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  #21  
Old 22.08.2015, 18:11
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

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About "has it been confirmed that the guy was a terrorist?"
The guy had a pistol, a Kalashnikov and a knife and opened fire in a railway carriage! Was the guy a terrorist? No he sounds more like a Red Cross volunteer
having an assault rifle and bring a moroccan doesnt automatically make him a terrorist. it s important to differetiate brtwrrn lone wolf whack jobs and someone who is part of an organized crime group. I wouldnt jump to conclusions till we have more info
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  #22  
Old 22.08.2015, 18:12
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

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Speaking as an armchair warrior you only have one chance to defeat such terrorists and that is when they start the action. They are not experienced and have a few seconds start up time. People who react immediately and savagely have a good chance.
After the terrorists start and are in full action it is very difficult to challenge them especially if you are unarmed.
This guy may have been....

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Mr Cazeneuve said that the gunman's identity had not been confirmed, but that he was thought to be a 26-year-old Moroccan who had been flagged up to France by the Spanish authorities as affiliated to a radical Islamist movement.
The interior minister said he had been living in Spain in 2014, and in Belgium in 2015.
Spanish newspaper El Pais named the suspect as Ayoub El-Kahzzani, and said he had fought in Syria
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  #23  
Old 22.08.2015, 18:51
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

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having an assault rifle and bring a moroccan doesnt automatically make him a terrorist. it s important to differetiate brtwrrn lone wolf whack jobs and someone who is part of an organized crime group. I wouldnt jump to conclusions till we have more info

About "having an assault rifle and bring a moroccan doesn't automatically make him a terrorist. "


Yes it does!
It is not relevant if he was a lone wolf whack job or someone who is part of an organized group and it is not relevant he was Moroccan.
Relevant is he was heavily armed and attacked people.
Definition "a person who terrorizes or frightens others."
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  #24  
Old 22.08.2015, 19:09
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

Of course in that sense you're correct: terrorists and mass shooters, or serial killers commit violent acts and thus are risks to society. And yet although differentiating between them may not be relevant for you, it sure is for law enforcement.


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About "having an assault rifle and bring a moroccan doesn't automatically make him a terrorist. "


Yes it does!
It is not relevant if he was a lone wolf whack job or someone who is part of an organized group and it is not relevant he was Moroccan.
Relevant is he was heavily armed and attacked people.
Definition "a person who terrorizes or frightens others."
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Old 22.08.2015, 20:25
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

Seen many mass murders killing random people lately?
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  #26  
Old 22.08.2015, 20:34
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

Why?
How about the Lafayette shooting last month?
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  #27  
Old 22.08.2015, 20:43
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

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Of course in that sense you're correct: terrorists and mass shooters, or serial killers commit violent acts and thus are risks to society. And yet although differentiating between them may not be relevant for you, it sure is for law enforcement.
I suspect what you are trying to say is he should not be labeled as an Islamic terrorist until the facts are in, but your bullshit PC brainwashing won't allow you to form that idea anymore.
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Old 22.08.2015, 20:49
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

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having an assault rifle and bring a moroccan doesnt automatically make him a terrorist. it s important to differetiate brtwrrn lone wolf whack jobs and someone who is part of an organized crime group. I wouldnt jump to conclusions till we have more info
That's fair comment, and in fact his initial claim was he had found the weapons in a field and was planning to merely rob people on the train. Sounded pretty far-fetched when i read it, and we now hear that he had been in Syria and was known to the authorities as a militant Islam sympathiser, so (if true) I guess we can conclude this was no robbery.

As for it being important to differentiate between lone-wolf and organised groups, well it is important for intelligence analysts but not sure it would matter much to me if I was on the train when the guy started shooting.
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  #29  
Old 22.08.2015, 20:49
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

what is bullshit pc brainwashing?
why do you feel like i'm trying to brainwash anyone? You can either jump to conclusions or wait till you hear from the specialists whether he was a Jihadist. I just stated that I prefer to form my opinions after I have more information. No brainwashing there, but then you might be prejudiced against anyone who's not sharing your views Wish you well.
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Old 22.08.2015, 20:56
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

Yes, for civilians it's irrelevant who their assailant is, but for those tasked with (internal) safety, it's a different story.

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That's fair comment, and in fact his initial claim was he had found the weapons in a field and was planning to merely rob people on the train. Sounded pretty far-fetched when i read it, and we now hear that he had been in Syria and was known to the authorities as a militant Islam sympathiser, so (if true) I guess we can conclude this was no robbery.

As for it being important to differentiate between lone-wolf and organised groups, well it is important for intelligence analysts but not sure it would matter much to me if I was on the train when the guy started shooting.
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  #31  
Old 22.08.2015, 23:23
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

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Why?
How about the Lafayette shooting last month?


"Rusty" Houser had a history of anti-government and far-right views; sounds like a terrorist to me
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  #32  
Old 22.08.2015, 23:54
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

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I suspect what you are trying to say is he should not be labeled as an Islamic terrorist until the facts are in, but your bullshit PC brainwashing won't allow you to form that idea anymore.
Terrorism requires an organized group of people. It is politically (or similar) motivated, planned use of force. It is intended to work against the status quo, to bring or foster change. None of this applies to a robbery. Every lone wolf incident lacks at least one (usually most if not all) of the above.

Brainwash. Right.
Some people try to make sure the don't call an orange "apple". Apparently such "details" are irrelevant to someone with your intelligence.
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  #33  
Old 23.08.2015, 08:15
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

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Brainwash. Right.
Some people try to make sure the don't call an orange "apple". Apparently such "details" are irrelevant to someone with your intelligence.
and some people won't even use the term "apple" anymore regardless of the context. This was my only point.

BTW, I don't know if this guy was a jihadist either, nor am I advocating he is one at this point (until the facts are in). Make sure you get the details right.
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  #34  
Old 23.08.2015, 08:42
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

So you aren't voicing any opinion, instead calling others ignorant and indoctrinating?


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and some people won't even use the term "apple" anymore regardless of the context. This was my only point.

BTW, I don't know if this guy was a jihadist either, nor am I advocating he is one at this point (until the facts are in). Make sure you get the details right.
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Old 23.08.2015, 08:46
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

Not terrorism in the classical sense. But I see how you might think that. Different legal systems have different definitions of (international and national) Terrorism. In addition, he has been called right-wing terrorist widely in the media.

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"Rusty" Houser had a history of anti-government and far-right views; sounds like a terrorist to me
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  #36  
Old 23.08.2015, 08:52
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

their actions are a perfect example of how to react to terrorists, who in most cases are outnumbered by the people they attack! I hope more people act like predators and attack the terrorists! why wait like a prey to die? take action, be a hero, worst case scenario even if you die at least you die like a hero!

I am so proud of these young men, because after September 11 I decided that if my plane was ever hijacked by terrorists I would stand up and fight in the fist minute, and I always hoped that some of the other 200+ passengers would back me up!

Glad to know that most likely some will back me up!

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  #37  
Old 23.08.2015, 08:54
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

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and some people won't even use the term "apple" anymore regardless of the context. This was my only point.

BTW, I don't know if this guy was a jihadist either, nor am I advocating he is one at this point (until the facts are in). Make sure you get the details right.
Not on EF. Here those who complain about the crazy PC rules are doing it while they make the most bigoted and non-PC comments every time they have a chance. Probably not about "apples", but they have other valves to vent things out (they are allowed and even encouraged). All is not lost.

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Not terrorism in the classical sense. But I see how you might think that. Different legal systems have different definitions of (international and national) Terrorism. In addition, he has been called right-wing terrorist widely in the media.
A fine example of what VFRontop has said. Let's not pretend we don't get it.

Last edited by greenmount; 23.08.2015 at 09:08.
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  #38  
Old 23.08.2015, 09:44
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

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Seen many mass murders killing random people lately?


THIS exactly is the question. Was and is he just a maniac with the will to kill at random ? or is there a political idea ?
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Old 23.08.2015, 09:58
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

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their actions are a perfect example of how to react to terrorists, who in most cases are outnumbered by the people they attack! I hope more people act like predators and attack the terrorists! why wait like a prey to die? take action, be a hero, worst case scenario even if you die at least you die like a hero!

I am so proud of these young men, because after September 11 I decided that if my plane was ever hijacked by terrorists I would stand up and fight in the fist minute, and I always hoped that some of the other 200+ passengers would back me up!

Glad to know that most likely some will back me up!


stand up and fight ? fight with what exactly ? the wine glass ?
y
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  #40  
Old 23.08.2015, 10:43
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Re: Two US Marines take down a gunman on a Paris train

Much better if people fight to stop these people coming here in the first place.
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