The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	k_and_e
	Would 24 hours be sufficient for a hard Brexit?

I may be wrong but, yes, as long as Boris becomes PM after June 30. Until then the Cooper-Letwin Act (passed in April) bans a no-deal Brexit.

	Quote:	Mikers
	how do you know anyone was screaming ? The people who reported it are far from neutral, the police said there was nothing to see, the guardian havent / won't release the recording. Right now, we have the words of two people who are about as far from neutral as you can get.

BoJo's lawyers have likely slapped an injunction on the recording. Let's not pretend that the Guardian is simply panicking because it's just a noisy coffee machine and a lively discussion about whether to buy a patio heater.

[Urs Max]

	Quote:	Mikers
	how do you know anyone was screaming ? The people who reported it are far from neutral, the police said there was nothing to see, the guardian havent / won't release the recording.

Aren't the conservatives (Tories) mostly remainers? Doesn't that make the two anti-remainers aka Brexiteers, which in turn should make them like Boris' position? So where's the logic in your diatribe?

[amogles]

	Quote:	marton
	I do not remember the Stasi modus operandi involved handing stuff to the Press?

maybe you ought to learn more about the Stasi's modus operandum.

	Quote:	Mikers
	how do you know anyone was screaming ? The people who reported it are far from neutral, the police said there was nothing to see, the guardian havent / won't release the recording. Right now, we have the words of two people who are about as far from neutral as you can get.

Are you suggesting the guardian have the full recording, but have decided to make something up instead of using it, knowing it will become public domain soon enough? Good logic.

There are multiple earwitnesses who have stated there was screaming. I think you're trying a bit too hard to deflect what is a pretty open and shut case.

[Mikers]

	Quote:
	Are you suggesting the guardian have the full recording, but have decided to make something up instead of using it, knowing it will become public domain soon enough? Good logic. There are multiple earwitnesses who have stated there was screaming. I think you're trying a bit too hard to deflect what is a pretty open and shut case.

No not at all, as you say more than one person heard it. I'd just like to hear it myself. it's open and shut in the sense that the Police thought so - they said there was nothing to do after all. So looking forward to being able to hear it, as everyone seems to have agreed that it's in "the public interest" to hear their private life.

	Quote:	Mikers
	No not at all, as you say more than one person heard it. I'd just like to hear it myself. it's open and shut in the sense that the Police thought so - they said there was nothing to do after all. So looking forward to being able to hear it, as everyone seems to have agreed that it's in "the public interest" to hear their private life.

Again, it isn't private if they are so loud the whole building can hear.
I wouldn't suggest a domestic you or I were having was public interest, but the man who is about to become PM? You'd better believe it.

Patience, we'll get to hear it soon enough I am sure. It will no doubt be fairly mundane, plus a bit of plate throwing.

The only slightly interesting bit was her telling him to get off her, and then her telling him to leave and him refusing. It seems leave doesn't really mean leave after all.

[Mikers]

	Quote:
	The only slightly interesting bit was her telling him to get off her, and then her telling him to leave and him refusing. It seems leave doesn't really mean leave after all.

now thats funny! 10/10 for sharp witted humour!

[marton]

	Quote:	Mikers
	So it's monday and the picture is at least a bit clearer, though still lots of questions really. Mr Pen and Ms Leigh, who called the police said at the time they 'voted to stay in the EU in the referendum but that is our entire involvement in politics'. A closer inspection now by the media has shown they wrote an EU Funded Anti-Brexit play, have been giving out vitriolic anti-conservative messages since 2012, have an almost personal hatred of Boris Johnson involving gesticulating, posters, swearing, you name it and having called the Police and then contacted the Guardian have disappeared and not been seen since, which is a bit odd seeing as they only did it out of concern for the welfare of the female resident in the adjoining flat. The other thing I'm really looking forward to is hearing the tape. The Guardian has it, they have an online website, they have certainly said it contains all sorts of shouting and screaming (though the Police didn't really think that was the case), so it would seem pretty clear - as this has been declared as "in the public interest" - that the recording has to be made public too, otherwise we are going on the words of two hard left anti-brexit fanatics who hate the Conservatives. Difficult to make a judgement call at the moment. By the way I hate Boris Johnson, I think he is the worst politician ever - even more than Corbyn - but this is just a witchhunt and it always wigs me out when lefties do this.

If I had the Press camped on my doorstep then I would disappear too!

I recommend you consider what you write in terms of your opinions of people; EF is a public forum so libel laws stand.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Mikers
	Right now, we have the words of two people who are about as far from neutral as you can get.

Three sets of neighbours from that building have said that they were disturbed by the argument with one person, crucially not one of the couple you have referred to, saying that "it sounded like someone was being murdered."

Now everyone is welcome to get their knickers in a twist about this all day long. That's their choice. However, as a survivor of domestic violence, I've found the last few days worth of media and social media to be more than a little disturbing. I'm eternally grateful to the neighbour who came to my aid and, in hindsight, I'm eternally grateful that she got the police involved, and we're still friends. At the time, I was literally terrified by the prospect of police involvement (which was minimal on that occasion), but it became crucial 15mths later (several months after we'd seperated) when I really needed them because they could instantly see a previous call out to my address.

I hate to read the line "all couple have shouty arguments". No they don't. In the 8yrs I've been with my partner, we've never lost our tempers with each other. We've disagreed and argued, but it's never escalated to shouting, things being smashed and neighbours being disturbed. For a domestic situation to reach the point that neighbours are "scared", think "someone is being murdered" and call the police, several lines of acceptable behaviour have been crossed.

There's something bothering me in all this, and it bothered me in the Johnny Depp / Amber Heard case too... What if the woman is the vilian of the piece? We don't know and the media are assuming that Boris is the villian because so many former colleagues and people in the media have witnessed his temper.

The Secret Barrister sums it all up beautifully...


https://twitter.com/BarristerSecret/...91302698545155


...and also explains the 1997 Harassment Act to a journo who was herself guilty of the same.

https://twitter.com/BarristerSecret/...72280082882560

[Mikers]

	Quote:	marton
	If I had the Press camped on my doorstep then I would disappear too! I recommend you consider what you write in terms of your opinions of people; EF is a public forum so libel laws stand.

well i got it all from the papers Marton, so I should be able to refer back.

You must be quaking a bit with the Loz situation though, if he can pursue you for damages for anything defamatory you have written about him on EF.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Mikers
	it's open and shut in the sense that the Police thought so - they said there was nothing to do after all.

The police role in such matters is to establish if all parties are safe, assess if a crime has been committed, take the heat out of the situation with a little mediation, ensure that all parties will remain safe once the police have left, and to then write up their report which will be noted against that particular address. If neither party makes a formal complaint against the other, and there is no evidence of physical violence, then they have 'nothing else to do' except write up their report.

[Mikers]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	The police role in such matters is to establish if all parties are safe, assess if a crime has been committed, take the heat out of the situation with a little mediation, ensure that all parties will remain safe once the police have left, and to then write up their report which will be noted against that particular address. If neither party makes a formal complaint against the other, and there is no evidence of physical violence, then they have 'nothing else to do' except write up their report.

Yep, and they did just that - no further action taken.

Anyway, it will all be clear soon because there is a recording of the incident, so when the Guardian release it, which they must do because its in the public interest, everyone can take their own call on it and we won't have to rely on the local statements.

	Quote:	Mikers
	Yep, and they did just that - no further action taken. Anyway, it will all be clear soon because there is a recording of the incident, so when the Guardian release it, which they must do because its in the public interest, everyone can take their own call on it and we won't have to rely on the local statements.

What if Boris has slapped an injunction on it?

You know - like public figures tend to do when they've been caught with their trousers down (figuratively or otherwise).

[Mikers]

	Quote:
	What if Boris has slapped an injunction on it? You know - like public figures tend to do when they've been caught with their trousers down (figuratively or otherwise).

What if the people who reported it have put an injunction on it ? They have, after all, disappeared without trace.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Mikers
	Anyway, it will all be clear soon because there is a recording of the incident, so when the Guardian release it,

I don't necessarily believe that will change anything. My neighbour lives directly opposite the house I own in the UK. The neighbours either side, both of whom I have a 20+ yr long friendship with, didn't hear anything because there was nothing to be heard. My neighbour called the police based upon what she saw one Saturday afternoon in broad daylight.

[Mikers]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	I don't necessarily believe that will change anything. My neighbour lives directly opposite the house I own in the UK. The neighbours either side, both of whom I have a 20+ yr long friendship with, didn't hear anything because there was nothing to be heard. My neighbour called the police based upon what she saw one Saturday afternoon in broad daylight.

I dont think you're tenants were standing for PM though ? Either its a private matter, because the police were called and decided not to take any further action so both boris and his partner carry on living their private life privately.

Otherwise it isn't. if it isnt, then we have the views of two now vanished people who reported it plus quotes from other unnamed residents via newspapers. If its in the public interest, then it should be public and the public can then make their own opinion on how this reflects on his character and not have to rely on the view delivered by newspapers.

	Quote:	Mikers
	What if the people who reported it have put an injunction on it ? They have, after all, disappeared without trace.

Why would they do that? What would have been the point of submitting it in the first place if you then have to lay out huge legal expenses to stop a national newspaper from releasing it?

I think it's patently clear that they've left their house because of the seething pack of journos camped outside.

If you are fancying a conspiracy theory or two, what about the angle that Boris has paid a couple of hitmen to "deal with them"? He's got form, apparently, after being recorded another time dallying with just such a scenario.

	Quote:
	If you are fancying a conspiracy theory or two, what about the angle that Boris has paid a couple of hitmen to "deal with them"? He's got form, apparently, after being recorded another time dallying with just such a scenario.

He was too incompetent to find the address of the journo his mate wanted to send the hit-squad round to though That's the man we want leading our fine, sceptered isles.

[Mikers]

	Quote:
	Why would they do that? What would have been the point of submitting it in the first place if you then have to lay out huge legal expenses to stop a national newspaper from releasing it? I think it's patently clear that they've left their house because of the seething pack of journos camped outside. If you are fancying a conspiracy theory or two, what about the angle that Boris has paid a couple of hitmen to "deal with them"? He's got form, apparently, after being recorded another time dallying with just such a scenario.

Yes must be pretty awful, perfectly normal thing to do. So with them unfairly out of the picture because they are just timid citizens who were concerned for the safety of the residents of Boris's apartment then poor old Boris is skewered:

If he has got an injunction and it was just a row, then no one will know and he can carry on being accused of being unfit for office.

If he allows its release and it turns out he was beating up his girlfriend - or vice versa - then he's going to get another visit from the Police and he's had it PM-bid wise.

Either way, he's cooked.