World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? - Page 158

Axa · #**3141** 27.02.2022, 12:19

15.02.2022 - Sheeple! Don't believe mainstream media, our dear great leader Putin is NOT about to invade Ukraine. There's is no evidence of 100+K troops near Russia-Ukraine border.......well, a minute of silence for the IT contractor that one day realized he had a conscience, only to forget about it the next morning.

So ironic that Mr. Snowden fought against misinformation and until some months ago the public perception was "he did more good than harm". https://twitter.com/Snowden/status/1493641714363478016

#**3142** 27.02.2022, 12:20

	Quote:	vladest
	will see. i'm a bit skeptical about EU but Nato probably will happen quite soon

This will not happen as long as Ukraine is at war and will result in the direct confrontation with Russia. This should have happened a week ago, now this is too late.

komsomolez · #**3143** 27.02.2022, 12:25

	Quote:	gaburko
	Well, I wouldn't be so sure about that anymore. (As a keyboard-strategist ) we still don't know Putin's endgame and the outcome of the mess could be a scenario in which he splits Ukraine in east, dominated by him and an independent west, which could then be part of a deal to be accepted into EU and NATO. I am not saying it's an ideal outcome, but it's certainly a possibility.

What I meant there is no way UA is becoming a NATO member during this war.

vladest · #**3144** 27.02.2022, 12:25

	Quote:	leonie
	This will not happen as long as Ukraine is at war and will result in the direct confrontation with Russia. This should have happened a week ago, now this is too late.

of course not during hot phase...but jfyi the war is ongoing for 8 years now

vladest · #**3145** 27.02.2022, 12:30

Some more Nazi disinformation form UA miltary HQ:

	Quote:
	Total losses of the enemy for the three previous days (February 24, 25 and 26) of the war of aggression of the Russian Federation in Ukraine: Planes - 27 helicopters - 26 Tanks - 146 Armored combat vehicles - 706 Cannon - 49 SAM BEECH - 1 MLRS BM-21 "Grad" - 4 Automotive equipment - 30 Tanks - 60 UAV operational and tactical level - 2 Ships / boats - 2 Personnel - approximately 4300 (to be specified).

disinformation taken from here: https://www.facebook.com/GeneralStaff.ua

komsomolez · #**3146** 27.02.2022, 12:50

U.S. and Europe take aim at Russian central bank reserves, threatening blow to economy

https://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...k-white-house/

Missed that yesterday. I think this is all good and needs to happen. I am getting a bit worried though that we are headed straight towards nuclear blackmail if/when Putin feels cornered. And I don't know I want to bet on Russian top military turning on Putin if we get to worst case.

vladest · #**3147** 27.02.2022, 12:55

	Quote:	komsomolez
	U.S. and Europe take aim at Russian central bank reserves, threatening blow to economy https://www.washingtonpost.com/busin...k-white-house/ Missed that yesterday. I think this is all good and needs to happen. I am getting a bit worried though that we are headed straight towards nuclear blackmail if/when Putin feels cornered. And I don't know I want to bet on Russian top military turning on Putin if we get to worst case.

I think, risks of nuclear attacks already counted

komsomolez · #**3148** 27.02.2022, 12:57

	Quote:	vladest
	I think, risks of nuclear attacks already counted

What does that mean?

vladest · #**3149** 27.02.2022, 13:09

RU propagandon Soloviev: "What I did? What I did?"

How does this work?

vladest · #**3150** 27.02.2022, 13:11

	Quote:	komsomolez
	What does that mean?

its just my speculations but i think biden and co will never go further if they was sure that there is nuclear threat

Axa · #**3151** 27.02.2022, 13:16

	Quote:	kiwiguy08
	Russia hasn’t captured Kiev in 3 days and now Ukraine is winning the war and can dictate the terms of surrender….. Last saturday we were pandemic experts, now we’re all military experts

There are things beyond the military. Found about these local experts earlier today. I had no idea about the religion politics between Ukraine and Russia. I thought schism was a word you only find in museums, e.g. year 1054 Schism, and not in "2018 Orthodox Church Schism". I still don't grasp the whole topic but Ukraine got an autonomous church independent from Russian church which is a symbol of political independence....guess who didn't like this: V. Putin. https://css.ethz.ch/en/publications/...rthodox_church

It's totally true that we ignore a lot of things east of Austria and I guess this goes beyond NATO. This is an issue people literally die for :/

	Quote:
	An average Westerner may well have overlooked the potentially seismic geopolitical event of 6 January 2019. On that snowy Sunday – Epiphany in western Christianity; Christmas Eve in Ukraine – the 39-year-old Metropolitan of Kyiv, Epiphanius, received tomos from the Constantinople Patriarchate. This document bestowed autocephalous (self-governing) status on what was now the newly formed Orthodox Church of Ukraine. The event was historic not just for Ukraine, but for Russia and the whole Orthodox world too. For Ukrainians, autocephaly was a sign of their country moving towards greater independence from Russia, now in matters clerical as well as earthly. For a country still stuck in a slow-moving war with Russia, this was no small matter. Nor was it a small matter for Russia. Just under one-third of the Russian Orthodox Church’s 36,000 parishes are to be found in Ukraine, and their status is now in question. The Russian Orthodox Church is set to lose territory, believers, and a huge amount of symbolic power.

https://ecfr.eu/publication/defender...eatens_russia/

vladest · #**3152** 27.02.2022, 13:21

	Quote:	Axa
	There are things beyond the military. Found about these local experts earlier today. I had no idea about the religion politics between Ukraine and Russia. I thought schism was a word you only find in museums, e.g. year 1054 Schism, and not in "2018 Orthodox Church Schism". I still don't grasp the whole topic but Ukraine got an autonomous church independent from Russian church which is a symbol of political independence....guess who didn't like this: V. Putin. https://css.ethz.ch/en/publications/...rthodox_church It's totally true that we ignore a lot of things east of Austria and I guess this goes beyond NATO. This is an issue people literally die for :/ https://ecfr.eu/publication/defender...eatens_russia/

same as with Nato: its not up to russia to decide which churches ua have to have

Buenzli · #**3153** 27.02.2022, 13:29

	Quote:	vladest
	its just my speculations but i think biden and co will never go further if they was sure that there is nuclear threat

They could nuke Bank for International Settlements... Err, wait...

Axa · #**3154** 27.02.2022, 13:32

	Quote:	Buenzli
	They could nuke Bank for International Settlements... Err, wait...

SWIFT is located in Wallonia, south of Brussels

komsomolez · #**3155** 27.02.2022, 13:38

	Quote:	vladest
	its just my speculations but i think biden and co will never go further if they was sure that there is nuclear threat

They will certainly assess the risk of nuclear escalation. And it will not be assessed at zero, you are right.

What I meant is not an unannounced launch, but rather the likelihood of Russia - when cornered - saying "you calm down now or all cards are on the table", combined with a raising of the alert levels of the nuclear forces. Like the US did in Yom Kippur.

I admit I laughed at this risk a week ago. The bizarre thing is that the better UA is doing in its fight, the higher the escalation risk becomes. This is based on the assumption that Putin is not the type to cut his losses. If he is, then this becomes much better.

komsomolez · #**3156** 27.02.2022, 13:48

Looks like EU airspace will be completely closed for Russian planes shortly. Which means Russia will do the same for all EU planes.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-60539303

gaburko · #**3157** 27.02.2022, 13:52

	Quote:	Axa
	I had no idea about the religion politics between Ukraine and Russia. I thought schism was a word you only find in museums, e.g. year 1054 Schism

It's not a "schism" as in the Catholic vs. Orthodox sense as in the Orthodox world there is no schism per se. Catholics have one Pope, Orthodox have many Patriarchs. The "battle" for an independent Ukrainian church was politicized by Moscow in order to rally popular support among the Russians as in "look, our brothers are stabbing us in the back! We must bring them back!". There's absolutely no drama as today there are I think 15 Patriarchs all over the world and the Kiev one was recognized by the "first among equals" Patriarch of Constantinople as a legitimate one and the Ukrainian church as an independent one.

bowlie · #**3158** 27.02.2022, 13:53

From Press reports Putin is proposing ‘peace talks’ to be held in Belarus. Obviously Ukraine won’t accept that venue as Belarus is supporting the Russian invasion and has suggested either Kazakistan or Turkey.

Certainly doesn’t suggest Putin is confident of victory. But then again …

TinyK · #**3159** 27.02.2022, 13:57

My father and his neighbours built barricades, made Molotov's cocktails and are ready to welcome the Russian tanks.

greenmount · #**3160** 27.02.2022, 14:15

	Quote:	TinyK
	My father and his neighbours built barricades, made Molotov's cocktails and are ready to welcome the Russian tanks.

Heart breaking, TinyK, I don't even have the right words to encourage you. There's literally nothing more to say.

It's absurd and Putin and his clique should pay for all of these.

I watch the news and grow increasingly angry and frustrated. Kids dragging their little suitcases over the border with UA and mothers crying and saying they told their husbands they will see each other again? Old people who stayed behind? I can't. What literally breaks my heart is watching the children, some of them still not understanding what is going on, other crying they left daddy. It is hard to say anything these days, just cry with them.