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  #181  
Old 15.12.2012, 17:41
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Re: Connecticut primary school shootings

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I think what you will get out of this is armed school patrols by parents, not more regulation.
Unfortunately or fortunately, American school will become like the airports. Think about the airports before 9/11 and think about them afterwards. That's where American schools are headed.
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  #182  
Old 15.12.2012, 18:18
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Re: What the hell is going on with guns in the US?

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An angry, delusional person without a gun is just an angry, delusional person. An angry, delusional person with a gun can become a murderer. The children in CT and Kayla didn't die because a guy was pissed-off or mentally ill. They died because they were pissed off or mentally ill AND had a gun.
While essentially true (and I'm no gun advocate), someone who wants to do harm to a large number of other people can do so with only a little bit of basic chemistry and a few ingredients you can find at grocery stores and lawn centers. Just imagine the carnage if he had a few homemade claymore-style pipe bombs where the kids would be full of holes, shrapnel, and die in agony. I'm not sure why guns are the method of choice for these psychos of late as there are other ways to take out more people, more horrifically, more painfully and more efficiently than a rifle.

Guns are merely the way we finally take notice of a mentally ill person who has been ignored for too long. Society has become so....isolating that it breeds this sort of contempt for people. What if the guy had used claymores instead? Would we be talking about controlling pipes and nails to shifty looking white guys? No. At least I hope not.
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  #183  
Old 15.12.2012, 18:24
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Re: What the hell is going on with guns in the US?

And the latest reliable info is that Mom, the kindergarten teacher's aide who had worked at the school in the past, though was not presently working there nor had worked there in the last few years, was an avid gun collector and often took the kids target shooting. (While I understand KG teachers are a diverse lot, that sure is an unusual hobby for the marry poppins sort).

When all is said and done, damn this is going to be an interesting story, no matter how terrible the end result is. A study in just how odd 'family' can get while appearing 'normal'.
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  #184  
Old 15.12.2012, 18:35
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Re: Connecticut primary school shootings

After reading many of the post here people must remember, America is not "supposed" to be a "third world country," hence the immediate comments and outrage. America is "suppose" to be the leader of the free world, an example of what a democratic society is "supposed" to be like. People are astounded at their utter stupidity and this is why there is such a rash of comments criticizing American foolishness. The same thing happens again and again...so what now?

For a so-called modernized country, this is atrocious. Not only that, people want more guns, which is a sign that people do not trust each other. In their minds, it's easy to shoot and kill someone over anything. This is the sign of a failed society. The term "freedom" has been construed. There can't be freedom without some limitations. Freedom means responsibility. Unfortunately, guns in America have infested the society. Who can sit comfortably at a movie theater or restaurant? Where will the next carnage take place?

Problems begin with the private family; however, a country is a family as well. Sometimes, when a family member feels extremely neglected they turn to various means to get themselves heard. Americans vote and judges and courts overturn their decision, Americans have no jobs but corporations continuously send jobs overseas, Americans want change in foreign policy but money by the billions is still sent to other countries who "hate them." Americans are starting to feel that "they don't matter." This incident and others is a cry for help from the American people. And now every caring parent in America today is afraid to send their child to school. How sick is that?

It will take leaders like in the old days to get things back on track. It will take people of great wisdom who aren't afraid of public ridicule, who can't be bought with money and praise from other men. Regrettably, this person may never get the chance to speak in America, because once they do they are silenced. Can America be renewed, it depends on if they realize that they really, really, need help and if have the courage to do the right thing for the country as a whole. If they don't do this, America will become the laughing stock of the world. Who will want to listen to what they have to say if they don't clean up their own backyard? I feel sorry for America...
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  #185  
Old 15.12.2012, 18:39
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Re: What the hell is going on with guns in the US?

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The gun used to kill the kids was reported to shot 60 bullets per second. Now why on earth a citizen should even be allowed to buy these??
A news article said the following about the weapons:

"Two handguns - a Glock and Sig Sauer - were later found inside the school and a .223-calibre rifle was found in the back of the car."

So no automatics I think.
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  #186  
Old 15.12.2012, 18:50
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No, it's not just about mental illnesses. And yes, most people with mental illnesses are likely to be victims rather than perp. But there is definitely something going on - young adults who are isolated, filled with rage. Something is triggering sociopathic behavior.
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  #187  
Old 15.12.2012, 18:51
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Re: What the hell is going on with guns in the US?

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Guns are merely the way we finally take notice of a mentally ill person who has been ignored for too long. Society has become so....isolating that it breeds this sort of contempt for people. What if the guy had used claymores instead? Would we be talking about controlling pipes and nails to shifty looking white guys? No. At least I hope not.
I completely agree with you. But, yes, my point was only focused on guns. If a mentally ill person is strong enough, they could even kill with their bare hands I'm sure. Creepy as it sounds.
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  #188  
Old 15.12.2012, 18:52
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Re: What the hell is going on with guns in the US?

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So no automatics I think.
There were three more guns, 2 automatics, but they haven't said just yet where those were recovered. They're also saying that they have 'good evidence' of a motive though, again, they're not releasing that information just yet.

But a good shot with a revolver usually winds up with more casualties than a kid with a spray gun...so it's all speculation until they reveal what the real story is.
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  #189  
Old 15.12.2012, 18:54
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Re: What the hell is going on with guns in the US?

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And the latest reliable info is that Mom, the kindergarten teacher's aide who had worked at the school in the past, though was not presently working there nor had worked there in the last few years, was an avid gun collector and often took the kids target shooting. (While I understand KG teachers are a diverse lot, that sure is an unusual hobby for the marry poppins sort).

When all is said and done, damn this is going to be an interesting story, no matter how terrible the end result is. A study in just how odd 'family' can get while appearing 'normal'.
This is what I suspected .The choice of waepons and the maximum effect .Do you have the source to this
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  #190  
Old 15.12.2012, 18:54
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Re: What the hell is going on with guns in the US?

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I completely agree with you. But, yes, my point was only focused on guns. If a mentally ill person is strong enough, they could even kill with their bare hands I'm sure. Creepy as it sounds.
It wouldn't fit the profile of someone like this who wants the thrill of killing lots of people and then taking their own life. It takes a lot more talent to kill with your bare hands and kill yourself without a weapon. They keep saying he was smart or 'like a genius', but....I'd like to think a smart person would do things a lot differently.
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  #191  
Old 15.12.2012, 18:56
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Re: What the hell is going on with guns in the US?

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This is what I suspected .The choice of waepons and the maximum effect .Do you have the source to this
Reuters. Of course, I can't find the link now...
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  #192  
Old 15.12.2012, 19:45
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Re: What the hell is going on with guns in the US?

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No-one can pull the trigger 60x/second!

Even 4x/second is quite fast.

Tom
Well, I don't know anything about guns, as I said that is what was reported on Radio Canada
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  #193  
Old 15.12.2012, 19:57
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Re: Connecticut primary school shootings

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Do you realize it that it might be just a little frustrating for the Americans among us who are deeply affected by this to hear a bunch of people spout off about Americans being this way, and how Americans should do this, and no, this is the real problem with America and blah blah blah, all mere hours after this all happened...?
Leaving aside the point that if any poster online needed to be intimately familiar with their subject as a precondition to writing, that most forums would have their traffic reduced by 90% and EF would probably wither and die.....

To your points about only Americans knowing what is good for America, I am interested in your view on the following

1. If YOU had ultimate power and didn't need to worry about re-election or Congress, what would you do today (if anything) about gun control laws in the US?

2. If there wasn't a historical argument about 2nd amendment issues and guns had never been legal in the US, what would be the arguments to legalise today?

Last edited by Caviarchips; 15.12.2012 at 20:19. Reason: Formatting
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  #194  
Old 15.12.2012, 20:07
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Re: Connecticut primary school shootings

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Leaving aside the point that if any poster online needed to be intimately familiar with their subject as a precondition to writing, that most forums would have their traffic reduced by 90% and EF would probably wither and die.....

To your points about only Americans knowing what is good for America, I am interested in your view on the following

1. If YOU had ultimate power and didn't need to worry about re-election or Congress, what would you do today (if anything) about gun control laws in the US?

2. If there wasn't a historical argument about 2nd amendment issues and guns had never been legal in the US, what would be the arguments to legalise today?
I 100% agree with you..In fact, America needs to be criticized. They need a wake-up call. Maybe America should have sanctions against them like they implement to other countries until they get it together. Either way, America needs as much criticism that's coming to them. People don't consider Swiss persons on this forum when they're doing their criticizing and ranting.
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  #195  
Old 15.12.2012, 20:17
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Re: Connecticut primary school shootings

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I 100% agree with you..In fact, America needs to be criticized. They need a wake-up call. Maybe America should have sanctions against them like they implement to other countries until they get it together. Either way, America needs as much criticism that's coming to them. People don't consider Swiss persons on this forum when they're doing their criticizing and ranting.
It wasn't a criticism! You are an eloquent and throughful poster and I am genuinely interested in the answers to the questions....
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  #196  
Old 15.12.2012, 20:21
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Re: Connecticut primary school shootings

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It wasn't a criticism! You are an eloquent and throughful poster and I am genuinely interested in the answers to the questions....
I understand what you meant...I added the criticism part...
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  #197  
Old 15.12.2012, 20:26
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Re: What the hell is going on with guns in the US?

another one?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/1...n_2307505.html
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  #198  
Old 15.12.2012, 20:28
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Re: Connecticut primary school shootings

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I 100% agree with you..In fact, America needs to be criticized. They need a wake-up call. Maybe America should have sanctions against them like they implement to other countries until they get it together. Either way, America needs as much criticism that's coming to them. People don't consider Swiss persons on this forum when they're doing their criticizing and ranting.
I don't understand what you mean by "America needs criticism". America is a country and a country is a fuzzy, complex concept, not an individual person.

Let's criticise the people and the things responsible for this outrage, not some technical entity. I'm sure you can't mean that all American people should be criticised and somehow blamed for this outrage.

If we want to hold certain people or groups responsible, we could start with the guy who does the shooting. Beyond that, the short-sighted NRA, who can't see any link between the freedom to bear arms and these mass shootings. The average middle-class urban American is no more 'to blame' for this than you or I, and doesn't deserve ridicule or criticism.
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  #199  
Old 15.12.2012, 20:31
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Re: Connecticut primary school shootings

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I don't understand what you mean by "America needs criticism". America is a country and a country is a fuzzy, complex concept, not an individual person.

Let's criticise the people and the things responsible for this outrage, not some technical entity. I'm sure you can't mean that all American people should be criticised and somehow blamed for this outrage.

If we want to hold certain people or groups responsible, we could start with the guy who does the shooting. Beyond that, the short-sighted NRA, who can't see any link between the freedom to bear arms and these mass shootings. The average middle-class urban American is no more 'to blame' for this than you or I, and doesn't deserve ridicule or criticism.
I wrote "America needs criticism" not "Americans need criticism." America such as their policies, laws, etc...
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Old 15.12.2012, 20:46
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Re: What the hell is going on with guns in the US?

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While essentially true (and I'm no gun advocate), someone who wants to do harm to a large number of other people can do so with only a little bit of basic chemistry and a few ingredients you can find at grocery stores and lawn centers. Just imagine the carnage if he had a few homemade claymore-style pipe bombs where the kids would be full of holes, shrapnel, and die in agony. I'm not sure why guns are the method of choice for these psychos of late as there are other ways to take out more people, more horrifically, more painfully and more efficiently than a rifle.

Guns are merely the way we finally take notice of a mentally ill person who has been ignored for too long. Society has become so....isolating that it breeds this sort of contempt for people. What if the guy had used claymores instead? Would we be talking about controlling pipes and nails to shifty looking white guys? No. At least I hope not.
I can't agree with what I think you're saying. Just because there are other ways of doing terrible things to people isn't a good argument for trying to take these lethal weapons out of easy circulation.

To create a bagful of pipe bombs or whatever, to transport them to a school, and to deploy them in such a way as to terrorise and kill a number of people would take far more knowledge, planning and good fortune (from their perspective) than to go to the same place with some guns in a hold-all that you keep in a cupboard at home.

From what I can see, many of these losers are fantasists for whom the gun is an essential icon. Picking victims off with a gun is probably part of the arcade-game fantasy world they live in. They can terrorise people without endangering themselves, which I would think is not so easy with home-made bombs.
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