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View Poll Results: Would you favour Scotland opting for indepence from UK
YES........ go for it 31 50.00%
NO.......... hang on for dear life 31 50.00%
Voters: 62. You may not vote on this poll

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  #201  
Old 27.08.2014, 14:48
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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No offence Sbrinz, but maybe you should have declared your allegiance at the start.
Why what difference would that make?
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  #202  
Old 27.08.2014, 14:55
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

The NO camp here are sounding increasingly like the naysayers against the first efforts at rail travel.

Don't go more than 10mph or you will suffocate, don't even think about it.
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  #203  
Old 27.08.2014, 15:01
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

I think the yes people are a bit deluded as to how much 'wealth' the oil actually brings, you see the black gold and the money it fetches and think its all 'yours' but conveniently forget all the things you get from being part of the UK.

as an outsider (I couldn't care either way) it really looks like a case of the goose that lays the golden egg, you want the cake and to eat it too.
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  #204  
Old 27.08.2014, 15:15
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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The NO camp here are sounding increasingly like the naysayers against the first efforts at rail travel.

Don't go more than 10mph or you will suffocate, don't even think about it.
Or let's get it right before we screw up a (in your words) a wealthy and vibrant country.
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  #205  
Old 27.08.2014, 15:32
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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Well because I don't really see it as a gamble, or maybe I see it as less of a gamble than staying in the UK. What people fail to see is that this is a movement that's grown over some time, it's not just some opportunistic stab at it, and now it looks like we have approximately half of the population agreeing on this, whether it turns out to be more than half or less than half will be seen on September 18th.

It's about many things over a long period of time - had Thatcher given a thought to the post-industrial landscape when she de-indistrialised, had Tony Blair been a bit more leftist with his massive majority or had he not attacked Iraq, we might not be here having this discussion; likewise had Nick Clegg stuck it out and demanded a fairer, more representative electoral system in 2010 (something we've had in Scotland since 99) and pushed for their idea of a more federal UK, we might not be here having this discussion. As it is, any reforming ideas in the UK are dead before they even start, but here we have this huge chance to start again, and with a more localised government, elected on a fairer system, which the people can have much more of an influence on.

The question is why would I take the risk of staying in the UK?

Firstly the UK is one of the more stable countries in Europe and one of the few that is showing real signs of continued recovery...there is a LOW risk there.

Secondly, what you are saying is that voting YES for Scottish independence is the ultimate protest vote against UK politics. That is madness and a real gamble, and if you cant see that perhaps being in Zurich is masking your romantic ideas.

I think we would all support a move for Scotland's independence or greater autonomy provided it is done properly in a well thought out fashion. In short in a way that would benefit the country and its people. This is not what is happening.....it is all being left to tomorrow, but tomorrow is upon you and still you don't have a plan for money, defence, social services, business and on, and on. This is not a game.

Salmond is trying to convince everyone (you included) that he is the only person who knows what is best for Scotland and that everyone else is wrong. There have been other leaders in history who have made similar claims and they have all been proven to be wrong in the end (maybe Ghandi could be excused, but he never boasted). Bottom line, he has not convinced me that he is capable of establishing an independent nation and running it....over the past 2 years he has set out to be at loggerheads with the closest ally that Scotland has and needs - the UK....if he cant get that part right, what hope is there?
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  #206  
Old 27.08.2014, 15:48
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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Why what difference would that make?
I think it is quite clear.

It would be like me trying to join in a debate on Basque independence - sure I might have an outsider's idea of what is going on, but I think it would be difficult for me to claim that I have the insight or experience of someone who lives there or has lived there, or has been brought up in the culture.
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  #207  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:00
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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I think it is quite clear.

It would be like me trying to join in a debate on Basque independence - sure I might have an outsider's idea of what is going on, but I think it would be difficult for me to claim that I have the insight or experience of someone who lives there or has lived there, or has been brought up in the culture.
What utter bollocks. The English have every right to have their opinion heard.

After that selfish comment I'm definitely out of this.

Salmond really has worked his magic on you.
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  #208  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:03
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

Its a nice idea, but how would it work??

no currency, no eu membership, no army, no dhss, state pensions, debt repayment, costs a lot of cash to run a country.

then you have businesses, all those trade agreements that are no longer valid.

Banks - what would happen here, split from the uk, regulation etc etc

boarders

navel bases

imports

bet the icelandic fishing fleet is praying for a yes

No one has given a credible answer to any of this, we'll just use the pound! oh really, a currency you don't control, good luck setting interest rates, ok we'll use the Euro, except they have already said no go, A N Other currency??

and what if the price of oil tanks???

And of course the all giving oil, you really think westminster will just roll over and give you the oil fields?? the boundries will be chosen that best suits them not you, and there isn't a thing you can do about it (no army see) go off crying to brussels, ah, you can't you're not in the EU

salmond is an idiot, he's out for whats best for him, not scotland. I'd bet privately he doesn't want yes to win, he just wants to keep riding the gravy boat
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  #209  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:11
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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What utter bollocks. The English have every right to have their opinion heard.

After that selfish comment I'm definitely out of this.

Salmond really has worked his magic on you.
Another unfounded nasty comment. Seems to be a staple on here.

Yet another NO campaigner running out of arguments and spitting the dummy.
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  #210  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:15
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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Noise
I'm sorry BB, but that post is so full of inaccuracies, that have already been previously answered in this thread, and most were even covered in the last televised debate.

Again, it is fine to be against it for valid reasons, and that we can discuss, but writing lines and lines of misinformation isn't helpful for the debate.
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  #211  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:17
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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Another unfounded nasty comment. Seems to be a staple on here.

Yet another NO campaigner running out of arguments and spitting the dummy.

I don't think the no's have run out of arguments, they where never given anything to argue against, vote yes because I say so and everything will be great isn't really something you can argue with. and therein lies the problem.

The oil is ours, look at norway's sovereign wealth fund seems to be the only point given
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  #212  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:18
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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I'm sorry BB, but that post is so full of inaccuracies, that have already been previously answered in this thread, and most were even covered in the last televised debate.

Again, it is fine to be against it for valid reasons, and that we can discuss, but writing lines and lines of misinformation isn't helpful for the debate.

I watched part of the last debate, and no info was given, lots of shouting and accusing a labour mp of being a tory, and lots of "I have 3 plan b's"
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  #213  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:28
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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I'm sorry BB, but that post is so full of inaccuracies, that have already been previously answered in this thread, and most were even covered in the last televised debate.

Again, it is fine to be against it for valid reasons, and that we can discuss, but writing lines and lines of misinformation isn't helpful for the debate.

as I said, I don't care either way, but I've not heard or read a single credible reason why they should split. salmond doesn't seem to have a plan, if he can't even explain what currency he's going to use then alarm bells really should be ringing to all the scottish voters.

Just for info my brother lives in Glasgow, I've worked in perth and edinburgh.
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  #214  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:29
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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Another unfounded nasty comment. Seems to be a staple on here.

Yet another NO campaigner running out of arguments and spitting the dummy.
This is not an argument either! Instead of name calling and telling us we are simply all wrong and our politics stink....why not explain to us HOW Scotland will function after independence? Lets start with a simple one....what currency will you use and who will control it in terms of inflation and interest rates? I don't want to overburden the questions yet, so lets go 1 at a time.

If you don't like that question, what about national security given the current global threats? Who is going to defend Scotland? Where will your counter terrorist unit come from? You national intelligence capability?

I could go on, as we all have been doing, but with only a matter of weeks to go, these questions are unanswered and in return we simply get ridiculed for caring about Scotland!!
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  #215  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:42
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

I also find it quite funny that the scots bitch about england when the last 2 prime ministers have been scottish
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  #216  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:43
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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I also find it quite funny that the scots bitch about england when the last 2 prime ministers have been scottish
And Cameron is a very English name, is it not?
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  #217  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:47
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

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And Cameron is a very English name, is it not?

true, but he was born and raised in england
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  #218  
Old 27.08.2014, 16:58
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

Thinking on a practical level (and a very selfish one too ) all those Gov IT systems that cost billions, scotland would be relying on westminster to hand over all the data, in a format they can use. and of course scotland would need to buy all the licenses, hardware, software, expertise to get these systems up an running, we're talking billions of pounds, or hundreds of billions of scottish thistles (the new currency)

dvla
health
dhss
job center
smmt
tax
police

etc etc

all these IT systems separated, the contract possibilities are endless, can someone point me to the scottish immigration dept, need to make sure I have the correct visa must be paid in euro's of gbp though
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  #219  
Old 27.08.2014, 17:02
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

I see the poll is getting closer as the discussion continues. Does this mean the No-campaigners are winning over the electorate due to superior debating skills? .
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  #220  
Old 27.08.2014, 17:05
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Re: Voting for Scottish Independence?

it needs a few more poll options

3, dont care
4, screw em, you get the gov you deserve
5, kick em out and never let em back in
6, rebuild the wall and install oerlikon guns on it every 10 meters
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