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-   -   Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS (https://www.englishforum.ch/international-affairs-politics/226339-muslim-terrorists-get-state-jobs-free-shrinks-if-they-decide-leave-isis.html)

crazygringo 22.01.2015 23:20

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
despite decades of trying to convince myself otherwise, I remain hopelessly bearish on the concept of "rehabilitation".

Castro 22.01.2015 23:33

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
It seems like the bleeding heart Danes are also in on the act.

Guest 22.01.2015 23:51

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
By the way, I do believe in the value of the rehabilitated. The best intelligence we have on these movements, their ideologies and their inner workings have been from former members and defectors. In regards to the on-going conversations, I particularly appreciate Maajid Nawaz's contributions.

Except not everyone is rehabilitable.

marton 23.01.2015 00:29

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Castro (Post 2325437)
It seems like the bleeding heart Danes are also in on the act.

I just realised the title does not say "and free drinks" :D

greenmount 23.01.2015 01:35

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by BokerTov (Post 2325254)
Let me clarify my statement: when I say "I don't see any rehabilitation possible", I mean "I don't think that the option of rehab should even be offered to them". Of course it could work, but what entitles them to even have the option?
.............................
Also - disaffected youth my a$$. What about personal responsibility for your actions? Not that the following matters to the discussion, but I hear this too often. I wish I had the time to be disaffected back in the day, but alas, I was busy studying and working 3 jobs with the hope of defying all stereotypes and make something out of a small-village girl born in a blue-collar family. Maybe I should have said "scr** all this, I'll be an irresponsible idiot instead and then someone will bail me out at the end."

If we don't learn that actions have consequences, and we are personally responsible for our actions, what kind of message are we sending out??? :msnshock:

Some people have more rights. ;)

And yes, thinking of it: I wish I had the time to sit on my a*** and contemplate having an existential crisis ...

st2lemans 23.01.2015 09:33

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by marton (Post 2325370)
:confused:

Police in Sweden have been armed for 50 years!
The Swedish police have been armed since 1965.

Sorry, got confused with Norway. :(

Tom

CorsebouTheReturn 23.01.2015 09:50

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MidfieldGeneral (Post 2325213)
Thanks, I got your point the first time. Lets say either way you could prove that that person wasn't a murderer. Do you think he shouldnt be rehabilitated if he was sorry and showed a willingness to do so?

Well then, if the proofing method is 100% sure, then we should discuss about the meaning of "rehabilitation".

If it's just giving them a job and insert them directly in the society, discriminating others then no.

But if "rehabilitation" means: jail (or special centre which remove them from society for a while) + some education, then maybe.

Meaning that they should still be punished, with an "option" to prove their worth, and give them a conditional "opportunity".

Then that as far as "rehabilitation" goes.
And again, I repeat, those people had their entire life to educate and do better, yet they have chosen the wrong path and crossed the line.

And, to open another debate, I'd take the example of the idiots who killed Charlie's hebdo' staff and some civilians:
In France they had their entire schooling free + social money + free university and some free grants to study at university level.

So we are talking an opportunity of free education which is not existing in many other countries.
Yet, they have chosen to ignore that and become criminals.

To what extend (cost + will) should you try to "rehabilitate" those persons?

idefix 23.01.2015 10:00

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
A 1 EUR worth of 1 7.62mm bullet in the back of the head is the proper AND ONLY rehabilitation for these terrorists.

I read few weeks back that Switzerland will take away citizenship for Swiss people who join Jihad and deport them. That is actually what I proposed a month or so ago, people called me stupid.

For the rest of you who believe in "rehabilitation" and all the other jerk off BS the lefties are serving you, feel free to take all the Jihadist and put them in your communes, kindergartens, police, government bodies and let's see in 10 years how their "rehabilitation" will pan out.

But do it far away from me thanks.

Meeyat 23.01.2015 10:00

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Medea Fleecestealer (Post 2325252)

Yes. He knows what a gun is and what it does so no excuse of "oh, he's just a child". He's probably much more "grown up" than most Western children of his age.

Medea, are you serious? I mean, really, in which sense is the child on the picture much more "grown up" then our, Western, children? If you recall, in most of the civilized world the children under certain age are NOT treated as adults in front of the law, exactly because they are, well, children. It is one of the beauties of our civilization - to acknowledge that children are having their rights, they can not be prosecuted as they do not understand right from wrong and are not fully aware of the consequences, they can not vote nor work full time, they have the right to go to school, etc.

If you believe that 5 year old should be executed because he knows what a gun is, I think you seriously need help.


On another note, program in Denmark has been considered largely a success. (source - from the latest Time magazine). It works.

marton 23.01.2015 10:15

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by idefix (Post 2325563)
A 1 EUR worth of 1 7.62mm bullet in the back of the head is the proper AND ONLY rehabilitation for these terrorists.

I read few weeks back that Switzerland will take away citizenship for Swiss people who join Jihad and deport them. That is actually what I proposed a month or so ago, people called me stupid.

For the rest of you who believe in "rehabilitation" and all the other jerk off BS the lefties are serving you, feel free to take all the Jihadist and put them in your communes, kindergartens, police, government bodies and let's see in 10 years how their "rehabilitation" will pan out.

But do it far away from me thanks.

About "take away citizenship for Swiss people who join Jihad and deport them." I do not want to discuss if this is a good approach. I just wonder if this is practical? I do not see how Switzerland would persuade any other country to accept the deportation of a jihadist?
It is not like sending convicts to Australia when UK owned the country.

You can only deport people if the other country accepts them.

idefix 23.01.2015 10:23

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by marton (Post 2325576)
About "take away citizenship for Swiss people who join Jihad and deport them." I do not want to discuss if this is a good approach. I just wonder if this is practical? I do not see how Switzerland would persuade any other country to accept the deportation of a jihadist?
It is not like sending convicts to Australia when UK owned the country.

You can only deport people if the other country accepts them.

I am pretty sure the government in Syria would love to get their hands on them. :msncool:

MidfieldGeneral 23.01.2015 10:31

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by CorsebouTheReturn (Post 2325557)
Well then, if the proofing method is 100% sure, then we should discuss about the meaning of "rehabilitation".

If it's just giving them a job and insert them directly in the society, discriminating others then no.

But if "rehabilitation" means: jail (or special centre which remove them from society for a while) + some education, then maybe.

Meaning that they should still be punished, with an "option" to prove their worth, and give them a conditional "opportunity".


Then that as far as "rehabilitation" goes.
And again, I repeat, those people had their entire life to educate and do better, yet they have chosen the wrong path and crossed the line.

And, to open another debate, I'd take the example of the idiots who killed Charlie's hebdo' staff and some civilians:
In France they had their entire schooling free + social money + free university and some free grants to study at university level.

So we are talking an opportunity of free education which is not existing in many other countries.
Yet, they have chosen to ignore that and become criminals.

To what extend (cost + will) should you try to "rehabilitate" those persons?

thanks very much. my view is much what is in highlights in your post

MidfieldGeneral 23.01.2015 10:35

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by idefix (Post 2325563)

I read few weeks back that Switzerland will take away citizenship for Swiss people who join Jihad and deport them. That is actually what I proposed a month or so ago, people called me stupid.

do you have a link for the first sentence? not the second.

idefix 23.01.2015 10:41

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by MidfieldGeneral (Post 2325592)
do you have a link for the first sentence? not the second.

It was on the TV but there is already a law that can grant this

http://www.admin.ch/opc/en/classifie...208/index.html

b. Revocation

Art. 48


The Federal Office may with consent of the authority in the canton of origin revoke the Swiss, cantonal and communal citizenship of a person holding dual nationality if his or her conduct is seriously detrimental to the interests or the reputation of Switzerland.

So Syria here we come! :D Assad will be happy! :D

Corbets 23.01.2015 10:45

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Man. I thought I was something of a hardass, but some of you people have some really extremist views. Shoot 'em? Killing is the only solution? Sounds a bit jihadist, if you ask me.

Of course, it's ok when it's your extremist views. :rolleyes:

Guest 23.01.2015 10:46

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Meeyat (Post 2325564)
On another note, program in Denmark has been considered largely a success. (source - from the latest Time magazine). It works.

By whom, and what is this measure of success?


Quote:

Originally Posted by Corbets (Post 2325603)
Of course, it's ok when it's your extremist views. :rolleyes:

Which is likely where this situation is headed. Politics is a pendulum. Pulling it too far in any direction causes it to swing back just as far in the other direction.

idefix 23.01.2015 10:51

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Corbets (Post 2325603)
Man. I thought I was something of a hardass, but some of you people have some really extremist views. Shoot 'em? Killing is the only solution? Sounds a bit jihadist, if you ask me.

Of course, it's ok when it's your extremist views. :rolleyes:

So your solution is to put them in the government, commune, police etc etc? Really?!

I don't have a problem with people of any religion, color etc to be part of my society. I have a problem with brainwashed wits that kill innocent people that did absolutely nothing to them or anybody. Imagine one morning you arrive at work, just like any other day, boom, you are killed. You have a family, all your life in front of you? Why should we let such things happen?

It's not extremist to say that we need to get rid of them for good. They are people that mass murder, slaughter etc so they don't deserve for us to pay them jail nor rehabilitate them.

If you are happy to live with them by your side and rehabilitate them, fine. I certainly won't accept that.

So no, my views are not extremist, they are just REALITY.

greenmount 23.01.2015 10:51

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Corbets (Post 2325603)
Man. I thought I was something of a hardass, but some of you people have some really extremist views. Shoot 'em? Killing is the only solution? Sounds a bit jihadist, if you ask me.

Of course, it's ok when it's your extremist views. :rolleyes:

Distorting what has been said here, much? :rolleyes:

Guest 23.01.2015 10:56

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by idefix (Post 2325583)
I am pretty sure the government in Syria would love to get their hands on them. :msncool:


This actually is sensible and righteous. If someone committed a crime in Iraq or Syria, they ought to be extradited and tried where the crime was committed.

MidfieldGeneral 23.01.2015 10:57

Re: Muslim terrorists to get state jobs and free shrinks if they decide to leave ISIS
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by idefix (Post 2325598)
It was on the TV but there is already a law that can grant this

http://www.admin.ch/opc/en/classifie...208/index.html

b. Revocation

Art. 48


The Federal Office may with consent of the authority in the canton of origin revoke the Swiss, cantonal and communal citizenship of a person holding dual nationality if his or her conduct is seriously detrimental to the interests or the reputation of Switzerland.

So Syria here we come! :D Assad will be happy! :D

I missed the bit about Jihadis being deported back to Syria in your link? Was the law revised following the emergence of ISIS?

What if the citizen is Swiss born and bred, where in that link does it say that he can be deported to Syria?


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