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Old 10.07.2017, 14:34
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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Your knowledge of history is either lacking or you have been viewing it through the rosy-tinted glasses of nostalgia if you think that the Chinese, Irish and Indians had a smooth and idyllic transition into their new lives in the US and UK.
And I wrote that it was smooth and idyllic where ??

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As for the "disproportionate amounts of crime" and "car burning", isn't that more an indication of the kind of media you read? Yes, it happens but not disproportionately.
See this post for exact proportions in Switzerland - not only disproportionate but massively so. Media source is central stats office - not a known source of innuendo.
  #1122  
Old 10.07.2017, 14:36
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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I never said "manual labour", nor did i say "agricultural labour".
You think a large portion of those people have the skills - language and otherwise to engage effectively ?? Stats say otherwise.
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And why ignore everything else on the list?
First 2 points were so laughable that they were standout.
  #1123  
Old 10.07.2017, 14:42
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

If they truly ran away from war and violence, they would accept to live anywhere. But the truth is, they don't. Don't blame them, just saying.
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  #1124  
Old 10.07.2017, 14:49
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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You think a large portion of those people have the skills - language and otherwise to engage effectively ?? Stats say otherwise.

First 2 points exhausted my mental capacity and i overheated.

Do you think where they came from, they lived in mud huts and wore loincloths, so have absolutely no skills to offer? Do you think they are all uneducated savages coming from the deep dark depths of the earth?


Very few people are able to engage on day one, refugee or not. But given the opportunity, few refugees turn it down. i wasnt much good at german on my first day, but lo and behold, now i can converse quite happily with a german speaker.


Languages can be learned. As many people in switzerland prove.


Since i expect many dont speak greek, should we torpedo the boats carrying them, after taking a roll call of greek speakers on board?


What if they speak english, but land in greece? I assume from your vitriol about refugees crossing borders, they should teleport to the UK?


I fixed the rest of your post for you.
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  #1125  
Old 10.07.2017, 14:50
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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If they truly ran away from war and violence, they would accept to live anywhere. But the truth is, they don't. Don't blame them, just saying.
Yes, but expecting them to be happy living on a beach with nothing but crabs for company is stretching it a bit.
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  #1126  
Old 10.07.2017, 14:55
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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And I wrote that it was smooth and idyllic where ??


See this post for exact proportions in Switzerland - not only disproportionate but massively so. Media source is central stats office - not a known source of innuendo.
Your link is to Wikipedia, not the Swiss central stats office!

If you actually look at the the Swiss central stats office here you will see three quarters of the convicted foreign criminals were here illegally.
So tightening Swiss admission controls on refugees and legal migrants will only reduce such foreigner crimes by, at best, a quarter.

Edit As mentioned you are comparing apples and oranges when you compare crimes by Swiss residents with crimes committed by foreigners who are here illegally.
If you look at the crimes rate of foreigners who are here legally then it is quite a different story
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  #1127  
Old 10.07.2017, 15:06
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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You seem to have missed the "manual labour" bit - I'm CERTAIN it's not wilful ignorance on your part

Also refugees do not have the neccessary skills to enter the labour market in Germany according to the companies themselves.

Does anyone doubt that in 20 years there will be riots and burning in the streets of Northern Europe a la the suburbs of Paris and Marseilles ???
There are no manual labour jobs in Germany? Really?
  #1128  
Old 10.07.2017, 15:09
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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If they truly ran away from war and violence, they would accept to live anywhere. But the truth is, they don't. Don't blame them, just saying.
"If they truly ran away from war and violence, they would accept to live anywhere." That is your opinion which you are entitled to. The reality is that, like us, they want to find the best solution.
  #1129  
Old 10.07.2017, 15:10
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

Just dipping into this thread to see what's what. Please try and keep it civil - there are a couple of posts descending towards name calling, and other being deliberately provocative. Surely there's nothing more to add to this topic anyway?
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  #1130  
Old 10.07.2017, 15:40
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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Yes, but expecting them to be happy living on a beach with nothing but crabs for company is stretching it a bit.
Particularly seeing as the traffickers have regularly been dumping these people on uninhabited islands with no fresh water, and the Greek navy have been rescuing them on a daily basis for a few years now.

Been saying this for years, but Greece does not have the resources or the international support required to manage this ongoing situation. All they have is the willpower to do the best that they can, but when you're struggling to find work for, and feed your own people, it's a big ask.
  #1131  
Old 10.07.2017, 16:33
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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"If they truly ran away from war and violence, they would accept to live anywhere." That is your opinion which you are entitled to. The reality is that, like us, they want to find the best solution.
Of course, we'll see how many places Germany still has...because at one point or another the hospitality will be over.
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  #1132  
Old 10.07.2017, 17:14
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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Just dipping into this thread to see what's what. Please try and keep it civil - there are a couple of posts descending towards name calling, and other being deliberately provocative. Surely there's nothing more to add to this topic anyway?

We got to that point ages ago. Dont think there has been anything of note to add for weeks.


At this point its just fun toying with certain posters...
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  #1133  
Old 10.07.2017, 17:17
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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As for the "disproportionate amounts of crime" and "car burning", isn't that more an indication of the kind of media you read? Yes, it happens but not disproportionately.
Oh come oooon, you know darn well that the G20 protests were staged by refugees painted white.
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  #1134  
Old 10.07.2017, 17:18
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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Oh come oooon, you know darn well that the G20 protests were staged by refugees painted white.



Those damn refugees, coming over here, taking all the good protest violence for themselves....Leaving the locals with nothing more than a bin to topple over.


Its political correctness gone mad, i tell ya, mad!
  #1135  
Old 10.07.2017, 17:27
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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Of course, we'll see how many places Germany still has...because at one point or another the hospitality will be over.

By places, do you mean jobs? its actually not very clear what youre talking about at all.

Or do you mean slots as in places for people? Do you mean like when you go to Post and get a ticket from that machine you press a button on, then you get a slot to be seen by someone?

Are you saying Germany is running out of tickets with numbers on?

Clarify a bit please?
  #1136  
Old 10.07.2017, 18:26
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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Clarify a bit please?
Accommodation in asylum or refugee centres, jobs, schools for retraining them, etc... everything people actually need.

I find it totally weird or dishonest not to acknowledge that it can be a problem at some point. Greece can't do it and has admitted it. Is Germany some sort of horn of abundance? Really, it is not difficult to understand what I was about, but suit yourself.

Amusing.
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  #1137  
Old 10.07.2017, 18:35
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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Do you think where they came from, they lived in mud huts and wore loincloths, so have absolutely no skills to offer? Do you think they are all uneducated savages coming from the deep dark depths of the earth?
Do you ALWAYS do drugs when you post?

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Very few people are able to engage on day one, refugee or not.
Uhh the great majority of people on this board worked hard for their qualifications to come to this country - and had to engage LONG before they got here.

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But given the opportunity, few refugees turn it down. i wasnt much good at german on my first day, but lo and behold, now i can converse quite happily with a german speaker.
If your conversation levels in German are similar to those in English you must be quite the dinner party guest.

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Languages can be learned. As many people in switzerland prove.
Since i expect many dont speak greek, should we torpedo the boats carrying them, after taking a roll call of greek speakers on board?
What if they speak english, but land in greece? I assume from your vitriol about refugees crossing borders, they should teleport to the UK?
I fixed the rest of your post for you.
Sticks and stones child.
  #1138  
Old 10.07.2017, 18:42
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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Just dipping into this thread to see what's what. Please try and keep it civil - there are a couple of posts descending towards name calling, and other being deliberately provocative. Surely there's nothing more to add to this topic anyway?
Firstly there have been several posts which have been rude and insulting - and only by one side in the argument.

Secondly there are quite some new developments in the story - and will continue to do so as it unfolds - probably over generations.

Finally this essay by a Syrian Professor in Germany - is quite illuminating :

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Cologne was not an isolated case

As a Syrian from Damascus, I am astonished at the ignorance and naïveté of the Chancellor and her defence minister, who believe that they can end the war with conferences in Geneva and Munich. But this war should be categorized as a “protracted conflict” that will be with us for many years. It is a type of war that I call “an irregular not state-run war.”

Among the war refugees, there are not only victims of violence but also many perpetrators, and even numerous Islamists. Added to that is the fact that these predominantly young men aged 14 to 20 bring with them the culture of violence, including against women, from the Near East to Germany. New Year’s Eve in Cologne is just a demonstration of that, and no isolated case as our politicians like to pretend in order to downplay the significance of the matter.

....

Cologne was just the beginning. If Germany brings in over a million people from the world of Islam and does not fulfil their expectations, we had better be prepared for a few things. From advertisements, all these young men think that they know that every European has a luxury apartment, a car and a “pretty blonde”; they think that they will get all that too and join in the prosperity.

But when these young men instead end up receiving emergency accommodation in school gyms or sports arenas, they feel like they have been deceived and discriminated against. So they develop a desire for revenge against the European man. The disappointed and enraged Arab men therefore took their revenge in Cologne and Hamburg against German men, represented by their women.

...
As a Syrian from Damascus, I have been living in Germany since 1962, and I know: Patriarchally minded men from a misogynistic culture cannot be integrated. A European, civil Islam that the Islamic functionaries in these parts have rejected as Euro-Islam, would be the alternative. At the present time, it doesn’t have a chance. My teacher Max Horkheimer called Europe “an island of freedom in an ocean of dictatorships.” Today I see this freedom endangered.
There are none so blind as those who will not see.
  #1139  
Old 10.07.2017, 18:44
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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Accommodation in asylum or refugee centres, jobs, schools for retraining them, etc... everything people actually need.

I find it totally weird or dishonest not to acknowledge that it can be a problem at some point. Greece can't do it and has admitted it. Is Germany some sort of horn of abundance? Really, it is not difficult to understand what I was about, but suit yourself.

Amusing.
Nobody is saying its not a problem (the refugee crisis), we are usually referring to comments by people on this forum who see all the people taking boats across the Med as being freeloading, economic, illegal migrants that are going to cause the demise of western civilisation by raping our kids and stealing our iphones.

Of course its a problem, its a massive f'ing problem of epic proportions and nobody is prepared to work out a realistic solution. That doesn't mean that the majority of people trying to get into Europe are destined to rape, murder, steal and riot their way into our society or are undercover terrorists.

Some of us come onto this thread to give some other opinions and to counter the extreme prejudices of some of the forum users.
  #1140  
Old 10.07.2017, 18:46
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Re: Migrants, Refugees, Asylum Seekers or Other terms?

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Accommodation in asylum or refugee centres, jobs, schools for retraining them, etc... everything people actually need.

I find it totally weird or dishonest not to acknowledge that it can be a problem at some point. Greece can't do it and has admitted it. Is Germany some sort of horn of abundance? Really, it is not difficult to understand what I was about, but suit yourself.

Amusing.
So far all the quick building of tent camps and more permanent housing, not to mention all the language courses, integration courses, people cooking and cleaning for them, legal stuff, etc etc is actually creating GDP growth.

This just goes to show how GDP is not necessarily an effective measure of meaningful or sustainable growth. Even paying people to dig holes and then fill them back in would actually create GDP growth. But any government shutting that down too quickly would be shooting themself in the foot. The Pavlovian attachment to GDP is too strong.
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