/12 on the Snellen scale in 1 eye, yes 50% vision in 1 eye is all that is required to legally drive. As I said before you have a habit of speaking with authority whilst being totally incorrect, wear your gold badge with pride

I will provide a link as you failed to do so https://www.gov.uk/driving-eyesight-rules

And clicking on your link then links to this one which states you could be fined £1,000 and prosecuted if a health condition affects your driving.



Nobody came up with a conspiracy theory that the virus might have affected his vision. He offered up the vision problems himself and his own wife was according to him very concerned about his ability to drive


Btw are you an expert on the virus or an optometrist who can judge whether his sight was sufficient to drive! DVLA does NOT state you can legally drive but "You must tell DVLA if you have reduced visual acuity." If in doubt he should have either not driven or been checked by a Doctor first


https://www.gov.uk/health-conditions-and-driving
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  #246  
Old 27.05.2020, 09:51
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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Btw are you an expert on the virus or an optometrist who can judge whether his sight was sufficient to drive! DVLA does NOT state you can legally drive but "You must tell DVLA if you have reduced visual acuity." If in doubt he should have either not driven or been checked by a Doctor first


https://www.gov.uk/health-conditions-and-driving
Easy enough to download a Snellen chart & test your V.A. yourself, hardly rocket science. The are talking about less than 50% V.A. in 1 eye, you won't be in any doubt if you realise how low that standard is.
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Old 27.05.2020, 09:55
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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I can't say I've followed every twist and turn of this story but re the first one, I have heard a Durham Police spokesperson on the radio confirm that they didn't speak to Dominic Cummings...
I thought they confirmed they spoke to someone at his sister's (or was it parents') household, not him personally. Regardless, I still say an apology for making a big error in judgment would be more appropriate and help with smoothing things over rather than doubling down on his rather sketchy story.
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  #248  
Old 27.05.2020, 09:58
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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Easy enough to download a Snellen chart & test your V.A. yourself, hardly rocket science. The are talking about less than 50% V.A. in 1 eye,

Then perhaps it would have been more sensible for DC to do just that rather than risk the life of his wife and child on a 60 mile round trip drive just to check whether he could see properly or not. I guess if the experiment proved he couldn't and he had ploughed into another car injuring or killing someone you might not be so quick to tell us all how he was legally able to drive.

Of course, the other scenario was that there was nothing wrong with his eyesight and he was taking the family out for a drive to celebrate her birthday and lied through his teeth rather than being man enough to own up to it
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  #249  
Old 27.05.2020, 09:59
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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1. There is an independent witness stating he saw Cummings on the 19th. He stands by his story and Cummings has failed to prove otherwise.
A single witness, without corroboration or evidence? This is TERRIBLE journalism, yet was allowed to be splashed across the front pages of two national newspapers. Mr Cummings has said that data on his phone proves that he remained on London. Imagine all the internet sleuths and journalists that will have tried to find evidence that he returned to Durham and yet NOTHING has come to light. Hence it is a lie.

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2. The 1st statement by Durham Police said they did talk about lockdown guidelines. They changed their story yesterday. I wonder why...
Do you really think the police changed their story under pressure from the government as you're implying? This borders on conspiracy theory and if it were to come to light, would be far more damaging to the government than anything that has happened until now.
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  #250  
Old 27.05.2020, 10:00
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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I thought they confirmed they spoke to someone at his sister's (or was it parents') household, not him personally. Regardless, I still say an apology for making a big error in judgment would be more appropriate and help with smoothing things over rather than doubling down on his rather sketchy story.
It won't go away as it's politically motivated, probably best ignored. BJ is a true leader so will not sack his hugely successful advisor who is clearly the best man for the job, who could possibly replace him?
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  #251  
Old 27.05.2020, 10:00
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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Then perhaps it would have been more sensible for DC to do just that rather than risk the life of his wife and child on a 60 mile round trip drive just to check whether he could see properly or not. I guess if the experiment proved he couldn't and he had ploughed into another car injuring or killing someone you might not be so quick to tell us all how he was legally able to drive.

Of course, the other scenario was that there was nothing wrong with his eyesight and he was taking the family out for a drive to celebrate her birthday and lied through his teeth rather than being man enough to own up to it

I would say that the one that the one that never violated traffic rules and never drove in too dangerous conditions should throw the first stone.
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  #252  
Old 27.05.2020, 10:01
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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The corollary of that is that mob has the power to make anybody resign if only they kick up enough indignation .
I'll take your word for it, you are from there. Hope he sticks to his guns and recieves the support that comes with his role.
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  #253  
Old 27.05.2020, 10:04
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

Good lord you lot are desperate aren't you. Would you have quite the same vim and vigour if I didn't have ovaries,


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Thats untrue, "You could be prosecuted if you drive without meeting the standards of vision for driving." That standard is 0.5 or 6/12 on the Snellen scale in 1 eye, yes 50% vision in 1 eye is all that is required to legally drive. As I said before you have a habit of speaking with authority whilst being totally incorrect, wear your gold badge with pride

I will provide a link as you failed to do so https://www.gov.uk/driving-eyesight-rules
If you have, or suspect you have a comdition that impairs your ability to drive and then drive, you are in trouble. Cummings admitted he had impaired vision. He should not
have driven.

I am not totally incorrect at all. As usual you pick and choose what you deign to read.

But by all means, continue your campaign. Everyone needs a hobby.

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I can't say I've followed every twist and turn of this story but re the first one, I have heard a Durham Police spokesperson on the radio confirm that they didn't speak to Dominic Cummings. And I'm not aware of anyone still saying that he made a second trip to Durham. I thought that one had been abandoned as it's easy enough to prove his whereabouts. As for any physical interaction with his parents, I've not heard anyone claim that this happened.

If you know different to this, then fair enough, but I'd be surprised if you have information that isn't publicly available.

For me, the story has gone beyond this rather silly forensic stuff about how we can prove that he did or didn't stop for a pee on the way back. We all know he made the trip -- he has not only admitted this but given far too much dull detail on it. The story is whether he should resign. Personally, I don't think so -- but there again, I'm not in favour of these media witch hunts, hounding people until they lose their livelihoods. And before I'm accused of blindly supporting Cummings, I said exactly the same thing when Stephen Kinnock and those two other Labour MPs were 'exposed' as travelling to attend social events. No harm in admonishing them but to lose their jobs over this sort of thing would be way over the top.

...

As far as I can see, there's a lot of Culture War Schadenfreude on display here. Cummings is usually described as the "Brexit Mastermind" and the bloke who won Boris Johnson his December landslide. He has a lot of enemies who want to punish him. So the sanctimonious outrage along the lines of "I'd never do what he did, regardless of my family" is just a little bit nauseating. There's a bigger story here.

...
Sigh. Police didn't speak to Cummings, they spoke to his father. As I have said i think four times now. TC is refuting that the police spoke to Cummings or any of his family. They spoke to Daddy Cumminbs.

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And clicking on your link then links to this one which states you could be fined £1,000 and prosecuted if a health condition affects your driving.



Nobody came up with a conspiracy theory that the virus might have affected his vision. He offered up the vision problems himself and his own wife was according to him very concerned about his ability to drive


Btw are you an expert on the virus or an optometrist who can judge whether his sight was sufficient to drive! DVLA does NOT state you can legally drive but "You must tell DVLA if you have reduced visual acuity." If in doubt he should have either not driven or been checked by a Doctor first


https://www.gov.uk/health-conditions-and-driving
Yep. This. FMF is talking guff because it's me and I upset his equilibruim or something by, you know, posting.

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Easy enough to download a Snellen chart & test your V.A. yourself, hardly rocket science. The are talking about less than 50% V.A. in 1 eye, you won't be in any doubt if you realise how low that standard is.

Are you a trained optometrist or optician?

It's easy enough, sure, but are you confident in your skills to do it properly? Universal second person pronoun btw. I can well imagine your own personal response. Do I get another gold star?

Last edited by RufusB; 27.05.2020 at 10:26.
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  #254  
Old 27.05.2020, 10:05
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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Then perhaps it would have been more sensible for DC to do just that rather than risk the life of his wife and child on a 60 mile round trip drive just to check whether he could see properly or not. I guess if the experiment proved he couldn't and he had ploughed into another car injuring or killing someone you might not be so quick to tell us all how he was legally able to drive.

Of course, the other scenario was that there was nothing wrong with his eyesight and he was taking the family out for a drive to celebrate her birthday and lied through his teeth rather than being man enough to own up to it
You have to remember that he is assumed innocent until proved guilty by a court, it's up to the prosecution to prove beyond reasonable doubt that his vision was below the min standard required. This is clearly impossible, time to move on
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Old 27.05.2020, 10:08
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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I would say that the one that the one that never violated traffic rules and never drove in too dangerous conditions should throw the first stone.

Nope if I had just been seriously ill and I was having vision problems there is no way I would ever risk the life of my family or other innocents by driving for something any less than an absolute life and death emergency which a day to a beauty spot was not! Are you seriously telling us that you would get behind a wheel not fully recovered from Covid and with dodgy eyesight.
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  #256  
Old 27.05.2020, 10:08
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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Good lord you lot are desperate aren't you. Would you have quite the same vim and vigour if I didn't have ovaries,
You clearly have a very high opinion of yourself, it's not shared by everyone.
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Old 27.05.2020, 10:09
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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I'll take your word for it, you are from there. Hope he sticks to his guns and recieves the support that comes with his role.
So am I but I'm being shouted down by the idiotic groupthink mentality on here.

He is an unelected advisor. He cocked up big time. He deserves nothing.


General political consensus has always been (no link FMF, you're a man of the world, you should know this stuff) that as soon as an advisor becomes the story, as opposed to invisibly running the story, then it is time to go.

Tony Clifton, I take it you're choosing to ignore the actual facty facts in my posts?
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Old 27.05.2020, 10:12
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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Nope if I had just been seriously ill and I was having vision problems there is no way I would ever risk the life of my family or other innocents by driving for something any less than an absolute life and death emergency which a day to a beauty spot was not! Are you seriously telling us that you would get behind a wheel not fully recovered from Covid and with dodgy eyesight.

I don't know how he felt and I don't know the details about his eyesight, so I cannot judge - hence I will not be throwing the first stone.
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Old 27.05.2020, 10:15
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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He is an unelected advisor. He cocked up big time. He deserves nothing.
As you say he is an advisor, he advised on BREXIT & he advised on the General Election, both amazingly successful, he was not asked advise on driving to Durham

He is clearly a brilliant man, he will be around for a long time no matter how hard the lefties scream
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Old 27.05.2020, 10:15
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Re: Boris Johnson for PM?

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You have to remember that he is assumed innocent until proved guilty by a court, it's up to the prosecution to prove beyond reasonable doubt that his vision was below the min standard required. This is clearly impossible, time to move on
He will surely rely on his lawyer, I don't think a person in his position would cave in media bs. He's got BJ behind him, no?
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