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  #361  
Old 08.04.2015, 13:46
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Indeed.

The country I moved in 10 years ago is already very different than the country I visited last year. Sadly, not in the best way. Yeah, they are building lots of housing, yes they are trying to change Istanbul, bringing it to a more modern functional city but the society went backward in term of freedom, in term of politics and economics.

All the brainwash on the tv, the mindless shows, the controlled news and brain killer reporting.

The unhealthy worshiping of Ataturk, the arrogance of Erdogan....
agree on all also on the remark about Kemalism which was abused greatly in the past, diverging from the initial ideals. Ataturk still remains the founder of the republic for most of the anti-AKP camp (excluding probably some Kurds) including myself but this does not change the fact that his name/ideology was abused by various governments in the past to suppress opposition

I must admit, that change of power did help create a more critical look at the recent past .. also showed brainwashing was not only done through tv shows
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  #362  
Old 08.04.2015, 13:51
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Re: Turkish Spring?

Greek Cypriots are still waiting for the 90m euro's imposed on Turkey by the European Court of Rights back in 2013 for damages from the 1974 invasion.
Laughable when they called the ruling unfair.
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  #363  
Old 08.04.2015, 14:01
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Greek Cypriots are still waiting for the 90m euro's imposed on Turkey by the European Court of Rights back in 2013 for damages from the 1974 invasion.
Laughable when they called the ruling unfair.
I think Cyprus issue deserves its own thread. As for ruling, I don't think the delay in payment is related to cash shortage but to repercussions.

maybe when Merkel pays Tsipras the 292billion first for Nazi war reparations, Turkey will also be inclined to pay
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  #364  
Old 08.04.2015, 14:13
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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also showed brainwashing was not only done through tv shows
Yes indeed.

Schools, TV, newspapers, etc.

I find it very difficult to swallow all this Kemalism when looking at the genecids of Armenian and Kurdish people committed by that movement. It's insulting and disgusting. But again, brainwash is a power tool for the government to keep the population thinking it never happened.

Yes, we can talk about all the wonderful things done for the goods of the republic but to achieve this with the blood of millions of death isn't something to sweep under the carpet
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  #365  
Old 08.04.2015, 14:19
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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I think Cyprus issue deserves its own thread. As for ruling, I don't think the delay in payment is related to cash shortage but to repercussions.

maybe when Merkel pays Tsipras the 292billion first for Nazi war reparations, Turkey will also be inclined to pay
Maybe that issue deserves its own thread as well, although Germany never did invade Turkey.
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  #366  
Old 08.04.2015, 14:30
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Yes indeed.

I find it very difficult to swallow all this Kemalism when looking at the genecids of Armenian and Kurdish people committed by that movement. It's insulting and disgusting. But again, brainwash is a power tool for the government to keep the population thinking it never happened.

Yes, we can talk about all the wonderful things done for the goods of the republic but to achieve this with the blood of millions of death isn't something to sweep under the carpet
Armenian killings/deportations are dated 1915 before the republic was founded in 1923 and before the Turkish movement started in 1919. So Kemalism is not responsible; was the Ottoman government? yes

Was it a sudden event happening just overnight? Didn't any of the prevailing world powers know about what was being done? Why did they not intervene when the Ottoman government was so weak and prone to be influenced?
This is not to say the major culprit were the Ottoman government back then; it has caused deaths of its own citizens. But somehow the event fitted some back then.

Just like when after the defeat of Greek army in 1922 old Greeks were forced to leave Izmir in sight of the approaching Turkish army and western ships simply sailed away without taking ay onboard
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  #367  
Old 08.04.2015, 17:57
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Re: Turkish Spring?

OK not always grim headlines out of the country:
Thousands of Turkish Students Demand Jedi Temples On Campus

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Thousands of students across Turkey have demanded that their universities build Jedi and Buddhist temples on campus, in response to a surge in mosques being built for Muslim students.
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  #368  
Old 08.04.2015, 19:20
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Armenian killings/deportations are dated 1915 before the republic was founded in 1923 and before the Turkish movement started in 1919. So Kemalism is not responsible; was the Ottoman government? yes

Was it a sudden event happening just overnight? Didn't any of the prevailing world powers know about what was being done? Why did they not intervene when the Ottoman government was so weak and prone to be influenced?
This is not to say the major culprit were the Ottoman government back then; it has caused deaths of its own citizens. But somehow the event fitted some back then.

Just like when after the defeat of Greek army in 1922 old Greeks were forced to leave Izmir in sight of the approaching Turkish army and western ships simply sailed away without taking ay onboard
The young Turks movement were the ones who started the genocide, this movement is the foundation of the kemalist.

Wikipedia reference-linkAfter the demise of the Ottoman Empire, Atatürk, influenced by both the Young Ottomans and the Young Turks,[5] as well as by their successes and failures, led the declaration of the Republic of Turkey in 1923, borrowing from the earlier movements' ideas of secularism and Turkish nationalism, while bringing about for the first time free education, women's rights,[6] and other reforms that have been enshrined by later leaders into guidelines for government of Turkey.
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  #369  
Old 09.04.2015, 07:51
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Greek Cypriots are still waiting for the 90m euro's imposed on Turkey by the European Court of Rights back in 2013 for damages from the 1974 invasion.
Laughable when they called the ruling unfair.

The Greek Dypriot officers in 1974 caused the mess by toppling President Makarios and by declaring Enosis, so that it is Greek Cyprus which has to pay
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  #370  
Old 09.04.2015, 09:25
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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The Greek Dypriot officers in 1974 caused the mess by toppling President Makarios and by declaring Enosis, so that it is Greek Cyprus which has to pay
Crack on Wolli, explain your view to European Court of Rights. I'm sure you're onto something.
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  #371  
Old 09.04.2015, 10:47
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Crack on Wolli, explain your view to European Court of Rights. I'm sure you're onto something.
We, Turks, have a different view on what caused the 1974 "Invasion"; you will rightfully assume that we have a rather biased view; I on the contrary will counter that by saying you are the one with biased view ignoring all the atrocities carried out chasing Enosis leading to 1974 and that West sympathizes with Cypriots in general

But the fact of the matter remains that both communities on the island are currently suffering and the north has received an unfair amount of Turkish immigrants. Both sides need to come to terms about how to proceed going forward. I don't think they can start living together like they did before 1974 but giving back some of the deserted areas in north to south and increasing cooperation might be a step forward

As for ECR ruling, I guess Turkey has to pay, not having done enough to support her cause
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  #372  
Old 13.04.2015, 22:10
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Re: Turkish Spring?

The documentary Bakur (North), the first set in the camps of the outlawed Kurdistan Workers’ party (PKK) inside Turkey, had been scheduled to open in this year’s Istanbul International film festival on Sunday, but was cancelled only hours before the screening, after festival organisers received a letter from the Turkish ministry of culture claiming that the film did not have the required registration certificate.

Twenty three Turkish film-makers then withdrew their films from the festival, and the festival organisers announced today that all competitions – and the closing ceremony – had been cancelled.
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  #373  
Old 14.04.2015, 04:44
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Crack on Wolli, explain your view to European Court of Rights. I'm sure you're onto something.

It to me is clear that this "European Court" is WRONG. Turkey in 1974 acted in accordance with the Treaty of Zürich (1960) which was the base of the REPUBLIC OF CYPRUS, as a GUARANTEE POWER
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  #374  
Old 14.04.2015, 17:21
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Re: Turkish Spring?

If you are into Turkish domestic politics, try to follow up events/comments surrounding the recent PKK-Turkish Armed forces clash in Agri; it might turn out to be one of the biggest cover-ups. But since the justice & media is under heavy control, repercussions are not what you would expect elsewhere in the world
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  #375  
Old 14.04.2015, 21:03
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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It to me is clear that this "European Court" is WRONG. Turkey in 1974 acted in accordance with the Treaty of Zürich (1960) which was the base of the REPUBLIC OF CYPRUS, as a GUARANTEE POWER
So invading a county is in accordance to 1960 ZH treaty.b
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  #376  
Old 14.04.2015, 22:02
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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If you are into Turkish domestic politics, try to follow up events/comments surrounding the recent PKK-Turkish Armed forces clash in Agri; it might turn out to be one of the biggest cover-ups. But since the justice & media is under heavy control, repercussions are not what you would expect elsewhere in the world
Well if the PKK will organise public tree planting events then Turkey must send in fighter jets, commandos, helicopters &&&
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  #377  
Old 15.04.2015, 00:57
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Re: Turkish Spring?

Erdoğan warns Pope Francis not to repeat ‘mistake’ about Armenian claims, quote here.

I imagine the Pope is shaking in his shoes
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  #378  
Old 15.04.2015, 10:49
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Erdoğan warns Pope Francis not to repeat ‘mistake’ about Armenian claims, quote here.

I imagine the Pope is shaking in his shoes
Poor thing, he can't get to control everyone's ideas and opinions.
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  #379  
Old 15.04.2015, 11:29
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Re: Turkish Spring?

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Erdoğan warns Pope Francis not to repeat ‘mistake’ about Armenian claims, quote here.

I imagine the Pope is shaking in his shoes
On Bloomberg:
*ERDOGAN: TURKEY COULD DEPORT ARMENIANS, IT IS NOT DOING SO
*ERDOGAN SAYS TURKEY WON'T CARE ABT EUROPEAN PARLIAMENT DECISION
*ERDOGAN: EP ARMENIA RULING WOULD BE `IN ONE EAR, OUT THE OTHER'

Just the right sort of remarks before the 100th year anniversary on 24th April; oh, Bloomberg was not bad at translation, his tone in Turkish is way worse. With risk of losing the majority in next elections and not getting his presidency (I wonder why he keeps insisting on it, he has already been acting as an almighty president since he got elected), he is getting angrier every day

The mood in local markets in Turkey is very sour, Turkish Lira just now weakening to 2.7045 and the country paying for years wasted on fattening up instead of structural reforms (reminder to myself, this last remark for Turkey not Greece=
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Old 15.04.2015, 12:15
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Re: Turkish Spring?

Stung by Pope’s Remarks on Armenian Genocide, Turkish Minister Insults Argentina:

http://mobile.nytimes.com/2015/04/14...?referrer&_r=1
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