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30.03.2022, 07:18
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Putin's Bombers Could Devastate Ukraine But He's Holding Back. Here's Why https://www.newsweek.com/putins-bomb...es-why-1690494 Asdestructive as the Ukraine war is, Russia is causing less damage and killing fewer civilians than it could, U.S. intelligence experts say.
"I know that the news keeps repeating that Putin is targeting civilians, but there is no evidence that Russia is intentionally doing so," says the DIA analyst. "In fact, I'd say that Russian could be killing thousands more civilians if it wanted to."
didn't i get banned for suggesting this?  | | | | | No, you got banned for basically doing the Kremilins job for them on this forum. It's just obvious you are engaging in a pro-Russian agenda, selectively posting articles that paint them in the best light possible to distract from their ongoing and horrific atrocities. I'll just keep giving you red blobs whenever I see these posts.
Last edited by Chuff; 30.03.2022 at 07:31.
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30.03.2022, 07:53
| Banned | | Join Date: May 2021 Location: transcended.
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | No, you got banned for basically doing the Kremilins job for them on this forum. It's just obvious you are engaging in a pro-Russian agenda, selectively posting articles that paint them in the best light possible to distract from their ongoing and horrific atrocities. I'll just keep giving you red blobs whenever I see these posts.  | | | | | if you only interested in hearing one side of the story that's fine. but if that is EFs policy then they should make that clear rather than banning people for posting opposing opinions.
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30.03.2022, 08:00
|  | Forum Legend | | Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Lummerland
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | if you only interested in hearing one side of the story that's fine. but if that is EFs policy then they should make that clear rather than banning people for posting opposing opinions. | | | | | Have an opinion that runs against the mainstream narrative or anything that runs against Chuffys god given insights will see you groaned at or banned.
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30.03.2022, 08:03
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Have an opinion that runs against the mainstream narrative or anything that runs against Chuffys god given insights will see you groaned at or banned. | | | | | Let's see, the "mainstream narrative" is like that: Russia invaded Ukraine under false pretexts and is now erasing cities, killing civilians and sending millions of people abroad, in many cases just with some plastic bags in which they keep a few things they managed to save in the last moment.
What's the alternative view or uhem, the other side of the story of this? I tell you what it is: lies, lies and more lies coming from Russia's side.
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30.03.2022, 08:10
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Putin's Bombers Could Devastate Ukraine But He's Holding Back. Here's Why https://www.newsweek.com/putins-bomb...es-why-1690494 Asdestructive as the Ukraine war is, Russia is causing less damage and killing fewer civilians than it could, U.S. intelligence experts say.
"I know that the news keeps repeating that Putin is targeting civilians, but there is no evidence that Russia is intentionally doing so," says the DIA analyst. "In fact, I'd say that Russian could be killing thousands more civilians if it wanted to."
didn't i get banned for suggesting this?  | | | | | So this article basically says, that it could be worse, but Putin is afraid of NATO intervention, so he "restrains himself".
So if world would be silent, probably we would have tens of thousands killed civilians already.
Good. He should be afraid. That's the only way you can effectively negotiate with that thug.
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30.03.2022, 08:22
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Let's see, the "mainstream narrative" is like that: Russia invaded Ukraine under false pretexts and is now erasing cities, killing civilians and sending millions of people abroad, in many cases just with some plastic bags in which they keep a few things they managed to save in the last moment.
What's the alternative view or uhem, the other side of the story of this? I tell you what it is: lies, lies and more lies coming from Russia's side. | | | | | alternative view: how dare ukraininas defending itself?? we are peaceful invaders aiming only to military targets but since they are responding back, we have to kill, rape, torture civilians and this is veeery sad for us. so sad that we are crying every day
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30.03.2022, 08:48
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Have an opinion that runs against the mainstream narrative or anything that runs against Chuffys god given insights will see you groaned at or banned. | | | | | slammer, this talk of "mainstream narrative", despite the overwhelming evidence of what is happening in Ukraine, is not the sign of a logical or rational guy, it's generally a sign of someone who is impressionable and/or disenfranchised and vulnerable to conspiracies and right-wing propaganda.
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30.03.2022, 08:54
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Putin's Bombers Could Devastate Ukraine But He's Holding Back. Here's Why https://www.newsweek.com/putins-bomb...es-why-1690494 Asdestructive as the Ukraine war is, Russia is causing less damage and killing fewer civilians than it could, U.S. intelligence experts say.
"I know that the news keeps repeating that Putin is targeting civilians, but there is no evidence that Russia is intentionally doing so," says the DIA analyst. "In fact, I'd say that Russian could be killing thousands more civilians if it wanted to."
didn't i get banned for suggesting this?  | | | | | Now do the Mariupol theater.
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30.03.2022, 08:56
|  | Forum Legend | | Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Lummerland
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | slammer, this talk of "mainstream narrative", despite the overwhelming evidence of what is happening in Ukraine, is not the sign of a logical or rational guy, it's a sign of someone who is impressionable and vulnerable to conspiracies and right-wing propaganda. | | | | | You are too focused on Ukraine, think in broader terms, take „Mainstream narrative“ as generic.
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30.03.2022, 08:58
| Member | | Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Zurich Witikon
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Let's see, the "mainstream narrative" is like that: Russia invaded Ukraine under false pretexts and is now erasing cities, killing civilians and sending millions of people abroad, in many cases just with some plastic bags in which they keep a few things they managed to save in the last moment.
What's the alternative view or uhem, the other side of the story of this? I tell you what it is: lies, lies and more lies coming from Russia's side. | | | | |
It's very easy for the ones who want to read.
Ukraine has been used as a proxy in the cold war against Russia since the separation in the 90th. There are lots of proof on Internet, including videos and voice recordinds
In 2014, the hot phase began with Maidan taken over by pro-american puppet "government" that was promoting and supporting the nationalist ideology and justification of fascism. The areas that have not accepted that, have been bombed for 8 years. Despite neutral non-block status signed by all ex-USSR countries at separation, Ukraine intended to join NATO and started placing US bio labs and NATO training bases on it's territory. Finally, Ukraine announced the start on nuclear weapon program, and began preparation for ground operation on the separated territories.
Since this was a direct threat not only to the eastern regions of Ukraine, but also to Russia, Russia launched an operation to denationalize and demilitarize Ukraine.
I'm not going to discuss these facts. They've been repeated and proven many times.
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30.03.2022, 09:07
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | It's very easy for the ones who want to read.
Ukraine has been used as a proxy in the cold war against Russia since the separation in the 90th. There are lots of proof on Internet, including videos and voice recordinds
In 2014, the hot phase began with Maidan taken over by pro-american puppet "government" that was promoting and supporting the nationalist ideology and justification of fascism. The areas that have not accepted that, have been bombed for 8 years. Despite neutral non-block status signed by all ex-USSR countries at separation, Ukraine intended to join NATO and started placing US bio labs and NATO training bases on it's territory. Finally, Ukraine announced the start on nuclear weapon program, and began preparation for ground operation on the separated territories.
Since this was a direct threat not only to the eastern regions of Ukraine, but also to Russia, Russia launched an operation to denationalize and demilitarize Ukraine.
I'm not going to discuss these facts. They've been repeated and proven many times. | | | | | Come on, admit it. You were pissing your pants laughing when writing this.
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30.03.2022, 09:08
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | You are too focused on Ukraine, think in broader terms, take „Mainstream narrative“ as generic. | | | | | Instead of regurgitating right-wing talking points and catchphrases that you read on certain alternative websites, try articulating things clearly so that we really do understand what you mean by "mainstream narrative". If you are feeling daring, please even provide some links where we can read these things for ourselves.
Otherwise, pseudo-intellectual phrases like "mainstream narrative" are commonly thrown around by conspiracy theorists or people that feel that have somehow managed to find the truth that everyone else is missing.
If you are simply talking about the US and the EU using this war to also engage in some geopolitics and to weaken Russia as a majhor threat and rival that has existed since the second world war then yeah.... of course they are doing that and so would you or I in the same position. In fact, Russia has done most of the hard work on that itself by acting so abominably that the condemnation is now truly global and the impact will last for decades. Talk about shooting yourself in the foot. | Quote: | |  | | | It's very easy for the ones who want to read.
I'm not going to discuss these facts. They've been repeated and proven many times. | | | | | Also extremely common and stereotypical statements from conspiracy theorists engaging in pseudo-debate. "It's obvious, I don't have to prove it to you" etc etc... same spiel every time.
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30.03.2022, 09:15
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine?
Interesting article in the Spectator on how sanctions against Russia are not biting as much anymore. China and India taking up the slack, I think it would help if certain EU countries would stop buying Russian fossil fuels.
Also explains PhilMCR's eagerness to buy
The rouble’s astonishing recovery | Quote: |  | | | The tank columns are stalled; one or two towns captured from the Ukrainians have been retaken. Russia’s war effort has been going nowhere fast for the past fortnight – unless you count the constant pounding and destruction of apartment blocks a form of progress.
But then is the economic war being waged against Russia making any greater progress? True, Muscovites can no longer get a Big Mac, and western-made luxury goods have disappeared from the shelves. Yet look at the dollar’s march against the rouble and it is starting to look like a convoy of Russian armoured vehicles. For the first few days, the rouble sank inexorably as sanctions kicked in. On the day before Putin marched in on Ukraine, a rouble was worth $0.012. By 8 March it had plummeted by nearly half, to $0.007. But then? The rouble has steadily advanced back almost to where it was before the invasion.
The Russian stock market has not quite enjoyed the same bounce. But since it partially reopened last week it, too, has risen sharply. The Moscow Exchange index stood at 3,646 on 16 February. It plunged by nearly half on the morning of 24 February, reaching 1,943. Yet this morning it stands at 2,377. For anyone brave enough to invest at the bottom – and prepared to overlook the ethical issues – Russian stocks have been one of the best investments around over the past week. That is remarkable given the increasingly obvious signs that the war is not going well, and that Russia could find itself sunk into a quagmire for many years.
But it does show how difficult it is for the West to isolate and bring down an opponent’s economy – if this is going to be the new reality of international conflict. We have over-estimated our own economic power. Much as we might like to think that wealthy Russians find our luxury goods indispensable, it is energy that drives the Russian economy. And that is a rather good business to be in at the moment. We may be buying less oil from Russia, but we are still forced to buy its gas. Moreover, there are two very large markets for US gas and oil which are not trying to boycott Russian fossil fuels. Rather, China and India are taking advantage of the discounts being offered.
Since the invasion, India has signed contracts to buy six million barrels of oil from Russia – half as much as it bought during the whole of 2021. Why? Because Russian oil is going at a discount of around $30 a barrel. Between them, India and China could easily mop up any oil which the West refuses to buy from Russia – and if those countries decide that they don’t want to join the boycott there is nothing we can do about it.
Never before has the West attempted to respond to military aggression entirely by economic means. There are plenty of questions that need to be asked about the wisdom of doing so. Would we really want to reduce ordinary Russians to penury – if we could – knowing that it could boost their support for Putin? Putin, after all, has created a narrative that Russia is under attack from the West – and he will be able to cite any privations visited on Russians as evidence of that.
But there is the more immediate question of whether it can work in any case. The West, so far, has managed to bolster Ukraine’s defences by sending arms to the country. That has been a success. Economic sanctions, while initially seemed to hurt Russia, are working much less obviously now. | | | | | Source https://www.spectator.co.uk/article/...ctions-failed- https://www.datawrapper.de/_/d7cSy/ | The following 4 users would like to thank TonyClifton for this useful post: | | 
30.03.2022, 09:16
| Banned | | Join Date: May 2021 Location: transcended.
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | if you only interested in hearing one side of the story that's fine. but if that is EFs policy then they should make that clear rather than banning people for posting opposing opinions. | | | | | i was also banned for (correctly) stating that ukraine has a neo-nazi unit in their military.
maybe one of the mods could clarify EFs position?
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30.03.2022, 09:19
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | In 2014, the hot phase began with Maidan taken over by pro-american puppet "government" that was promoting and supporting the nationalist ideology and justification of fascism. The areas that have not accepted that, have been bombed for 8 years. Despite neutral non-block status signed by all ex-USSR countries at separation, Ukraine intended to join NATO and started placing US bio labs and NATO training bases on it's territory. Finally, Ukraine announced the start on nuclear weapon program, and began preparation for ground operation on the separated territories.
Since this was a direct threat not only to the eastern regions of Ukraine, but also to Russia, Russia launched an operation to denationalize and demilitarize Ukraine.
I'm not going to discuss these facts. They've been repeated and proven many times. | | | | | Russia had promoted the narrative that Ukrainians aren't a separate nation for a very, very long time and they saw Ukrainian identity movements as something threatening to their narrative and their state. I think those who supported the nationalist ideology are the Russians here, let's get this clear once and for all.
Those areas with the majority of inhabitants being ethnic Russians (I suppose) wanted to separate from the current territory of Ukraine and frankly Ukraine could not have allowed this. These regions and their separatism were supported by Russia but if they were the reason for the Russian invasion then the Russian army would have stayed there and would have tried to conquer that area not Kyiv or Mariupol.
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30.03.2022, 09:23
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | i was also banned for (correctly) stating that ukraine has a neo-nazi unit in their military. | | | | | I highly doubt that this is the sole reason you were banned and I am sure you also know that. The roots of the Azov regiment are a matter of public knowledge and well documented.
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30.03.2022, 09:33
| Member | | Join Date: Sep 2016 Location: Zurich Witikon
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | I think those who supported the nationalist ideology are the Russians here, let's get this clear once and for all. | | | | | You think so, and let's get it clear for all ))
No comments needed. | Quote: | |  | | | Those areas with the majority of inhabitants being ethnic Russians (I suppose) wanted to separate from the current territory of Ukraine and Ukraine could not allow this. | | | | | Yes, that's why Ukraine signed Minsk 1 and 2 to to solve the problem peacefully.
Who violated this agreement? | Quote: | |  | | | These regions and their separatism were supported by Russia but if they were the reason for the Russian invasion then the army would have stayed there and tried to conquer that are not Kyiv or Mariupol. | | | | | You mixed up the sequence. At first, Ukraine violated its obligations and kept bombing civilians, and only then Russia began to support compatriots abroad.
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30.03.2022, 09:48
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | You think so, and let's get it clear for all ))
No comments needed. | | | | | Not only me but also the majority of rational people, if that helps you with accepting this fact.
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30.03.2022, 09:56
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | ... rather than banning people for posting opposing opinions. | | | | | Doesn't happen. If you post fake news, propaganda or troll - then you'll get banned. But never for having a different opinion. | Quote: | |  | | | i was also banned for (correctly) stating that ukraine has a neo-nazi unit in their military. maybe one of the mods could clarify EFs position? | | | | | Sure. That wasn't the reason. As Chuff has eloquently pointed out. Now there is a "forum support" subforum where you can complain about moderation. Maybe add to one of the existing threads... But otherwise, please stay on topic.
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30.03.2022, 10:00
|  | Forum Legend | | Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: SZ
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Interesting article in the Spectator on how sanctions against Russia are not biting as much anymore. China and India taking up the slack, I think it would help if certain EU countries would stop buying Russian fossil fuels.
Also explains PhilMCR's eagerness to buy 
The rouble’s astonishing recovery
| | | | | Not very surprising. The CBR forces a lot of Ruble payments and therefore dollar sales and of course there is a certain rebound effect on the stock market when the first panic subsides.
Seeing the capital outflow (also in China, interestingly), total stop of foreign investment, hopefully lasting sanctions and so many companies leaving Russia for good - I have no doubt that the Russian economy will need decades to recover from this idiotic decision.
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