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01.09.2017, 15:23
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | Turkey a core power? 
Since the dramatic failure of their "Policy of Zero Problems with our Neighbors" they have practically no good relations with their neighbours.- The government in Baghdad, far from seeing Mr. Erdogan as “the president of all Muslims,” considers the Turkish military an occupying force.
- They backed the wrong horse in Egypt which destroyed their relationship.
- They destroyed an excellent relationship with Israel to try to gain some points with the Arabs.
- Syria they are backing the rebels who now look likely to lose.
- Greece; they are almost enemies.
| | | | | yes, but they're still an economic powerhouse. Lots of manufacturing going on, also infrastructure, tourism etc. So maybe they don't have the respect politically, but the region still largely looks up to them. Possibly the only other country in the region that comes anywhere near the mark is Egypt. Egypt has an important film industry and publishing houses with clients all over the Arab world. Also their dialect is pretty much universally understood (even if not necessarily liked) And with that there comes a certain degree of influence and trend setting.
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01.09.2017, 15:24
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
You mean, a forum where people can go to discuss their opinions on topics? Life? Politics? Religion? Sounds like the village square, which has existed wherever humans have gathered...
It is the "White Nights" like you who think stifling opinions which YOU deem wrong or bigoted who do the most damage to democracy. Why should any of the religions you mention be off limits to commentary?
Bigotry, racism, fascism, communism, libtard, Nazi are seriously overused in discussion these days and really just seem to mean, "I don't agree with you and you are a BAD person." | Quote: | |  | | | I imagine this means we'll be seeing new threads for all the bigots to express their take on Jews, Christians, Buddhists and the thousands of other religions out there.
Might be more efficient, however, to just have one megathread for bigotry in general | | | | | | The following 2 users would like to thank fduvall for this useful post: | | 
01.09.2017, 15:35
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | Yes they are. | | | | | Apart from anything else Turkey has little money versus the neighbouring oil rich states, the credit rating agencies have Turkey rated at junk!
Inflation and unemployment both running at 10%.
Last year, Turkey adopted a new method for calculating gross domestic product, the key indicator of national economies.
The retroactive revision made Turkey the fastest growing country after China in the past six years, "readjusting" GDP upward by 20%.
Controversy over the credibility of the new method flared up again last week as Ankara posted a 5% growth rate for the first quarter. Source | 
01.09.2017, 15:35
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | Excellent idea. | | | | | I also said something like that, but my post got deleted  Actually, I've had several posts deleted in this thread the last few days.. Mostly statistics about killing in the name of Islam versus other religions. Seems it is offending somebody? | Quote: | |  | | | Global problems?
Millions died in Congo, between 3 and 5 million and ongoing
Around 50,000 died in the US in 2016 from drug overdose.
Over 10,000 war deaths in Ukraine to date.
More than 10,000 murders in Mexico this year so far.
Over 13,000 murders in Duterte's drug war Philippines
460 murders this year so far in Chicago.
Compare this with around 60 people killed by Islamic terrorists in EU this year! | | | | | Here's some stats regarding Islamic terrorism.
This is from 2014: | Quote: |  | | | The firm's analysts found that in the 12 months before July 1 there were 18,668 fatalities compared to an average of 14,443 for the five years before that - a 29.3% increase.
Over the same period, 9,471 attacks were recorded - an average of 26 a day - down from a five-year average of 10,468. | | | | | http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worl...-deadlier.html
Wikipedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...rorist_attacks | The following 2 users would like to thank esto for this useful post: | | 
01.09.2017, 15:53
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | I also said something like that, but my post got deleted  | | | | | I don't have any fear to discuss about different religions or ideologies. It's rather disgraceful that the topic's title refers to people and not to ideas, as if there was only one way to interpret a religion. No, not all muslims and not all christians or buddhists are the same. A big human pot that is either good or bad is such a silly approach.
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01.09.2017, 16:27
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | I also said something like that, but my post got deleted Actually, I've had several posts deleted in this thread the last few days.. Mostly statistics about killing in the name of Islam versus other religions. Seems it is offending somebody?  | | | | | Kriss kross got banned for a month , bunch of my posts got deleted too - last one was about religious persecution in Pakistan and arguments refuting "it's only a tiny minority"... | Quote: | |  | | | | | | | | How does that compare against Christian terrorist attacks ?
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01.09.2017, 19:10
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | | | | | | If you go to the original Maplecroft site that was the source of the Telegraph report then you will see this is a report on all terrorism, not just Islamic terrorism.
Also in the Maplecroft site they say Russia is at an extreme (the highest rating) risk level.
None of the major Western economies fall within the high or ‘extreme risk’ bracket – United States (33), France (44) and United Kingdom (46) all remain in the ‘medium risk’ category, whilst Canada (67) and Germany (70) are rated as ‘low risk.’
Interesting "low" rating for Germany when there is so much anxiety about refugees here
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01.09.2017, 20:12
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | 
01.09.2017, 20:17
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
Did you read the report? I didn't notice any other "extremist" groups mentioned in there, other than Islamic ones.
I'm curious to see a credible report that compares killings in the names of religion, based on the religion. One CNN article... | Quote: |  | | | (CNN)Last year was the most violent for Christians in modern history, rising to "a level akin to ethnic cleansing," according to a new report by Open Doors USA, a watchdog group that advocates for Christians.
In total, the survey found that more than 7,100 Christians were killed in 2015 for "faith-related reasons," up 3,000 from the previous year
According to the report, however, much of the persecution faced by Christians occurs in predominantly Muslim nations, many of which are "failed states" that fail to protect any of their citizens' religious liberty.
Curry said that while "Islamic extremism is one of the driving forces" of Christian persecution, "peace-loving Muslims can make an impact on that part of their culture." | | | | | http://edition.cnn.com/2016/01/17/wo...015/index.html | 
01.09.2017, 23:27
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | Did you read the report? I didn't notice any other "extremist" groups mentioned in there, other than Islamic ones.
I'm curious to see a credible report that compares killings in the names of religion, based on the religion. One CNN article... http://edition.cnn.com/2016/01/17/wo...015/index.html | | | | | Yeas, I did read the report; the introduction says "The Maplecroft Terrorism and Security Dashboard (MTSD) is a new interactive mapping platform, which logs, analyses and plots all reported incidents of terrorism, piracy, political violence and human rights abuses by security forces down to 100m² worldwide."
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02.09.2017, 08:11
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | Did you read the report? I didn't notice any other "extremist" groups mentioned in there, other than Islamic ones.
I'm curious to see a credible report that compares killings in the names of religion, based on the religion. One CNN article... http://edition.cnn.com/2016/01/17/wo...015/index.html | | | | | The persecution of Christians is widely spread outside the Western world, unfortunately. Take India which has only 2% if you can imagine...aprox. 80% of population are Hindu.
In North Korea every kind of religion is forbidden with the exception of that monstrous personality cult. https://www.theguardian.com/world/20...ck-study-shows | Quote: |  | | | There was also an increase in Christian persecution across the region “driven by extreme religious nationalism, which is often tacitly condoned – and sometimes actively encouraged – by local and national governments”, said Lisa Pearce, of Open Doors UK & Ireland. The watchdog estimated that a church was burnt down or a cleric beaten on average 10 times a week in India in the year to 31 October 2016, a threefold increase on the previous year.
“There is a clear pattern of rising religious intolerance across the Indian sub-continent, which affects many millions of Christians,” said Pearce.
“Religious nationalists attempt to forcibly convert people to the dominant faith of their nation, often turning to violence when community discrimination and non-violent oppression do not succeed in imposing their religious beliefs on minority Christians. | | | | |
Last edited by greenmount; 02.09.2017 at 08:36.
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02.09.2017, 15:26
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | Interesting "low" rating for Germany when there is so much anxiety about refugees here  | | | | | Ah Germany that bastion of open thought. First close eyes and mouth to cologne attacks, pretend they didnt happen for a while, proceed with sacking some spapegoats because it was a decision at `local`level, and then stifle all criticism of allowing hundreds of thousands of migrants to europe with attacks of racism. All the while also denying terror attack increases are unrelated. Yes, lots to believe there.
Wouldnt be surprised if they classed the christmas market attack in Berlin under `road accident`.
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02.09.2017, 18:19
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
What believe and express on FB vs. irl topics of conversation is probably vastly different.
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02.09.2017, 18:25
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | Ah Germany that bastion of open thought. First close eyes and mouth to cologne attacks, pretend they didnt happen for a while, proceed with sacking some spapegoats because it was a decision at `local`level, and then stifle all criticism of allowing hundreds of thousands of migrants to europe with attacks of racism. All the while also denying terror attack increases are unrelated. Yes, lots to believe there.
Wouldnt be surprised if they classed the christmas market attack in Berlin under `road accident`. | | | | | Had 9/11 occurred in Germany it would have been a structural failure that brought down the twin towers.
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03.09.2017, 10:31
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
A great article on the strange reality of being a secular ex-muslim and the hypocrisy of the pseudoliberal Left: On Betrayal by the Left
" The betrayal of the left has really hurt us, because in principle these people should be on our side, standing shoulder-to-shoulder with us in our efforts to reform Islam and bring human and women’s rights to Islamic countries. But they’re barring the gate, telling us we’re ‘Islamophobic’ or spurring hatred toward Muslims or contributing to a hostile atmosphere for them. "
...
"Haider concludes that “If the left doesn’t take up this issue” – that is, start speaking honestly about Islam and its demerits – “they’re letting the right take it, and people end up looking to Donald Trump to protect them from terror, from morals that are rooted in the ideas of centuries ago. And that’s outrageous. Of course Trump isn’t the solution. But you’ve placed people in a situation where they feel they have no other choice. It’s only going to get worse if the left refuses to even engage with these ideas.”
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03.09.2017, 10:42
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | A great article on the strange reality of being a secular ex-muslim and the hypocrisy of the pseudoliberal Left: On Betrayal by the Left
" The betrayal of the left has really hurt us, because in principle these people should be on our side, standing shoulder-to-shoulder with us in our efforts to reform Islam and bring human and women’s rights to Islamic countries. But they’re barring the gate, telling us we’re ‘Islamophobic’ or spurring hatred toward Muslims or contributing to a hostile atmosphere for them. "
...
"Haider concludes that “If the left doesn’t take up this issue” – that is, start speaking honestly about Islam and its demerits – “they’re letting the right take it, and people end up looking to Donald Trump to protect them from terror, from morals that are rooted in the ideas of centuries ago. And that’s outrageous. Of course Trump isn’t the solution. But you’ve placed people in a situation where they feel they have no other choice. It’s only going to get worse if the left refuses to even engage with these ideas.” | | | | | Thanks | Quote: |  | | | some on the left treat her to mind-bending lectures about how Western imperialism is to blame for terrorist atrocities nowadays committed in Islam’s name, though the faith (with its attendant violence, misogyny, and warmongering) originated almost a thousand years before the imperialist era began.
“This is dehumanizing,” Haider tells me. “It’s as if Eastern peoples have no agency, we’re just acted upon. But I can tell you about Islamic cruelty and how they treated women and homosexuals long before the West was even in the picture.
[For those leftists] it’s as if history started in colonized countries when the West came.” | | | | | You also see here posts about "Western imperialism is to blame for terrorist atrocities nowadays" | 
03.09.2017, 10:48
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) Rohingya crisis: Johnson warns Suu Kyi over Muslim treatment
Foreign Secretary Boris Johnson has warned Myanmar's Aung San Suu Kyi that the treatment of the Muslim Rohingya is "besmirching" the country's reputation.
Mr Johnson called on Ms Suu Kyi, the country's de facto leader, to "use her remarkable qualities" to end prejudice against Muslims in Rakhine state.
Violence in the province erupted about a week ago, with some 58,000 refugees fleeing to neighbouring Bangladesh.
More than 100 people are thought to have died in the violence.
The Rohingya claim that security forces and Buddhist mobs of burning their villages.
Security officials in Myanmar, also known as Burma, claim they are reacting to more than 20 attacks on police posts by Muslim Rohingya militants.
Rakhine, the poorest region in Myanmar, is home to more than a million Rohingya. They have faced decades of persecution in the Buddhist-majority country, where they are not considered citizens.
Ms Suu Kyi won the Nobel Peace Prize for her political activism in Myanmar, which led to the first non-military elected head of state in the country since the military coup in 1962.
Although Htin Kyaw was sworn in as president in 2016 - as Ms Suu Kyi is constitutionally barred from holding the position - she is considered the de facto leader of the country.
Ms Suu Kyi, who has the title state counsellor of Myanmar, came to prominence in the 1990s when she was placed under house arrest by the military government.
Mr Johnson said: "Aung San Suu Kyi is rightly regarded as one of the most inspiring figures of our age, but the treatment of the Rohingya is alas besmirching the reputation of Burma.
"She faces huge challenges in modernising her country. I hope she can now use all her remarkable qualities to unite her country, to stop the violence and to end the prejudice that afflicts both Muslims and other communities in Rakhine.
"It is vital that she receives the support of the Burmese military, and that her attempts at peacemaking are not frustrated.
"She and all in Burma will have our full support in this."
Burma Campaign UK - which lobbies European governments in a bid to restore human rights and democracy in Burma - believes the foreign secretary could have gone further in his remarks.
Its director, Mark Farmaner, said Mr Johnson should have also criticised the armed forces' commander-in-chief, Ming Aung Hlaing.
He said: "Min Aung Hlaing's soldiers are the ones killing hundreds of Rohingya and he is the only person in Burma with the power to order soldiers to stop attacking Rohingya villagers, shooting children and burning families alive in their homes." Source | The following 4 users would like to thank Castro for this useful post: | | 
03.09.2017, 14:10
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)
i feel sick from lots of stupid here. or politely "un justice".
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03.09.2017, 14:44
| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | i feel sick from lots of stupid here. or politely "un justice". | | | | | Could you expand upon this? What, exactly, do you find unjust and stupid?
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03.09.2017, 18:23
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| | Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe) | Quote: | |  | | | A great article on the strange reality of being a secular ex-muslim and the hypocrisy of the pseudoliberal Left: On Betrayal by the Left
" The betrayal of the left has really hurt us, because in principle these people should be on our side, standing shoulder-to-shoulder with us in our efforts to reform Islam and bring human and women’s rights to Islamic countries. But they’re barring the gate, telling us we’re ‘Islamophobic’ or spurring hatred toward Muslims or contributing to a hostile atmosphere for them. "
...
"Haider concludes that “If the left doesn’t take up this issue” – that is, start speaking honestly about Islam and its demerits – “they’re letting the right take it, and people end up looking to Donald Trump to protect them from terror, from morals that are rooted in the ideas of centuries ago. And that’s outrageous. Of course Trump isn’t the solution. But you’ve placed people in a situation where they feel they have no other choice. It’s only going to get worse if the left refuses to even engage with these ideas.” | | | | | What if they don't tell anyone they're ex-Muslims? As a Christian at least, when you stop believing you don't tell anyone, why should you. Or you do, and apart from "why, oh, you are so wrong blah blah blah" nothing happens, people get on with their lives.
Not that I condone those reactions, mind, but one should find a way to be what they want to be.
Btw, most probably the same bakery wouldn't have any problem to write "Happy birthday ex-Christians" on top of a cake. | Quote: |  | | | The mainstream media, she says, seem not to care about their plight. She adduces an example: the June 2016 incident in which EXMNA called the local Wegman’s bakery and ordered a cake emblazoned with “Happy Three-Year Anniversary, Ex-Muslims!” The management refused to take their order, worried that such “inflammatory” verbiage might offend its Muslim employees. The Freedom from Religion foundation eventually intervened – businesses cannot deny services based on a customer’s faith or lack thereof – and Wegman’s relented. The rightwing press and blogosphere publicized the affair, but few other news outlets did. It goes without saying that similar incidents not long ago generated great public sympathy when the victims were gays.
Haider is still outraged. “When I read a news article about how a woman’s hijab was pulled off or how a stewardess refuses to give a Muslim woman an unopened can of Coke, it’s national news. But no one covers what we’re going through, no one covers our persecution. Of course we know there’s anti-Muslim bigotry, and that’s being covered. But our struggle should be covered as well. It’s appalling that our pain isn’t worth discussing. In fact, we’re often painted as the victimizers.”
That the rightwing media do at times report about them only leads to EXMNA being (wrongly) associated with the right.
The left’s rejection hurts all the more since the most menaced former Muslims are women. Female apostates, she tells me, face ostracism, beatings, harassment and threats from their families and communities, forced travel back to home countries to pry them free of Western influence, and forced marriage. | | | | | | This user would like to thank greenmount for this useful post: | |
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