The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[SponPlague]

Interesting result in Wales: Labour came 3rd, their worst ever result there, behind 2 Brexit MEPs at the top and a Plaid, and how did their leader there describe the result? “Wales wants to remain”.

Best example I have come across of why ordinary voters think the main parties are hopelessly out-of-touch...

[lewton]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	Remarkable, these elections have completely redefined what it takes to win an election. From this day forth let it be known that you may add your votes to as many other parties as you wish in order to claim a comprehensive victory. Bravo Change UK!

You keep changing what the other side is saying in order to make it easier for you to answer to it.
Nobody said that Brexit Party did not win the election.
They won and they won big.

But Brexit did not win the election. It looks as possible as ever that in a people's vote people will not vote for the Hard Brexit that Farage envisions.
Which is why you are afraid of a people's vote.

[Mikers]

	Quote:	lewton
	You keep changing what the other side is saying in order to make it easier for you to answer to it. Nobody said that Brexit Party did not win the election. They won and they won big. But Brexit did not win the election. It looks as possible as ever that in a people's vote people will not vote for the Hard Brexit that Farage envisions. Which is why you are afraid of a people's vote.

I like this analogy.

	Quote:	lewton
	You keep changing what the other side is saying in order to make it easier for you to answer to it. Nobody said that Brexit Party did not win the election. They won and they won big. But Brexit did not win the election. It looks as possible as ever that in a people's vote people will not vote for the Hard Brexit that Farage envisions. Which is why you are afraid of a people's vote.

How did Brexit not win? I’m really puzzled? That chart from the BBC was one of the most blatant pieces of spin I’ve ever seen. How could they not consider the Tories as a Brexit party when their campaign line was “we are the only Party who can deliver Brexit”?!

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Mikers
	A re-vote has too much risk.

Must say, I find it incredible, and more than a little ironic, that Brexiteers are so risk adverse. They appear to have no concerns over a no deal Brexit but are pooping their pants over people putting a cross on a piece of paper. Simply astonishing!


A little light relief...

My favourite facts of the day, courtesy of Larry The Cat:

The Conservative Party has three times more candidates to be its leader than it has MEPs.

Scotland has more pandas (two) than Labour MEPs (zero]

50% of the Brexit Party’s North East MEPs live in the South of France

[Mikers]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Must say, I find it incredible, and more than a little ironic, that Brexiteers are so risk adverse. They appear to have no concerns over a no deal Brexit but are pooping their pants over people putting a cross on a piece of paper. Simply astonishing!

Its not Brexiteer topic, its a Democracy requirement. Also just to be clear personally I think we should stay in Europe in case thats been misconstrued. But the posting is about democracy - people supporting Remain should have the same point of view. Anyone saying "we need to let the people decide!" in that very uppity fashion need to have a structured response to the main risk case: If Remain win 51-49 on a lower turnout than before, what do we do next ?

	Quote:	Mikers
	I like this analogy.

It's an awful analogy.

[Mikers]

	Quote:
	It's an awful analogy.

its a funny analogy. lighten up for gods sake.

	Quote:	Mikers
	Its not Brexiteer topic, its a Democracy requirement. Also just to be clear personally I think we should stay in Europe in case thats been misconstrued. But the posting is about democracy - people supporting Remain should have the same point of view. Anyone saying "we need to let the people decide!" in that very uppity fashion need to have a structured response to the main risk case: If Remain win 51-49 on a lower turnout than before, what do we do next ?

It would be unequivocal, we could finally move on

	Quote:	Mikers
	its a funny analogy. lighten up for gods sake.

It's just a poor analogy, I don't see too much humour in it, even if as an Arsenal fan it would be the nearest we've got to winning the league in quite some time!

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Loz1983
	How could they not consider the Tories as a Brexit party when their campaign line was “we are the only Party who can deliver Brexit”?!

It's all down to the semantics again, same as with the original EU Referendum ballot paperwork when it said "this government will..."

The government that was referred to in the referendum campaign paperwork was legally dissolved on 3 May 2017. End of. That's a simple fact and a matter of law which none of us can escape.

As for “we are the only Party who can deliver Brexit” from the 2017 GE Campaign, legally, only the National government can enact or prevent a no deal Brexit, or deal Brexit. With divisions amongst the Labour Party and membership over Brexit, UKIP exceptionally unlikely to ever be in a position to form a government, LD and Green resolutely backing Remain and a 2nd referendum, the Conservatives were (numbers based at the outset of the GE campaign) the only party that could deliver Brexit.

Now...I reckon we all agree that we can take Labour out of the equation whilst they're still impaling themselves straggling that barbed wire fence, but the Tories? There have been 30 or so consistent Tory MPs voting against the PM. That was nearly balanced out by your Kate Hoey types, but not enough. The 'One Nation Tories' have been running scared from the Blukippers. Let's see if they stand their ground to reclaim their party now.

Finally, in my local constituency Windsor & Maidenhead, the Brexit Party beat LD by 2%. Windsor Council is now one of the many constituencies being reported in a law suit over the people who were denied their vote, because they only dispatched their postal ballot papers on Tuesday 14th May. That pretty much excludes all their expat postal voters from having their vote counted. Other councils used a 3rd party mass mailing company that directed mail via the Netherlands to save money, causing thousands of ballots to be received too late.

https://britishineurope.org/2019/05/...the-5-million/

[amogles]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	LD, Green SNP and CHUK are absolutely clear. Only labour are unclear.

I'm not sure what's clear about the SNP.

They want a vote on Scottish independence which they want to win. And then they will start on long and protracted negotiations to join the EU on their own terms, which basically means being out of the EU for a long time.

So basically they are a party who wants to leave for the sake of rejoining. Or at least believes Brexit is inevitable, and sees it as part of their plan. So basically they are saying leave is the new remain.

If push comes to shove, the rest of UK may even back down out of the whole Brexit thing leaving an independent Scotland outside of both the UK and the EU.

The pro Brexit side is often accused of not having had a plan but just wanting to fudge it as it happened. It seems to me the SNP isn't any better in that regard.

[DanLF]

	Quote:
	It's just a poor analogy, I don't see too much humour in it, even if as an Arsenal fan it would be the nearest we've got to winning the league in quite some time!

As a Spurs fan, it's just insulting rather than funny, to be linked to Arsenal...

But good luck winning the Euro-Disney cup on Wednesday!

	Quote:	DanLF
	As a Spurs fan, it's just insulting rather than funny, to be linked to Arsenal... But good luck winning the Euro-Disney cup on Wednesday!

Good luck to you guys on Saturday too. It would be nice for you to win something not in black and white.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:
	Good luck to you guys on Saturday too. It would be nice for you to win something not in black and white.

Oooooooooo!!!!!

Still one of the best goals ever scored at Wembley, and in colour, and by the man who was my teenage heart throb. *swoon*

How does this work?

[omtatsat]

	Quote:	dawiz
	You’re the perfect SVP voter!

The EU is simply a puppet of the big corporations and vested interests and does not at all serve the interests of Mr Everyman.

[Blueangel]

Just two more things... Yesterday made me feel old because it was the 20th Anniversary of Man Utd vs Bayern and Ole Gunnar Solskjaer's magical Super Sub performance. Still remember it like it was yesterday, watching the match in the pub with my mates, nervously peeling the label off my bottle of Diamond White.

Secondly, seeing as the Brexit Party got 5.2million votes last night, what happened to the other 12.2million?

[omtatsat]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Just two more things... Yesterday made me feel old because it was the 20th Anniversary of Man Utd vs Bayern and Ole Gunnar Solskjaer's magical Super Sub performance. Still remember it like it was yesterday, watching the match in the pub with my mates, nervously peeling the label off my bottle of Diamond White. Secondly, seeing as the Brexit Party got 5.2million votes last night, what happened to the other 12.2million?

They were all on the toilet with chronic diarrhoea

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	omtatsat
	The EU is simply a puppet of the big corporations and vested interests and does not at all serve the interests of Mr Everyman.

Well done, don't let facts interfere with your opinion whatever you do.

[omtatsat]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	Well done, don't let facts interfere with your opinion whatever you do.

I have stated the facts. No problem there!