Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Off-Topic > Off-Topic > International affairs/politics  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #2041  
Old 10.04.2018, 12:43
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: -
Posts: 247
Groaned at 141 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 2,085 Times in 996 Posts
kriss kross has earned some respectkriss kross has earned some respect
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
But Im waiting for our resident muslim hater, KK, to provide some evidence that its happening all the time within the muslim community in europe...
It is irrelevant, I'm not discussing the prevalence of the practice, I'm discussing the justification for it in the Islamic world - and ultimately, whether Muslims would accept and adopt Western views of child marriage over their own Prophets.
Reply With Quote
  #2042  
Old 10.04.2018, 12:43
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Zurich
Posts: 982
Groaned at 249 Times in 178 Posts
Thanked 2,158 Times in 997 Posts
J2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

He wants you to comment on how disgusting all these muslims are. Thats pretty much the only reason he frequents this thread.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank J2488 for this useful post:
This user groans at J2488 for this post:
  #2043  
Old 10.04.2018, 12:44
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: -
Posts: 247
Groaned at 141 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 2,085 Times in 996 Posts
kriss kross has earned some respectkriss kross has earned some respect
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
Yes, and you know my opinion about it, what do you want more?
I just wanted to hear you agree that the majority of Muslims do in fact hold 'extreme views' in the European sense.
Reply With Quote
  #2044  
Old 10.04.2018, 12:44
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Zurich
Posts: 982
Groaned at 249 Times in 178 Posts
Thanked 2,158 Times in 997 Posts
J2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
It is irrelevant, I'm not discussing the prevalence of the practice, I'm discussing the justification for it in the Islamic world - and ultimately, whether Muslims would accept and adopt Western views of child marriage over their own Prophets.


Ahh, so now its irrelevant, but a minute ago it wasnt?


I thought we were discussing about how the muslims live in Europe?


Or have you moved the goalposts yet again because you couldnt find any evidence?
Reply With Quote
  #2045  
Old 10.04.2018, 12:54
Castro's Avatar
la mod
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: ZG
Posts: 5,829
Groaned at 129 Times in 105 Posts
Thanked 17,605 Times in 5,587 Posts
Castro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
It is irrelevant, I'm not discussing the prevalence of the practice, I'm discussing the justification for it in the Islamic world - and ultimately, whether Muslims would accept and adopt Western views of child marriage over their own Prophets.
Poverty is one of the leading causes of child brides. A Bangladeshi rickshaw driver with 7 kids will marry them off as soon as he can. That doesn't exclude other reasons such as rebellious teens being drugged and bundled on a plane to Pakistan, but none of this is intrinsically Islamic... like I'm sure you know.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank Castro for this useful post:
  #2046  
Old 10.04.2018, 12:55
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: -
Posts: 247
Groaned at 141 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 2,085 Times in 996 Posts
kriss kross has earned some respectkriss kross has earned some respect
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
Ahh, so now its irrelevant, but a minute ago it wasnt?


I thought we were discussing about how the muslims live in Europe?
Right, and we were discussing whether, in a general sense, Muslims would put European values above Islamic values.

In this specific case, whether they would put European views of child marriage above those of their Prophet.

I think you realise all this though and are simply attempting to obfuscate the point because you know the answer and you don't like it.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank kriss kross for this useful post:
  #2047  
Old 10.04.2018, 13:35
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Kt.ZH
Posts: 11,830
Groaned at 463 Times in 380 Posts
Thanked 18,480 Times in 9,348 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Values change with time...are also influenced by education, socioeconomic status, social inclusion, law enforcement etc.

Anyways. I'll let everyone else here debate these issues ad nauseam. It's like watching funny gifs with cats playing table tennis...lol Who can give a definite answer on such things? I congratulate those, they have...vision. People are different. You can't generalise.
Reply With Quote
  #2048  
Old 10.04.2018, 13:37
Elu Elu is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Olten
Posts: 642
Groaned at 23 Times in 22 Posts
Thanked 1,274 Times in 536 Posts
Elu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
So Muslims who believe in marriage of a girl who has reached mensus, regardless of age, have "extreme values"?
Quote:
View Post
I just wanted to hear you agree that the majority of Muslims do in fact hold 'extreme views' in the European sense.


STOP!
Don't you dare putting words into my mouth like that


In no words I wrote something about the majority of muslims.


EDIT: Oops sorry krisskross my mistake, i overread "prevalent" in your second question.

Last edited by Elu; 10.04.2018 at 13:56.
Reply With Quote
  #2049  
Old 10.04.2018, 14:07
Elu Elu is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Olten
Posts: 642
Groaned at 23 Times in 22 Posts
Thanked 1,274 Times in 536 Posts
Elu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
I just wanted to hear you agree that the majority of Muslims do in fact hold 'extreme views' in the European sense.


Hmm sorry I didn't see that you altered your statement a bit before asking for a confirmation. My bad.


Let me clarify then: Nope I dont think that a majority of muslims has those extreme views.
Reply With Quote
  #2050  
Old 10.04.2018, 14:11
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Nov 2012
Location: Zurich
Posts: 982
Groaned at 249 Times in 178 Posts
Thanked 2,158 Times in 997 Posts
J2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond reputeJ2488 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
Right, and we were discussing whether, in a general sense, Muslims would put European values above Islamic values.

In this specific case, whether they would put European views of child marriage above those of their Prophet.

I think you realise all this though and are simply attempting to obfuscate the point because you know the answer and you don't like it.


The fact there is no prevalence of child brides would indicate that the muslim community have already put that european value above that of their homelands, in this respect.


The fact that they talk like us, dress like us, learn like us, work like us, pay taxes like us, have passports like us, do military service like us, and generally live like us indicates that they have already put 'european' values above their religious values.


Even when the values contradict, most are quite happy to take the european values, and dont want to make a big deal about it. Consider the number of muslims who buy meat from migros and coop; its not halal but they have adapted to what is available.


Believe it or not, muslims are like you and me, just trying to live their lives in an increasingly chaotic world. They have no intention of marrying their daughters off at the age of 12.


I do know the answer; Muslims are, by and large, integrated into european society. They contribute in myriad ways to european society as a whole, and are as european as you and me. And this infuriates people like you because you have some deep seated belief that they are a lesser, different people, and you dont think they should be here.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank J2488 for this useful post:
  #2051  
Old 10.04.2018, 14:16
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: -
Posts: 247
Groaned at 141 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 2,085 Times in 996 Posts
kriss kross has earned some respectkriss kross has earned some respect
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
Hmm sorry I didn't see that you altered your statement a bit before asking for a confirmation. My bad.

Let me clarify then: Nope I dont think that a majority of muslims has those extreme views.
So despite the fact that child marriage is allowed under Islamic law and that Prophet Muhammad engaged in it himself, you believe that most Muslims think it's wrong?
Reply With Quote
  #2052  
Old 10.04.2018, 14:19
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Kt.ZH
Posts: 11,830
Groaned at 463 Times in 380 Posts
Thanked 18,480 Times in 9,348 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post

Believe it or not, muslims are like you and me, just trying to live their lives in an increasingly chaotic world. They have no intention of marrying their daughters off at the age of 12.


I do know the answer; Muslims are, by and large, integrated into european society. They contribute in myriad ways to european society as a whole, and are as european as you and me. And this infuriates people like you because you have some deep seated belief that they are a lesser, different people, and you dont think they should be here.
Yes, and replace "Muslims" with any other group that some people here (I'd give some names but don't want to provoke any more discussions on the British Forum) don't feel like they should be where they are or that are "lesser, different people"...
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank greenmount for this useful post:
  #2053  
Old 10.04.2018, 14:24
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: -
Posts: 247
Groaned at 141 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 2,085 Times in 996 Posts
kriss kross has earned some respectkriss kross has earned some respect
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
The fact there is no prevalence of child brides would indicate that the muslim community have already put that european value above that of their homelands, in this respect.
Again, I never commented on the prevalence of the practice nor did I suggest that Muslims would all run off to marry children.

Quote:
View Post
The fact that they talk like us, dress like us, learn like us, work like us, pay taxes like us, have passports like us, do military service like us, and generally live like us indicates that they have already put 'european' values above their religious values.
My question was, in the hypothetical situation that they form a majority of a European city in the future, would they continue to put European values above Islamic values?
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank kriss kross for this useful post:
  #2054  
Old 10.04.2018, 14:26
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
The fact there is no prevalence of child brides would indicate that the muslim community have already put that european value above that of their homelands, in this respect.

The fact that they talk like us, dress like us, learn like us, work like us, pay taxes like us, have passports like us, do military service like us, and generally live like us indicates that they have already put 'european' values above their religious values.

Even when the values contradict, most are quite happy to take the european values, and dont want to make a big deal about it. Consider the number of muslims who buy meat from migros and coop; its not halal but they have adapted to what is available.

Believe it or not, muslims are like you and me, just trying to live their lives in an increasingly chaotic world. They have no intention of marrying their daughters off at the age of 12.

I do know the answer; Muslims are, by and large, integrated into european society. They contribute in myriad ways to european society as a whole, and are as european as you and me. And this infuriates people like you because you have some deep seated belief that they are a lesser, different people, and you dont think they should be here.
Funny, you complain when others lump Muslims all into the same boat and then do it yourself.

Yes, many Muslims are integrated into European society, however there are still massive numbers which are not, nor ever will be. Especially when people like you deny there is a problem.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank for this useful post:
  #2055  
Old 10.04.2018, 14:26
Elu Elu is offline
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: May 2017
Location: Olten
Posts: 642
Groaned at 23 Times in 22 Posts
Thanked 1,274 Times in 536 Posts
Elu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond reputeElu has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
So despite the fact that child marriage is allowed under Islamic law and that Prophet Muhammad engaged in it himself, you believe that most Muslims think it's wrong?


I have no idea what most muslims think and thats not what we started talking about. We were talking about how values can change when immigrating into another culture.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Elu for this useful post:
  #2056  
Old 10.04.2018, 14:28
Castro's Avatar
la mod
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: ZG
Posts: 5,829
Groaned at 129 Times in 105 Posts
Thanked 17,605 Times in 5,587 Posts
Castro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond reputeCastro has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
So despite the fact that child marriage is allowed under Islamic law and that Prophet Muhammad engaged in it himself, you believe that most Muslims think it's wrong?
You are talking about the Arabian peninsula in 630AD, life expectancy of the general population was just 35. Back then there were no schools, universities or Justin Bieber concerts. As soon as you hit puberty, you were an adult.

You are like a pound shop Terminator.. you just don't stop
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Castro for this useful post:
  #2057  
Old 10.04.2018, 14:31
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: -
Posts: 247
Groaned at 141 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 2,085 Times in 996 Posts
kriss kross has earned some respectkriss kross has earned some respect
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
I do know the answer; Muslims are, by and large, integrated into european society. They contribute in myriad ways to european society as a whole, and are as european as you and me.
Well, I don't believe that some Hijabi with no roots in the continent is as European as me so we'll have to agree to disagree there.

Quote:
View Post
And this infuriates people like you because you have some deep seated belief that they are a lesser, different people, and you dont think they should be here.
You keep insisting that I hate them and consider them inferior to me. I simply think that they have their own homeland that shares their culture and that they may be happier enjoying their Islamic lifestyle there.
Reply With Quote
  #2058  
Old 10.04.2018, 14:32
parnell's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Geroldswil
Posts: 642
Groaned at 218 Times in 140 Posts
Thanked 2,165 Times in 1,024 Posts
parnell has a reputation beyond reputeparnell has a reputation beyond reputeparnell has a reputation beyond reputeparnell has a reputation beyond reputeparnell has a reputation beyond reputeparnell has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
The fact there is no prevalence of child brides would indicate that the muslim community have already put that european value above that of their homelands, in this respect.
Fact huh ?

Quote:
Denmark's response has swung first one way and then the other.
In February, Integration Minister Inger Stojberg vowed to act after a review found dozens of cases of girls living with older men in asylum seekers' accommodation - which the minister called "totally unacceptable".
Couples would require "exceptional reasons" to live together below the age of 18 (the legal age for marriage in Denmark) and no cohabitation would be allowed whatsoever if one party was below 15.
But separation reportedly prompted two migrants under 18 to attempt suicide.
The policy was reversed earlier this week - with children as young as 14 reunited with their husbands - after the issue was raised with the Danish Immigration Service (DIS) by lawmaker Josephine Fock.


Data suggest that in Germany there are at least 1,000 marriages where one or both parties are under the legal marriage age of 18, of which more than half are in the southern state of Bavaria.
and that just from the BBC and just those that are reported...
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank parnell for this useful post:
  #2059  
Old 10.04.2018, 15:10
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 12,361
Groaned at 337 Times in 273 Posts
Thanked 26,263 Times in 11,000 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

And finally we realize that Jimmy Saville was a muslim.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank amogles for this useful post:
  #2060  
Old 10.04.2018, 15:19
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: -
Posts: 247
Groaned at 141 Times in 99 Posts
Thanked 2,085 Times in 996 Posts
kriss kross has earned some respectkriss kross has earned some respect
Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Quote:
View Post
You are talking about the Arabian peninsula in 630AD, life expectancy of the general population was just 35. Back then there were no schools, universities or Justin Bieber concerts. As soon as you hit puberty, you were an adult.
Just shows the ridiculousness of it all, that Allah/Muhammad didn't have enough foresight to include a clause that said 'once life improves a bit, stop having sex with children'
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank kriss kross for this useful post:
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Will borders with CH be affected after terrorist attacks? McTAVGE Daily life 19 15.11.2015 18:14
The All Muslims are evil thread bigblue2 General off-topic 4 27.08.2010 15:46
Confused about coverage in rest of Europe on Swiss Health Insurance Wingnut Insurance 8 15.12.2008 09:20


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 22:49.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0