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  #241  
Old 25.02.2014, 16:24
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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From a Kurdish family, I can tell you that while we got more recognition over the past years, none that I know, have Erdogan in respect. Kurdish new rights and "freedom" was, I believe, a political move for joining the EU. Nothing to do with justice and rights.
at some stage, tayyip's goals and Kurdish rights struggle had overlapping goals.. and each side tried to use it to its most benefit

if anything, one must give credit to the current government for making ordinary sunni turks aware of others problems/difficulties.. i, for one, am now more aware what sort of trouble the non-muslim turks and kurds faced.. i also started understanding what sort of pressure the more fundamentalist segment of the population faced from the more secular governments
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  #242  
Old 25.02.2014, 16:57
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Re: Turkish Spring?

Just for the record: here is the full script:
source

RTE: Are you home son?
Bilal E(son): Yes father
RTE: Now! This morning [they] made an operation. Ali Agaoglu, Reza Zerrab, Erdogan's [Bayraktar-ex minister] son, Zafer's [Caglayan – ex-minister] son, Muammer's [Guler – ex-minister] son, etc.. All their houses are being searched now.
BE: Tell again, daddy
RTE: I'm saying that Muammer's son, Zafer's son, Erdogan's son, Ali Agaoglu, Reza Zerrab etc they are searching the houses of 18 people under a big corruption operation thing.
BE: yes
RTE: OK? Now, what I say is, you take everything that you have in the house out. OK?
BE: What can I have on me dad! There is your money in the safe
RTE: That's what I am saying. Now, I am sending your sister. OK?
BE: You are sending who?
RTE: Your sister, I'm saying.
BE: Eh, OK
RTE: Then,... She has that information, OK. Talk with your big brother
BE: Yes
RTE: On him,,, Let's do..., talk with your uncle too, he should also take out, also talk to your [maternal] uncle, he should also...
BE: What should we do with these daddy, where should we put them?
RTE: To specific places, to some specific places... do it
(A woman's voice on background saying “Berat”)
BE: Berat also has some
RTE: That's what I am saying. Now, get together, go get your uncle, I don't know if Uncle Ziya has some, OK? Also immediately [inform] your brother Burak too.
BE: OK father. You mean Sumeyye, I mean take out, Sumeyye will tell me where to take them?
RTE: Yes, fine. C'mon now, do [it] think about yours among yourselves with your uncle, etc
BE: on what to do?
RTE: Yes, yes, let's contact fast, until 10.00. Because the issue is...
BE: OK father
RTE: OK? Keep in touch
BE: OK daddy
2nd call 11.17
BE: Father, We got together with Brother Hasan etc. Brother Berat, my uncle, we are together, thinking about it. Berat has another idea. He says that let's give some of it to Faruk [Kalyoncu] for the other “business/thing” so he can process them like the previous ones. Shall we do it, we can solve a big amount with this.
RTE: That may be
NE: OK. For the other part, because we started a business partnership with Mehmet Gur, we thought of giving it to him saying “keep it, as the projects come you can use from that. This way, we will be able to dissolve and move the rest to somewhere else.
RTE: OK, fine, as long as you do...
BE: OK
RTE: Did Sumeyye arrive?
BE: She arrived home, she'll now come here. OK daddy, we will sort this out today, inshallah (with God's permission). Anything else?
RTE: It would be good if you do... If you can dissolve them all.
BE: Yes, we will dissolve them all, inshallah
3rd call 15.39
RTE: Did you do the other tasks I gave you?
BE: We will finish them in the evening. We sorted some out; We sorted the Berat part, now we will first handle the part with Mehmet Gur and the rest, we will do that when it gets dark.
RTE:....
BE: Inshallah
RTE: What did Sumeyye do?
BE: She took them out, brought, we talked, etc.
RTE: Did she sort both sides?
BE: I think so daddy, she said she emptied both.
RTE: Both sides
BE: Yes, she said both of them, but you mean this by saying both sides, right?
RTE: Whatever. OK, fine
BE: What time will you arrive?
RTE: About 12
BE: Have a safe journey
RTE: Do not talk on the phone
4th call 23.15
BE: Hi daddy, I am calling to... we did [it] mostly. Eee, did you call me daddy?
RTE: No I did not, you called me
BE: I was called from a secret number
RTE: By saying mostly, did you fully dissolve it
BE: We did not zeroized it yet daddy. Let me explain.. We still have a 30 million euros that we could not yet dissolve. Berat thought of something.. There was an additional 25 million dollars that Ahmet Calik should receive. They say let's give this [to him] there. When the money comes, we do [something], they say. And with the remaining money we can buy a flat from Sehrizar, he says. What do you say, father?
RTE: ....
(background soun: Ayyy)
BE: Daddy
RTE: Is Sumeyye with you?
BE: Yes with me, should I call her?
RTE: No, there was another sound, that's why I asked
BE: Umm.. I mean, he can transfer 35 million dollars to Calik and buy a flat from Sherizar with the remaining.
RTE: Whatever, we will sort it
BE: Should we do it like this?
RTE: OK do it
BE: Do you want them all dissolved father, or do you want some money for yourself
RTE: No, it cannot stay, son. You could transfer that to the other, with Mehmet you could transfer it there...
BE: Yes, we gave to them. We gave 20 to them
RTE: For God's sake, first you should've transferred you could then do...
BE: we were able to give this much for now, it is hard already, it takes too much space. We are putting some of it to another place, we gave part of it to Tunc, and then...
RTE: did you transfer all to Tunc?
BE: (Sumeyye, can you come) Where, father?
RTE: To Tunc, I say, did you transfer all to Tunc?
BE: They asked, I guess he said that he could take 10 million euros.
RTE: Whatever. Do not talk this like this on this.
BE: OK, then, we will sort it as such
RTE: Ok do it. I am not able to come tonight, I will stay in Ankara
BE:OK, we are sorting it out. You do not worry
5th call
18.12.2013 10.58
RTE. I wondered if everything is fine, so I called
BE: No, nothing. We finished the tasks you gave us, with the help of the God
RTE: Is it all zeroed?
BE: Fully, I mean saying zeroed, how should I put it? I had Samandira and Maltepe's money, 730.000 USD and 300.000 TL. I will handle these too. We owe 1 million TL to Faruk İsik (AKP MP); I will give those to him and tell him to transfer the rest to the academy.
RTE: Do not talk openly
BE: Should't I talk?
RTE: Do not talk, OK?
BE: OK daddy
RTE: I mean, do not keep anything on you, whatever it is Samandira or whatever... Send it to where it needs to be, where do you keep it?
BE: OK daddy, but I think currently we are under surveillance
RTE: What have I been telling to you since the very beginning!
BE: But is it the bodyguard team? Who is following us father?
RTE: Son, you are being tapped
BE: But they are also visually monitoring, they say
RTE: That may be true. Now, we did some things (meaning intervention) in Istanbul security
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  #243  
Old 06.03.2014, 15:59
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Re: Turkish Spring?

Turkish Government official today endorses claims by pro-government media that all digital recordings of wiretaps made before 2012 have been removed from telecoms directorate.

Who has them and what do they plan to do with them?
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  #244  
Old 11.03.2014, 11:17
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Re: Turkish Spring?

just another victim of this scandalous government; tayyip (pm) did not even once acknowledge the government's and police's fault during the protests.
I still hope a miracle happens and they get outvoted during the elections at the end of this month -not very likely but still.
There is no law in the country any more; it has become tayyips family-run business

http://www.mcall.com/news/nationworl...0,644068.story
ISTANBUL (Reuters) - A 15-year-old Turkish boy who suffered a head injury during anti-government protests in Istanbul last June died on Tuesday after spending months in a coma, triggering renewed clashes between police and his family's supporters.

Berkin Elvan, then aged 14, got caught up in street battles between police and protesters on June 16 after going out to buy bread for his family. He was struck in the head with a suspected police tear-gas canister and went into a coma.
Elvan had become a rallying point for critics of Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan's government and they held regular vigils at the hospital where he lay in intensive care. No police officer has been prosecuted in connection with the Elvan case.
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  #245  
Old 21.03.2014, 16:46
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Re: Turkish Spring?

So now Twitter is banned
According to a recent study 31% of the 36m internet users in Turkey use Twitter. Some say because of doubts about official media reporting?

Anyway most people seem to have found ways around the ban; it is even claimed Arinc the deputy PM twitterd his schedule for today?
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  #246  
Old 21.03.2014, 16:57
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Re: Turkish Spring?

Funny timing as pm teyyip would say;
Yesterday he mentioned that he will close this evil Twitter and other social media blogs.. and same evening some guy makes an appeal (allegedly akp's Izmir candidate) and the site gets banned

rumours are that the government is fearing the publication of some "sex" tapes involving some high profile politicians (teyyip?) before elections; these "religious (!)" politicians are allegedly marrying some beautiful ladies following a short islamic marriage ritual and then engaging in intercourse
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  #247  
Old 21.03.2014, 18:17
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Funny timing as pm teyyip would say;
Yesterday he mentioned that he will close this evil Twitter and other social media blogs.. and same evening some guy makes an appeal (allegedly akp's Izmir candidate) and the site gets banned

rumours are that the government is fearing the publication of some "sex" tapes involving some high profile politicians (teyyip?) before elections; these "religious (!)" politicians are allegedly marrying some beautiful ladies following a short islamic marriage ritual and then engaging in intercourse
About "following a short Islamic marriage ritual" - this is the special high profile politician ritual that involves handing over a brown envelope (sorry - I meant shoe box) full of currency?
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  #248  
Old 21.03.2014, 18:23
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Re: Turkish Spring?

Erdogan is doomed to fail like his "muslim brotherhood" fellows in Egypt, Syria and Tunisia.

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  #249  
Old 22.03.2014, 06:04
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Erdogan is doomed to fail like his "muslim brotherhood" fellows in Egypt, Syria and Tunisia.

Unlike General Mubarak and Dr Assad, Mr Erdogan does not have the army behind him but against him. My advice to him would be to get to Berlin for longterm medical treatment, as he otherwise may meet the fate of Adnan Menderes


http://www.executedtoday.com/2009/09...dnan-menderes/

and here the victor of 1960/61

https://www.google.ch/search?q=Cemal...2F%3B397%3B595

Last edited by Wollishofener; 22.03.2014 at 06:17.
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  #250  
Old 24.03.2014, 00:27
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Re: Turkish Spring?

Everybody in this area is starting to play political games!

Quote "Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan has confirmed that the country's air force shot down a Syrian aircraft for violating Turkish airspace, an action that Syria denounced as "unprecedented and unjustifiable"."

and

"The social media ban (Twitter) has been circumvented and mocked, but Erdogan has remained resolute in the face of opposition from the public and even the Turkish president, Abdullah Gul, who earlier on Sunday had described the ban as "an unpleasant situation for such a developed country as Turkey".
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  #251  
Old 25.03.2014, 00:00
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Everybody in this area is starting to play political games!

Quote "Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan has confirmed that the country's air force shot down a Syrian aircraft for violating Turkish airspace, an action that Syria denounced as "unprecedented and unjustifiable"."

and

"The social media ban (Twitter) has been circumvented and mocked, but Erdogan has remained resolute in the face of opposition from the public and even the Turkish president, Abdullah Gul, who earlier on Sunday had described the ban as "an unpleasant situation for such a developed country as Turkey".
Abdullah Gül is the man who improved the Turkish Greek relations to a good level

Over to the airforces. Syria has the more modern fighter-bombers than Turkey, but the Turkish Air Force is better organised and has the better structure and far more planes around. In short, Turkey is in a far better position
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  #252  
Old 25.03.2014, 09:54
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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...
and

"The social media ban (Twitter) has been circumvented and mocked, but Erdogan has remained resolute in the face of opposition from the public and even the Turkish president, Abdullah Gul, who earlier on Sunday had described the ban as "an unpleasant situation for such a developed country as Turkey".
Gul is the same guy who only recently approved the internet law enabling such bans even before the details were known. He cannot play the innocent at this stage
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  #253  
Old 25.03.2014, 21:18
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Abdullah Gül is the man who improved the Turkish Greek relations to a good level

Over to the airforces. Syria has the more modern fighter-bombers than Turkey, but the Turkish Air Force is better organised and has the better structure and far more planes around. In short, Turkey is in a far better position
Turkish AF has better airplanes, training, organization and a larger Nato equipped force, so yes they are better. BUT, Syrians have the latest Russian SAM systems like the S300, which makes even the USA think twice before planning an attack
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  #254  
Old 26.03.2014, 00:33
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Turkish AF has better airplanes, training, organization and a larger Nato equipped force, so yes they are better. BUT, Syrians have the latest Russian SAM systems like the S300, which makes even the USA think twice before planning an attack
Could not agree more. Indeed the size of the Turkish Armed Forces is such that Turkey on the bottomline is ahead of Syria anytime. Add to this that Syria is divided

The inventory of the Syrian Air Force
--
Aircraft flown
Attack MiG-23
Su-24
Su-22
Mi-25
Gazelle
Electronic
warfare Mi-8
Fighter MiG-29
MiG-23
MiG-21
Interceptor MiG-25
Reconnaissance MiG-25
MiG-21
Trainer L-39
MBB 223
MFI-17
Transport An-26
An-24
Il-76
Mi-17
Mi-8
-
looks good but a check up on aspects as you mentioned above makes it clear that Syria has no chance against the military industrial giant in the north
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Old 26.03.2014, 00:37
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Could not agree more. Indeed the size of the Turkish Armed Forces is such that Turkey on the bottomline is ahead of Syria anytime. Add to this that Syria is divided

BUT, that S300 is pretty nasty stuff
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  #256  
Old 26.03.2014, 00:43
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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BUT, that S300 is pretty nasty stuff
No doubt. But in case Turkey decides to conquer Aleppo, it will overcome

At the other hand I do not trust the "news" provided by Ankara. To say it clearly, I do not have conclusive info, but simply do not believe info spread by either Ankara OR Damascus
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  #257  
Old 29.03.2014, 02:35
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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No doubt. But in case Turkey decides to conquer Aleppo, it will overcome

At the other hand I do not trust the "news" provided by Ankara. To say it clearly, I do not have conclusive info, but simply do not believe info spread by either Ankara OR Damascus

From Twitter ""One would think that if security is this compromised, the government should be looking at securing the confidentiality and secrecy of high-level communications rather than further damaging Turkey's image."
By Omerli on Turkey blocks access to YouTube
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  #258  
Old 30.03.2014, 07:30
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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From Twitter ""One would think that if security is this compromised, the government should be looking at securing the confidentiality and secrecy of high-level communications rather than further damaging Turkey's image."
By Omerli on Turkey blocks access to YouTube
Right. But Erdogan increasingly reminds me of Wilhelm II. As power hungry as he is he may well decide for an option taken by previous Turkish rulers and that would be expansion by military means, most likely southeast. Maybe in an alliance with a northern neighbour who also has imperial ambitions
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  #259  
Old 01.04.2014, 11:02
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Right. But Erdogan increasingly reminds me of Wilhelm II. As power hungry as he is he may well decide for an option taken by previous Turkish rulers and that would be expansion by military means, most likely southeast. Maybe in an alliance with a northern neighbour who also has imperial ambitions
Expansian into Southeast? Turkey should be happy if it does not lose its own southeast in couple years.. now that sultan teyyip has the approval rating, he can easily negotiate with the Kurds there to support him for presidency in return for a federation style government there
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Old 01.04.2014, 12:06
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Re: Turkish Spring?

Clearly the path to success in Turkey is to be a corrupt politician
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