It is irrelevant, I'm not discussing the prevalence of the practice, I'm discussing the justification for it in the Islamic world - and ultimately, whether Muslims would accept and adopt Western views of child marriage over their own Prophets.

He wants you to comment on how disgusting all these muslims are. Thats pretty much the only reason he frequents this thread.

I just wanted to hear you agree that the majority of Muslims do in fact hold 'extreme views' in the European sense.

Ahh, so now its irrelevant, but a minute ago it wasnt?


I thought we were discussing about how the muslims live in Europe?


Or have you moved the goalposts yet again because you couldnt find any evidence?

Poverty is one of the leading causes of child brides. A Bangladeshi rickshaw driver with 7 kids will marry them off as soon as he can. That doesn't exclude other reasons such as rebellious teens being drugged and bundled on a plane to Pakistan, but none of this is intrinsically Islamic... like I'm sure you know.

Right, and we were discussing whether, in a general sense, Muslims would put European values above Islamic values.

In this specific case, whether they would put European views of child marriage above those of their Prophet.

I think you realise all this though and are simply attempting to obfuscate the point because you know the answer and you don't like it.

Values change with time...are also influenced by education, socioeconomic status, social inclusion, law enforcement etc.

Anyways. I'll let everyone else here debate these issues ad nauseam. It's like watching funny gifs with cats playing table tennis...lol Who can give a definite answer on such things? I congratulate those, they have...vision. People are different. You can't generalise.

STOP!
Don't you dare putting words into my mouth like that


In no words I wrote something about the majority of muslims.


EDIT: Oops sorry krisskross my mistake, i overread "prevalent" in your second question.

Hmm sorry I didn't see that you altered your statement a bit before asking for a confirmation. My bad.


Let me clarify then: Nope I dont think that a majority of muslims has those extreme views.

The fact there is no prevalence of child brides would indicate that the muslim community have already put that european value above that of their homelands, in this respect.


The fact that they talk like us, dress like us, learn like us, work like us, pay taxes like us, have passports like us, do military service like us, and generally live like us indicates that they have already put 'european' values above their religious values.


Even when the values contradict, most are quite happy to take the european values, and dont want to make a big deal about it. Consider the number of muslims who buy meat from migros and coop; its not halal but they have adapted to what is available.


Believe it or not, muslims are like you and me, just trying to live their lives in an increasingly chaotic world. They have no intention of marrying their daughters off at the age of 12.


I do know the answer; Muslims are, by and large, integrated into european society. They contribute in myriad ways to european society as a whole, and are as european as you and me. And this infuriates people like you because you have some deep seated belief that they are a lesser, different people, and you dont think they should be here.

So despite the fact that child marriage is allowed under Islamic law and that Prophet Muhammad engaged in it himself, you believe that most Muslims think it's wrong?

Yes, and replace "Muslims" with any other group that some people here (I'd give some names but don't want to provoke any more discussions on the British Forum) don't feel like they should be where they are or that are "lesser, different people"...

Again, I never commented on the prevalence of the practice nor did I suggest that Muslims would all run off to marry children.

My question was, in the hypothetical situation that they form a majority of a European city in the future, would they continue to put European values above Islamic values?

Funny, you complain when others lump Muslims all into the same boat and then do it yourself.

Yes, many Muslims are integrated into European society, however there are still massive numbers which are not, nor ever will be. Especially when people like you deny there is a problem.

I have no idea what most muslims think and thats not what we started talking about. We were talking about how values can change when immigrating into another culture.

You are talking about the Arabian peninsula in 630AD, life expectancy of the general population was just 35. Back then there were no schools, universities or Justin Bieber concerts. As soon as you hit puberty, you were an adult.

You are like a pound shop Terminator.. you just don't stop

Well, I don't believe that some Hijabi with no roots in the continent is as European as me so we'll have to agree to disagree there.

You keep insisting that I hate them and consider them inferior to me. I simply think that they have their own homeland that shares their culture and that they may be happier enjoying their Islamic lifestyle there.

Fact huh ?

and that just from the BBC and just those that are reported...

And finally we realize that Jimmy Saville was a muslim.

Just shows the ridiculousness of it all, that Allah/Muhammad didn't have enough foresight to include a clause that said 'once life improves a bit, stop having sex with children'