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Old 26.10.2012, 13:43
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800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

There are five million people in Scotland. Those of voting age can have their say in the independence referendum. The 800,000 Scots in the rest of the UK cannot vote in it.

But what is the essence of being Scottish?
It's not about being able to tolerate the sound of bagpipes, or preferring Irn Bru to Coca-Cola, or saying "How no?" instead of "Why not?".
Instead, it all comes down to where you bide - that is, live.

When the referendum on Scottish independence is held in the autumn of 2014, only residents of Scotland will be eligible to vote. As a result, almost 400,000 people living north of the border but born in other parts of the UK will get to take part, while 800,000 Scots living in England, Northern Ireland and Wales will not.

"Given that Scotland has a population of just five million, 800,000 is a huge number," says David McCrone, professor of sociology at the University of Edinburgh.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-20048521
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Old 26.10.2012, 15:36
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

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There are five million people in Scotland. Those of voting age can have their say in the independence referendum. The 800,000 Scots in the rest of the UK cannot vote in it.

But what is the essence of being Scottish?
It's not about being able to tolerate the sound of bagpipes, or preferring Irn Bru to Coca-Cola, or saying "How no?" instead of "Why not?".
Instead, it all comes down to where you bide - that is, live.

When the referendum on Scottish independence is held in the autumn of 2014, only residents of Scotland will be eligible to vote. As a result, almost 400,000 people living north of the border but born in other parts of the UK will get to take part, while 800,000 Scots living in England, Northern Ireland and Wales will not.

"Given that Scotland has a population of just five million, 800,000 is a huge number," says David McCrone, professor of sociology at the University of Edinburgh.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-20048521
My English friends want to know why they can`t vote. They would happily let Scotland go Scotland`s own way. I just hope the Jocks have really thought this through.
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Old 26.10.2012, 16:25
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

What bugs me about this, is that the Scots want to have their fine thing and eat it.

The number of times I've heard them bleat about how badly they are treated in the union between England and Scotland - whose first king, James I, let us not forget was a Scot - reminds me of:



If they want to be separated, then let's bloody well cut off all and every single penny, support, infrastructure etc. etc. that is funded centrally.

Let's see how 5 million people with no major industry, one of the most unhealthy Western populations, dwindling oil/coal and 8+% unemployment manage to survive without the shared taxes of the UK...

Sadly I know that they'll probably vote in favour and then the rest of the UK will pay for it - literally - just like they are with that white elephant in Holyrood.
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Old 26.10.2012, 16:35
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

It'll just become a European bail-out.

And I agree that if you're not in your home country, does your opinion really matter? How can you vote to influence the country when you're not there and not paying tax?

If Scotland is so great, why aren't you living there?

(PS: I like Scotland)
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Old 26.10.2012, 16:49
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

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There are five million people in Scotland. Those of voting age can have their say in the independence referendum. The 800,000 Scots in the rest of the UK cannot vote in it.
They probably can't read or write, bit of a restriction when it comes to exercising your democratic rights. History may prove that Mel Gibson died in vain .....
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Old 26.10.2012, 18:12
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

It's never going to happen. Alex Salmond and his side kick are th Laurel and Hardy of politics.
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Old 26.10.2012, 18:24
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

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Let's see how 5 million people with no major industry, one of the most unhealthy Western populations, dwindling oil/coal and 8+% unemployment manage to survive without the shared taxes of the UK...
It's called Vanguard Class. The make of submarine that is. Harmless in itself, but a rather deadly load of Trident II missiles hide within it's bows. Based out of Clyde Naval Base (that'll be Scotland) it gives any party a rather decent hand of cards at the negotiating table.

History recalls that Ukraine managed to bargain quite effectively with the then newly formed Russia about 15 years ago in a not dissimilar situation.
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Old 26.10.2012, 18:35
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

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It's never going to happen. Alex Salmond and his side kick are th Laurel and Hardy of politics.
You'd be surprised, I know a fair few "educated" Scots and they are all up for remove the burden of the English yoke from their necks.

Let's hope they don't end up with egg on their faces when they realise what's weighing them down might be more of a chip on the shoulder than an English yoke...

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It's called Vanguard Class. The make of submarine that is. Harmless in itself, but a rather deadly load of Trident II missiles hide within it's bows. Based out of Clyde Naval Base (that'll be Scotland) it gives any party a rather decent hand of cards at the negotiating table.

History recalls that Ukraine managed to bargain quite effectively with the then newly formed Russia about 15 years ago in a not dissimilar situation.
Right - and who owns that?

Wouldn't that be HM's forces?

Shouldn't we also kick out all the Scot's from the armed services? They can have their own army after all. Granted, we might lose a lot of folk from the SAS, but hey, it is a small price to pay.

I don't think you can compare the breakdown of the USSR with this situation.
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Old 26.10.2012, 19:35
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

Is a Scot living somewhere else in the uk an expat?
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Old 26.10.2012, 22:27
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

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Is a Scot living somewhere else in the uk an expat?
I think so. For me, either he is British, or if he lives outside Scotland, he must call himself an ex-pat Scot. For the voting, how else are you going to differentiate?

I think all British nationals should vote on this: it results in breaking up the centuries old laws and customs, and the United Kingdom. I really think Alex Salmond is an idiot, he seems to be playing to the front row of his supporters, not to either nation.
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Old 30.10.2012, 16:52
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

I'm a Scot and this is a nonsense. Salmond has killed himself anyway agreeing to a one question yes/no vote, then lying to the nation about taking legal advice on his planned separation and then alienating his own party by inferring that an independent Scotland would apply to join Nato taking a polar opposite stance to his own party's views on the nuclear arsenal.

As for voting, I may not live in Scotland but I have a national passport, not a Swiss one so I should have the right to vote (I would vote no to the question personally).

I do think we should have pushed for greater devolution, as a country I think that we should be more responsible for the running of ourselves but I know the Union is too reliant on EACH OTHER for a split. Finally, I find the anti-Scots sentiment in this thread in pretty bad taste if I am honest, it's one of things I don't miss from the UK.
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Old 30.10.2012, 17:01
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

Guy Faulks and his friends also wanted to England to be independent of Scottish rule.
I think it's high time we kicked the Scottish royals back to where they came from and have independence.
Or am I barking up the wrong tree?
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Old 30.10.2012, 17:20
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

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Wouldn't that be HM's forces?

Shouldn't we also kick out all the Scot's from the armed services? They can have their own army after all. Granted, we might lose a lot of folk from the SAS, but hey, it is a small price to pay.

I don't think you can compare the breakdown of the USSR with this situation.
Technically, the Queen would still be Queen of Scotland, so the future Scottish armed forces would still be HM forces.

Also, in contrast to what happened in the USSR, the plan is that relevant state-held assets (including debt) would be split between Scotland and the rest of the UK according to some key, so the armed forces would also be split, presumably with certain regiments and their assets being handed over to the Scottish government.
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Old 30.10.2012, 17:21
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

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Guy Faulks and his friends also wanted to England to be independent of Scottish rule.
Yes, the only time the Irish were on our side.
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Old 30.10.2012, 17:25
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

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I think so. For me, either he is British, or if he lives outside Scotland, he must call himself an ex-pat Scot. For the voting, how else are you going to differentiate?

I think all British nationals should vote on this: it results in breaking up the centuries old laws and customs, and the United Kingdom. I really think Alex Salmond is an idiot, he seems to be playing to the front row of his supporters, not to either nation.
My thoughts exactly. The Act of Union was agreed between England and Scotland as equal nations, and so if the act is to be repealed, then both sides should be able to have a say in the matter.

Personally I feel that if the Scots want to go their own way then, regrettable as that may be, it is something I would respect and wish them all the best with it. The worst bit would be having to *import* whisky.
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Old 30.10.2012, 17:50
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

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What bugs me about this, is that the Scots want to have their fine thing and eat it.

The number of times I've heard them bleat about how badly they are treated in the union between England and Scotland - whose first king, James I, let us not forget was a Scot - reminds me of:



If they want to be separated, then let's bloody well cut off all and every single penny, support, infrastructure etc. etc. that is funded centrally.

Let's see how 5 million people with no major industry, one of the most unhealthy Western populations, dwindling oil/coal and 8+% unemployment manage to survive without the shared taxes of the UK...

Sadly I know that they'll probably vote in favour and then the rest of the UK will pay for it - literally - just like they are with that white elephant in Holyrood.
They will join Canada
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Old 30.10.2012, 18:04
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

I think nothing really speaks agains an autonomous Scotland as they can always establish mutually benefitial contracts with the rest of the UK if there is a need for it. But the current situation is hardly satisfactory for either side, as both think they subsidise the other side and would do better without. I hope for the same in Belgium, Spain and other countries; if two sides are unhappy about each other, why not have a divorce?

I say nay to all that European solidarity crap, let countries collaborate on a mutually benefitial and voluntary basis, not through extortion and "crisis-handling".
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Old 30.10.2012, 19:08
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

The reason residents of England don't get a vote is that if they did, then a yes vote would be far more likely. My money's on a "no".
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Old 30.10.2012, 20:58
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

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Also, in contrast to what happened in the USSR, the plan is that relevant state-held assets (including debt) would be split between Scotland and the rest of the UK according to some key, so the armed forces would also be split, presumably with certain regiments and their assets being handed over to the Scottish government.
Well the nearest precedent is the split with the "Irish Free State" back in 1922 and in that case everything but the regiments were split up along some agreed formula. In that case the regiments were disbanded and a new army constituted with career soldiers going in each direction depending not just on loyalties but also on career prospects. I would imagine the career prospects for a young officer would be very different serving in the army of a small nation that a major power...
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Old 30.10.2012, 21:20
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Re: 800,000 Scottish ex-pats cannot vote on referendum

My original posting was to draw attention to the elegibility situation: people born in Scotland but living south of the border will not be able to vote. While all the "Foreigners" living in Scotland will have the vote, if they meet the standard rules of residence. This seems to me to be an absurd situation for such an important vote.
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