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  #1841  
Old 09.03.2018, 12:30
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Before hitting back too hard here, it would be interesting to know if this is a regular occurence or something that has just happened on a couple of occasions.

Sometimes you have to go with the situation.

Supposing there was a football game and the airport was fillled with excited fans, singing their club songs loudly and generally being barstewards. There's probably a rule against that but the police would probably do well to turn a blind eye (within bounds) in order not to come across as too heavy handed and potentially make things worse.

Or suppose, say, a bunch of schoolkids spontaneously start singing their favourite song, and everybody else cringes at the horror if it.

If a couple of muslims get overly pious and similarly lose control of themselves, is that any different?

is it wrong?

If however this is being systematically organized as an act of provocation, the police should step up.

Either way, they're probably alienating way more people than they are impressing, so what is really in it for them?
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  #1842  
Old 09.03.2018, 12:39
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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If a couple of muslims get overly pious and similarly lose control of themselves, is that any different?

is it wrong?

If however this is being systematically organized as an act of provocation, the police should step up.

Either way, they're probably alienating way more people than they are impressing, so what is really in it for them?
In Zurich there is often a gobby religious nut yelling at the top of his lungs in the street (impressively loud voice, by the way!). Most people just walk past him, either give him the Swiss stare or just carry on their way, ignoring him.

There are also Christian groups waving leaflets at people as they walk by and doing whatever they can to flag you down to engage you. I've never seen anyone even break stride.

Having a bunch of muslims setting up prayer time in a busy airport where people's main (if not only) goal is to get to their gate on time, I don't see how it's going to cause an avalanche of random religious conversions.

Noisy and annoying maybe. Religious agenda? Nah...
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  #1843  
Old 09.03.2018, 13:40
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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In Zurich there is often a gobby religious nut yelling at the top of his lungs in the street (impressively loud voice, by the way!). Most people just walk past him, either give him the Swiss stare or just carry on their way, ignoring him.

There are also Christian groups waving leaflets at people as they walk by and doing whatever they can to flag you down to engage you. I've never seen anyone even break stride.
But CH is a Christian country
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  #1844  
Old 09.03.2018, 13:44
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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But CH is a Christian country
And they have protection to ensure religious freedom. So?

It's still irritating people tooting their religion (whatever it might be - Christian/Muslim/Jedi).

Was just agreeing that the "ramming down your throat in the street" approach tends to turn off more people than it converts.
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  #1845  
Old 09.03.2018, 14:12
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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I would feel this way about any religion, culture or tour group that I find disruptive.

Your thoughts?
I agree with you because your opinions are very even handed. If it's a regular occurrence, there needs to be some consultation to resolve the matter amicably.
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  #1846  
Old 09.03.2018, 16:09
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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Before hitting back too hard here, it would be interesting to know if this is a regular occurence or something that has just happened on a couple of occasions.
According to the article, security personnel say it's a weekly occurrence, before the departure of a group of flights to muslim countries.

How often do you have a loudspeaker on you when you travel? That alone says it's planned. And yes, it's an abuse of public space.
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  #1847  
Old 09.03.2018, 16:30
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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http://www.20min.ch/schweiz/romandie...lobby-26640526

It seems Muslims are praying and using loudspeakers at the Geneva airport. There is an assigned room available for prayer but for whatever reason, they have chosen to pray in the lobby instead.

My thoughts on this:

1. Loudspeaker? I find this highly intrusive, and to be honest, arrogant. It would also bother me if kids play loud music too. Can't prayer be done quietly?

2. I realize that perhaps due to flight times, they might not have time to use the prayer room. However, if their prayer in the lobby had nothing to do with time issues, then I would feel anger towards their arrogance in not respecting my wishes, and the policy of the airport, of keeping the lobby a neutral place.

I would feel this way about any religion, culture or tour group that I find disruptive.

Your thoughts?
Perhaps they are scared of flying and just want their prayers heard. what constitutes a loudspeaker? a mobile phone speaker? then is that worse then a stroppy teen on a bus listening to grime? Equally irritating, but a lot of people have no social etiquette even in Switzerland!
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  #1848  
Old 30.03.2018, 11:04
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Very good common sense article from NYT on the situation in Germany with regards to Islam and the problems of integration.

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Many Germans just don’t believe that Islam is compatible with Western values
Funny, I was banned from EF for expressing this exact sentiment.
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  #1849  
Old 30.03.2018, 23:05
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

This lady says it all:

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  #1850  
Old 30.03.2018, 23:18
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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Very good common sense article from NYT on the situation in Germany with regards to Islam and the problems of integration.

Source


Funny, I was banned from EF for expressing this exact sentiment.
You did read the last three paragraphs of the article you posted then? You don't offer ideas as to how Islam can be compatible with western values, KK you just hate the religion and the people who follow it.
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  #1851  
Old 30.03.2018, 23:24
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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This lady says it all:

An antagonistic old bag. Those kids were just fronting her for being so. She rants on about the war, yep they were the good ole days in Deutschland the Blitz spirit eh!
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  #1852  
Old 30.03.2018, 23:33
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Meanwhile in Ireland a report commissioned by "The Irish Human Rights and Equality Commission" finds that support for immigration is dropping and particularly against the Roma...

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Those surveyed were “very resistant” to allowing more Roma, with only 25pc saying they would allow many or some.
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The study revealed just under half of people born in Ireland believed some cultures are superior to others.
....

“The relatively high levels of discriminatory attitudes detailed in the study are a matter of concern,” said Ms Logan.
So cultures which place enormous burdens upon the receiving peoples and their tax base are perceived as being inferior...

Naturally enough the above is "concerning"
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  #1853  
Old 30.03.2018, 23:59
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)



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  #1854  
Old 31.03.2018, 00:32
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

That was three years ago!

The move was condemned as provocative by the Swedish LGBT activists, who organized their own counter-demonstration to protest what they saw as an appropriation of the LGBT cause for the sake of xenophobia.

30 or so people showed up to demonstrate, they were far outnumbered by the counter-demonstration.

No clue what your point is?
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  #1855  
Old 31.03.2018, 08:52
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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You did read the last three paragraphs of the article you posted then? You don't offer ideas as to how Islam can be compatible with western values, KK you just hate the religion and the people who follow it.
You should read the comments on the article as well, they're also great:

'Speaking as someone very much on the left, when it comes to Islam, the left has completely lost the plot. In 2018 it is totally fine – even admirable – to criticize Christianity and Christians, but utter a word against Islam and Muslims and you’re instantly branded an Islamophobe.'
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  #1856  
Old 31.03.2018, 11:48
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

Begs the question kk, are you a practising Christian or just someone who identifies themself as being Christian?

I'll happily put my cards on the table as state I was raised Roman Catholic in a Catholic & Anglican family with Wesleyan Methodist and Jewish ancestry. After 20yrs sitting on the fence as an agnostic, I'm now a devout atheist.
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Old 31.03.2018, 12:03
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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Begs the question kk, are you a practising Christian or just someone who identifies themself as being Christian?

I'll happily put my cards on the table as state I was raised Roman Catholic in a Catholic & Anglican family with Wesleyan Methodist and Jewish ancestry. After 20yrs sitting on the fence as an agnostic, I'm now a devout atheist.
How can you be an atheist and defend Islam?
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  #1858  
Old 31.03.2018, 12:50
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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Begs the question kk, are you a practising Christian or just someone who identifies themself as being Christian?
I'm not a Christian.

Growing up I knew one Christian, the rest were irreligious or Muslim.

However, it's not hard to see the double standards, particularly from leftists, where they have no qualms about bashing Christianity yet won't do the same for Islam.
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Old 31.03.2018, 13:02
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

I’m agnostic, or perhaps lapsed Catholic. Mother was Catholic, Father Jewish.

I come from an extended family of assorted Catholics, Protestants of convenience (decided they wanted to marry someone divorced) evangelical Christians, and agnostics. Sadly, the Jews in my family have all died out. But the Christian side still has some fairly virulent anti Semitics. And anti Islam’s too...although I think they‘ve never met any Muslims and they easily forget that my father was a Jew....he‘s dead anyway.

I have Muslim friends of varying levels of devotion. Same with Jews, Catholics, other Christians.

I respect religious freedom, religion or lack thereof are belief systems. I don‘t respect anyone pushing their beliefs on me. I think that when you see a lot of different religions you see similarities rather than differences. I do anyway.


Radical Muslims are like radical Jews and radical Christans. All crazy.

As for the Muslims praying in GVA, I think a private space would be better. Although, if you‘ve ever flown the American flight from ZRH to JFK, there are usually a bunch of Hasidic Jews on the flight. Many times, flight attendants have to ask them to stop praying in the aisles so the flight attendants can do their jobs. It‘s the same thing, imho. I‘ve not taken this flight in a few years....maybe it‘s
Changed.

I am most uncomfortable around evangelical Christians actually.....because I feel they‘re trying to impose their system on me. Or maybe it‘s because some of them are relatives. Who knows. I am far from perfect.
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Old 31.03.2018, 13:09
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Re: All about Muslims (in the wake of terrorist attacks in Europe)

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Radical Muslims are like radical Jews and radical Christans. All crazy.
Right, but would say they are all exactly equal and pose an equal threat to civilization?

Or perhaps it one of them just a bit more of a threat than the others?
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