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05.04.2022, 22:49
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | So what Vushka refers to here, apparently, are horror stories of German soldiers bayoneting babies in Belgium, WW1. Stories that were made up in order to demonize the enemy. http://historymatters.gmu.edu/d/6648/
In other words, Vushka denies that what happened in Bucha were Russian atrocities, but staged scenes by the Ukronazis.
Do I have this right, Vushka? | | | | | Not to forget England apologized for it
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05.04.2022, 22:54
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Source, proof, please. | | | | |
The images aren't a proof either.
Even if made from different satellites, in series with minute time resolution, and tamper-proof satellite logs. I can guarantee that those will be never presented. The lack of proof is a proof by itself.
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05.04.2022, 22:58
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | The images aren't a proof either.
Even if made from different satellites, in series with minute time resolution, and tamper-proof satellite logs. I can guarantee that those will be never presented. The lack of proof is a proof by itself. | | | | | Your guarantees are worthless. | The following 3 users would like to thank marton for this useful post: | | 
05.04.2022, 22:59
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | You seem to miss one point here. We've seen that Russia lies repeatedly without any remorse or blinking an eye.
They even contradicted their own narrative, latest example:
- Putin saying they will be greeted with flowers
- Later saying that everything is going according to plan and publishing a | | | | |
So, Russia highly likely to lie here 
And the West never lies.
Can you please quote where Putin said the army will be greeted with flowers?
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05.04.2022, 23:03
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | So, Russia highly likely to lie here 
And the West never lies.
Can you please quote where Putin said the army will be greeted with flowers? | | | | | Instead of gaslighting, can you just tell us who do you believe the perpetrators of the Bucha killings are?
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05.04.2022, 23:33
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | wikipedia and others describe them as a neo-nazi group.. | | | | | And the Nazis called the Russian "Untermenschen " So true | 
05.04.2022, 23:54
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine?
" Czech Republic sends tanks, infantry fighting vehicles to Ukraine".
Makes sense to utilise them now instead of waiting for the Russians to arrive at the border.
" Video shows Ukrainian Stugna-P anti-tank guided missile shooting down Russian Kamov Ka-52 attack helicopter".
Very impressive, I knew it was possible to do this in principle but it is very difficult to achieve in practice.
Extremely cost effective; $20K missile versus a $15/20M helicopter.
Because of the high price, it is believed the Russians had less than 100 Ka-52s in their fleet at the start of the war.
Despite the very high tech capabilities with anti radar and other electronic jamming features of this helicopter it is claimed they are vulnerable to the very old fashioned shoulder held heat seeking missiles.
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06.04.2022, 08:24
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Instead of gaslighting, can you just tell us who do you believe the perpetrators of the Bucha killings are? | | | | | I prefer not to guess, but to wait for the results of an independent investigation. If such an investigation is not carried out, the refusal to conduct it will unequivocally indicate that this is a fake (since there is already a lot of indirect evidence), and who killed the non-combatants.
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06.04.2022, 08:30
| Forum Legend | | Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Kt.Zh
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | So, Russia highly likely to lie here 
And the West never lies.
Can you please quote where Putin said the army will be greeted with flowers? | | | | | Oh no, they admitted their intel wasn't that good in Irak.  When will Russia admit....anything? Anything at all? I thought so.
Whatever US officials said it's gonna happen in this war, it happened. Russia did attack and did invade Ukraine. I remember nobody believed till it happened. To begin with. | Quote: | |  | | | I prefer not to guess, but to wait for the results of an independent investigation. If such an investigation is not carried out, the refusal to conduct it will unequivocally indicate that this is a fake (since there is already a lot of indirect evidence), and who killed the non-combatants. | | | | | Ukrainians killed each other then? Is that what you're guessing here? Who killed those civilians and to which end? Have you watched the films with the locals of Bucha?
I hope you are a troll, frankly I don't know how to react to such statements.
Last edited by greenmount; 06.04.2022 at 08:44.
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06.04.2022, 08:40
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | I prefer not to guess, but to wait for the results of an independent investigation. If such an investigation is not carried out, the refusal to conduct it will unequivocally indicate that this is a fake (since there is already a lot of indirect evidence), and who killed the non-combatants. | | | | | Of course there will be an investigation.
When someone goes on trial as a war criminal, there has to be some evidence to be put forward at the trial.
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06.04.2022, 08:46
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | "[
"Video shows Ukrainian Stugna-P anti-tank guided missile shooting down Russian Kamov Ka-52 attack helicopter".
Very impressive, I knew it was possible to do this in principle but it is very difficult to achieve in practice.
| | | | | There are verified reports of German tanks, (or a tank) taking down Russian aircraft with the main gun during WW2, a difficult and lucky shot indeed, even if it is a bit overkill.
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06.04.2022, 08:49
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Your guarantees are worthless.  | | | | | In this context "guarantee" means closing one's eyes to what's going one, sticking one's fingers in one's ear and singing la-la-la I can't hear you.
Some people simply won't accept any evidence. Even if it goes to trial and is thoroughly investigated - it'll just be further evidence of corruption of the West and their hatred of Russia.
This is the nature of the True Believer.
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06.04.2022, 08:53
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | I prefer not to guess, but to wait for the results of an independent investigation. If such an investigation is not carried out, the refusal to conduct it will unequivocally indicate that this is a fake (since there is already a lot of indirect evidence), and who killed the non-combatants. | | | | | A masterful response. The only thing you could have added is something like "We should also ask ourselves who benefits from claiming that Russian personnel are the perpetrators of this heinous crime".
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06.04.2022, 09:00
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | When will Russia admit....anything? Anything at all? | | | | | Like what? Poisoning Skripals? Shutting the Boeing?
Remember, independent investigation was denied there, too. | Quote: | |  | | | Whatever US officials said it's gonna happen in this war, it happened. Russia did attack and did invade Ukraine. I remember nobody believed till it happened. To begin with. | | | | | Russia acknowledged this, didn't it? | Quote: | |  | | |
Ukrainians killed each other then? Is that what you're guessing here? Who killed those civilians and to which end? Have you watched the films with the locals of Bucha?
| | | | | This is a fact repeatedly confirmed by international organizations that the Ukrainian army and irregular armed groups systematically killed civilian compatriots for many years. Nevertheless, I'll keep my guesses to myself. | Quote: | |  | | | I hope you are a troll, frankly I don't know how to react to such statements. | | | | | Easy. Turn the logic on.
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06.04.2022, 09:01
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | A masterful response. The only thing you could have added is something like "We should also ask ourselves who benefits from claiming that Russian personnel are the perpetrators of this heinous crime". | | | | | Thank you. I thought it's obvious.
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06.04.2022, 09:13
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | This is a fact repeatedly confirmed by international organizations that the Ukrainian army and irregular armed groups systematically killed civilian compatriots for many years. Nevertheless, I'll keep my guesses to myself.
. | | | | | ....... | Quote: | |  | | | Easy. Turn the logic on. | | | | | Yeah, you are a troll.
No further questions.
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06.04.2022, 09:16
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | Yeah, you are a troll.
No further questions. | | | | |
"A masterful response." (C) 
How about answers?
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06.04.2022, 09:20
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | "A masterful response." (C) 
How about answers? | | | | | What can be answered to blatant lies?
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06.04.2022, 09:26
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | I prefer not to guess, but to wait for the results of an independent investigation. If such an investigation is not carried out, the refusal to conduct it will unequivocally indicate that this is a fake (since there is already a lot of indirect evidence), and who killed the non-combatants. | | | | | Why don't you share this independent evidence with us?
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06.04.2022, 09:30
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| | Re: World War 3 or just a local spat in Ukraine? | Quote: | |  | | | In this context "guarantee" means closing one's eyes to what's going one, sticking one's fingers in one's ear and singing la-la-la I can't hear you.
Some people simply won't accept any evidence. Even if it goes to trial and is thoroughly investigated - it'll just be further evidence of corruption of the West and their hatred of Russia.
This is the nature of the True Believer. | | | | | I don't think he or she's a true believer. The problem with propagating even the biggest lies is that they do sow seeds of doubt.. They release a lie and nobody bothers to check facts and on and on it goes around.
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