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-   -   All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) (https://www.englishforum.ch/international-affairs-politics/244043-all-about-muslims-wake-terrorist-attacks-europe.html)

kriss kross 27.08.2017 12:56

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by greenmount (Post 2837613)
Yeah, always the same explanation. Lots of people are not welcomed in Western European countries and they don't join extremist organisations which plan to blow up other people.

Can the left come up with other explanations because this one is not only false, considering they have all the rights like everyone else, but really old too.

They will rotate the same old excuses ad infinitum as they do not want to recognize that the underlying factor behind all the problems is the ideology of Islam.

Bucentaure 27.08.2017 13:02

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Castro (Post 2837621)
Of course not, Islamist groups have been simmering under the surface since time immemorial. The Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt have been around since the 30s BUT they were kept in check by strong and stable secular dictatorships, the very ones which we helped to bring down. ...

Basically, this is true.


However, with the help of God, human being at least sometimes (or some of them) is powerful enough to act and help to make turn out things not necessarily to the worst.
The Assads, Husseins, Khadafis ... maybe helped tourists in the Mediterranian to enjoy their holidays without glimpsing some drowned around,
but it's not those dictators didn't cause any death toll at all. All global terrorism worldwide struggles to get the slightest portion of their death toll, by comparison. And we don't only talk those who the "Lion of Damascus" killed in Hama or the kurds who died from gas attacks in Northern Iraq, but also the many who died and keep on dying already in the desert (which we don't see, evidently).


But wait, yes, it weren't Western tourists those among the murdered by the dictators, and as long as victims aren't swept ashore on a tourists' location everything is fine :rolleyes:

esto 27.08.2017 13:18

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Castro (Post 2837621)
Of course not, Islamist groups have been simmering under the surface since time immemorial. The Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt have been around since the 30s BUT they were kept in check by strong and stable secular dictatorships, the very ones which we helped to bring down. Its like antibiotics, remove them and the disease quickly spreads.

Seriously it shouldn't be this difficult to understand basic cause and consequence :confused:

I agree 100%. Islamic nut jobs have always been there, but now with the 'zoo keepers' gone, they have got free from their cages. I'm just curious why you don't seem to understand your own words? :confused:

marton 27.08.2017 13:19

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lewton (Post 2837637)
+1 again.
Pretty much the same is happening in Syria today. "Assad must go" repeat the martons of every forum. What comes after Assad though? Democracy? :rofl:

""Assad must go" repeat the martons of every forum" as you were using a small "m" I assume you did not mean me personally?
In fact I have never posted "Assad must go", I have nothing against opticians! :D

The problem with replacing brutal dictators is you have no control over who follows them, case in point - Libya.

pilatus1 27.08.2017 13:30

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Castro (Post 2837621)
Of course not, Islamist groups have been simmering under the surface since time immemorial. ...

Nope. Only since Mohammed.
Quote:

Originally Posted by Castro (Post 2837621)
Its like antibiotics, remove them and the disease quickly spreads.

The disease being Islam, and it's worst symptoms being Islamic terrorism and Sharia law.

22 yards 27.08.2017 13:31

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by marton (Post 2837675)
""Assad must go" repeat the martons of every forum" as you were using a small "m" I assume you did not mean me personally?
In fact I have never posted "Assad must go", I have nothing against opticians! :D

The problem with replacing brutal dictators is you have no control over who follows them, case in point - Libya.

Ophthalmologists, but I grant you, "opticians" is easier to spell.

Blueangel 27.08.2017 14:13

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Castro (Post 2837621)
Of course not, Islamist groups have been simmering under the surface since time immemorial. The Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt have been around since the 30s BUT they were kept in check by strong and stable secular dictatorships, the very ones which we helped to bring down. Its like antibiotics, remove them and the disease quickly spreads.

Seriously it shouldn't be this difficult to understand basic cause and consequence :confused:

Just to take this a bit further...

It's like an eternal game of chess. We are the pawns and we keep being sacrificed to protect the king and queen. We're collateral damage, and if you ever doubt that, just go to the Excel centre in London 4-11 September (if you can find a way to get into the place), and see what 'the west' are flogging to some seriously dodgy regimes.

The honest man has the highest price, and in 2005, GWB 'bought' Pakistan as an ally in the war on terror for the princely sum of 8 F-16 fighter jets, which they promptly flew over the biggest democracy in the World, India. His dad gifted Saddam an 'irrigation system' as a thank you for winning the Iran-Iraq war, much against the advice of the security agencies who pointed out that the components of said 'irrigation system' could also be used to make WMDs. Scroll back a bit further and you'll find Jimmy Carter supplying black market weapons to the Mujahideen via Sweden during the Russian invasion of Afghanistan.

Those are just three, well documented and in the public domain, examples of where 'the west' has royally screwed things up. There are dozens and dozens more examples from various western countries, and every time there's a terrorist attack in the west, it proves that us pawns are still paying the price for the numb ers in government playing chess without reaching the end game.

So the next time a numb skulled, overly-ambitious little git starts begging for your vote, and tries to blind you with health care, education and taxation, ask them about foreign policy, arms deals, who we're selling to, who we're buying from, who we're giving state visits to, etc...and don't give the slimy little toads an inch of wiggly room. If you ever get a straight answer, Congratulations!, because I never have.

marton 27.08.2017 14:25

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pilatus1 (Post 2837626)
This is where the double standards become so apparent. In your eyes, they are nothing more than a talk shop, in fact they are as harmless as the Mother's Union..

But if a right-leaning speaker wants to discuss free speech, 30,000 protesters show up to shut him down. (as took place in Boston, reaction to Charlottesville attack)He's suddenly a neonazi white supremacist, who deserves to be punched in the face for speaking his views or holding a flag with a stupid symbol on it...

A comparable response from the public to the Barcelona attacks would be 500,000 protesters outside of mosques across Europe, shutting down dissemination of the supremacist Muslim ideology.

If you read the link that you posted then you will see Hizb ut-Tahrir advocate non violence :rolleyes:

Quite what events in Boston have to do with the topic of this thread you will have to explain.

Comparing the reactions to these two events is comparing apples and oranges; I suspect if a group of terrorists were to organise a public event in Europe then they would see some pushback?

Anyway the US has very large NGOs like the Black Lives Matter movement who can organise their members for such protests. Offhand I cannot think of any similar trans European NGOs?

How easily people like you forget the major reaction to the Charles Hebdo massacre?

kriss kross 27.08.2017 14:32

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Blueangel (Post 2837713)
Just to take this a bit further...

It's like an eternal game of chess. We are the pawns and we keep being sacrificed to protect the king and queen. We're collateral damage, and if you ever doubt that, just go to the Excel centre in London 4-11 September (if you can find a way to get into the place), and see what 'the west' are flogging to some seriously dodgy regimes.

The honest man has the highest price, and in 2005, GWB 'bought' Pakistan as an ally in the war on terror for the princely sum of 8 F-16 fighter jets, which they promptly flew over the biggest democracy in the World, India. His dad gifted Saddam an 'irrigation system' as a thank you for winning the Iran-Iraq war, much against the advice of the security agencies who pointed out that the components of said 'irrigation system' could also be used to make WMDs. Scroll back a bit further and you'll find Jimmy Carter supplying black market weapons to the Mujahideen via Sweden during the Russian invasion of Afghanistan.

Those are just three, well documented and in the public domain, examples of where 'the west' has royally screwed things up. There are dozens and dozens more examples from various western countries, and every time there's a terrorist attack in the west, it proves that us pawns are still paying the price for the numb ers in government playing chess without reaching the end game.

Islamic terrorist attacks and conquests existed long before 'the West' began meddling in the Middle East.

Islam is, at least partially, responsible for the problems we are seeing today.

pilatus1 27.08.2017 14:34

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Blueangel (Post 2837713)
Just to take this a bit further...

It's like an eternal game of chess. We are the pawns and we keep being sacrificed to protect the king and queen......., and every time there's a terrorist attack in the west, it proves that us pawns are still paying the price for the numb ers in government playing chess without reaching the end game.

.

All true - but what's missing from the analogy, is that our 'kings and queens' are selling us out, they're making terrible sacrifices and letting the opponent's pawns advance unchecked. Inviting them in.

At this rate, Europe and Western classical liberalism will be easily check mated by Islam. Or the West will just forfeit...

50 years? 100 years?

marton 27.08.2017 14:44

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by pilatus1 (Post 2837682)
Nope. Only since Mohammed.


The disease being Islam, and it's worst symptoms being Islamic terrorism and Sharia law.

If Islam is the problem that you and others claim then can one of you please explain why Western Europe with over 20 million Muslims is not a smouldering wasteland?

Not sure what reasons you have against Sharia law being used in Muslim countries?
Anyway most Muslim majority countries have replaced Sharia with Western style criminal laws. Often they retain Sharia for personal law (marriage, divorce, domestic violence, child support, family law, inheritance and such matters)

marton 27.08.2017 14:47

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kriss kross (Post 2837731)
Islamic terrorist attacks and conquests existed long before 'the West' began meddling in the Middle East.

Islam is, at least partially, responsible for the problems we are seeing today.

What definition are you using for the Islamic terrorist attacks you claim existed long before 'the West' began meddling in the Middle East?

Conquests do not need explanation.

I assume you do not consider the Crusades as 'the West' meddling in the Middle East. :rolleyes:

kriss kross 27.08.2017 14:50

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by marton (Post 2837737)
If Islam is the problem that you and others claim then can one of you please explain why Western Europe with over 20 million Muslims is not a smouldering wasteland?

Most neighborhoods in Western Europe that have large Muslim communities are shitholes though :confused:

Castro 27.08.2017 14:56

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kriss kross (Post 2837741)
Most neighborhoods in Western Europe that have large Muslim communities are shitholes though :confused:

You are treading on thin ice KK, any more of your hate and you will be off on one.

pilatus1 27.08.2017 15:01

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by marton (Post 2837739)
What definition are you using for the Islamic terrorist attacks you claim existed long before 'the West' began meddling in the Middle East?

Conquests do not need explanation.

I assume you do not consider the Crusades as 'the West' meddling in the Middle East. :rolleyes:

ahem..

http://www.thelatinlibrary.com/imper...slamchron.html

esto 27.08.2017 15:02

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Regardless of money and geopolitics, the fact remains that there's a problem with Islamic extremists. There is no shortage of people willing to kill and die for Islam, every day, around the globe. Even if the West never set foot in the ME, or who built Sadams sewer system. It's an ideology.

parnell 27.08.2017 15:07

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Castro (Post 2837744)
You are treading on thin ice KK, any more of your hate and you will be off on one.

Why threaten him ? Why not dispute his statement with facts perhaps ???

marton 27.08.2017 15:19

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by kriss kross (Post 2837741)
Most neighborhoods in Western Europe that have large Muslim communities are shitholes though :confused:

You mean like South Kensington :rolleyes:

marton 27.08.2017 15:21

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by marton (Post 2837739)
What definition are you using for the Islamic terrorist attacks you claim existed long before 'the West' began meddling in the Middle East?

Conquests do not need explanation.

I assume you do not consider the Crusades as 'the West' meddling in the Middle East. :rolleyes:

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilatus1 (Post 2837749)

I did write "Conquests do not need explanation." :rolleyes:

And

What definition are you using for the Islamic terrorist attacks you claim existed long before 'the West' began meddling in the Middle East?

Medea Fleecestealer 27.08.2017 15:23

Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Castro (Post 2837744)
You are treading on thin ice KK, any more of your hate and you will be off on one.

Why? For speaking the truth? It's well known that a lot of the problems in France are due to Muslim communities living in bad conditions and that's probably true for a lot of other places. If you don't think that true, have a look at this:

http://www.express.co.uk/news/world/...s-France-Paris

This isn't news or hate, it's simply fact. Just the same as it was for Italian ghettos, Jewish ghettos, Polish ghettos, etc, etc, in major cities around the world for centuries. What do you think the East End of London was back in Jack the Ripper's time - one big ghetto of foreigners.

There are probably still Jewish, Polish, Italian, etc, etc, ghettos in major cities around the world. Muslims aren't exclusive to this phenomenon.


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