Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Off-Topic > Off-Topic > International affairs/politics  
View Poll Results: What would you personally prefer to happen?
I want the UK to stay in an ever-closer union 49 23.11%
I want the UK to stay in a loosely connected EU 68 32.08%
I want the UK out because the EU is bad for the UK 22 10.38%
I want the UK out because the EU is a bad thing 23 10.85%
I want the UK out because this would be good for the rest of us 17 8.02%
I don't really care 33 15.57%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #20761  
Old 04.07.2019, 10:12
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Oh, you think Brazil has better welfare standards than in the US? Bless.
Also, both you and Sandgrounder missed the fact that the embargo’s haven’t worked:
Oh and finally perhaps “killed” was the wrong word, but chlorine washed chicken has been proven unequivocally to reduce the prevalence of salmonella in chicken meat.
You are using the salmonella thing to somehow ham-fistedly justify the chlorinated thing and it's just not working.

There are CHECKS at the border to the EU which has identified that there are some batches of contaminated meat and the report says there *could* be some that has got through undetected. Given that there doesn't seem to have been a major breakout of salmonella is probably down the fact people are cooking it thoroughly.

You can't "cook out" bleach from meat.

I'm still not sure what point you are trying to make. Are you trying to say because the EU has managed to "perhaps" allow salmonella-infected shipments of chicken into the EU they should now allow bleachy chicken because it's basically the same thing? I don't get what you're on about or trying to prove.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank for this useful post:
  #20762  
Old 04.07.2019, 10:24
baboon's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Rheintal
Posts: 3,317
Groaned at 128 Times in 113 Posts
Thanked 5,508 Times in 2,638 Posts
baboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Oh and finally perhaps “killed” was the wrong word, but chlorine washed chicken has been proven unequivocally to reduce the prevalence of salmonella in chicken meat.
By up to 90% apparently. Which according to recent research makes no meaningful difference to your change of getting infected from it.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank baboon for this useful post:
  #20763  
Old 04.07.2019, 10:26
Fish Paste's Avatar
Forum Veteran
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: North
Posts: 996
Groaned at 39 Times in 24 Posts
Thanked 1,351 Times in 624 Posts
Fish Paste has a reputation beyond reputeFish Paste has a reputation beyond reputeFish Paste has a reputation beyond reputeFish Paste has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Jeremy Hunt's latest wheeze to appeal to tories, repeal the fox hunting ban.


That's a vote winner if ever I saw one.


Boris Johnson to employ another 20,000 police. Police that the tories cut over the previous years.


At least it's a bit more appealing than the irrelevant fox hunting though.
Reply With Quote
  #20764  
Old 04.07.2019, 16:24
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
You are using the salmonella thing to somehow ham-fistedly justify the chlorinated thing and it's just not working.

There are CHECKS at the border to the EU which has identified that there are some batches of contaminated meat and the report says there *could* be some that has got through undetected. Given that there doesn't seem to have been a major breakout of salmonella is probably down the fact people are cooking it thoroughly.

You can't "cook out" bleach from meat.

I'm still not sure what point you are trying to make. Are you trying to say because the EU has managed to "perhaps" allow salmonella-infected shipments of chicken into the EU they should now allow bleachy chicken because it's basically the same thing? I don't get what you're on about or trying to prove.
You fail to grasp the double standards of not wanting a trade deal with the US based on food standards grounds due to chlorinated chicken whilst already importing substandard chicken from Brazil.

And it’s chlorine they’re washed in, not bleach. Just like prepackaged salad in the EU.
Reply With Quote
  #20765  
Old 04.07.2019, 16:27
baboon's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Rheintal
Posts: 3,317
Groaned at 128 Times in 113 Posts
Thanked 5,508 Times in 2,638 Posts
baboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
You fail to grasp the double standards of not wanting a trade deal with the US based on food standards grounds due to chlorinated chicken whilst already importing substandard chicken from Brazil.

And it’s chlorine they’re washed in, not bleach. Just like prepackaged salad in the EU.
Chlorine IS (basically) bleach. Learn a little chemistry.
Reply With Quote
  #20766  
Old 04.07.2019, 16:30
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Chlorine IS (basically) bleach. Learn a little chemistry.
Prove the chemicals used to rinse chicken in the US are bleach. Take your time Mr Chemistry teacher.
Reply With Quote
  #20767  
Old 04.07.2019, 16:48
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
You fail to grasp the double standards of not wanting a trade deal with the US based on food standards grounds due to chlorinated chicken whilst already importing substandard chicken from Brazil.

And it’s chlorine they’re washed in, not bleach. Just like prepackaged salad in the EU.
Your point still doesn't stand.

1) The current standard forbids chicken contaminated with salmonella to be imported.

It was. It got picked up BECAUSE of the checks. Some got through - boooo, but maybe they will refine those checks and standards.

2) The current standard forbids chicken contaminated with chlorination processes (or however you want to label it) to be imported.

If it comes to the border in that state it will be stopped.

You are making the point as if salmonella-infected meat is allowed into the EU, and if that's the case, why isn't chlorinated meat.

The two concepts don't relate.

Quote:
View Post
Prove the chemicals used to rinse chicken in the US are bleach. Take your time Mr Chemistry teacher.
Give over, Loz. I was being flippant. If it helps you, I can go back and amend my post to the standard wording.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank for this useful post:
  #20768  
Old 04.07.2019, 16:56
marton's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Kt. Zürich
Posts: 8,639
Groaned at 369 Times in 319 Posts
Thanked 14,628 Times in 8,020 Posts
marton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond reputemarton has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
You fail to grasp the double standards of not wanting a trade deal with the US based on food standards grounds due to chlorinated chicken whilst already importing substandard chicken from Brazil.

And it’s chlorine they’re washed in, not bleach. Just like prepackaged salad in the EU.
"importing substandard chicken from Brazil." Exactly, you are comparing apples and oranges, the import from Brazil was sub standard; i.e. did not comply with the agreed food standard.
That is not the same as agreeing to import food which complies with an unacceptable food standard.
Reply With Quote
  #20769  
Old 04.07.2019, 16:56
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 8,020
Groaned at 484 Times in 403 Posts
Thanked 14,547 Times in 5,725 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Prove the chemicals used to rinse chicken in the US are bleach. Take your time Mr Chemistry teacher.
ermmmm

"Chlorine is presently an important chemical for water purification (such as in water treatment plants), in disinfectants, and in bleach. Even small water supplies are now routinely chlorinated.[79]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine#Disinfection
Reply With Quote
  #20770  
Old 04.07.2019, 16:59
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 3,310
Groaned at 60 Times in 40 Posts
Thanked 3,399 Times in 1,857 Posts
rainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond reputerainer_d has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
You fail to grasp the double standards of not wanting a trade deal with the US based on food standards grounds due to chlorinated chicken whilst already importing substandard chicken from Brazil.

That's also something I've wondered: why do we have to import poulet from Brazil, of all countries?

Isn't there enough chicken here or in the EU?

Aren't those who want US beef or Argentinian beef here going to buy it regardless of price?

Why do we need US or South American farmers to compete at the bottom-of-the-barrel with European farmers?

Just like people in the US (or even the EU) are going to buy Swiss cheese, if they really want to, regardless of price.

This is one of the reasons why I prefer the vegetarian option when I don't bring my own lunch but buy from one of the Asian places around my place of work.
I just don't think the meat I get at the average Asian take-a-way is worth any money at all.
And I don't really trust them into adjusting the food-labeling every time they get a new shipment of poulet.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank rainer_d for this useful post:
  #20771  
Old 04.07.2019, 17:04
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Ostschweiz
Posts: 7,200
Groaned at 265 Times in 227 Posts
Thanked 9,315 Times in 4,909 Posts
Urs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
By up to 90% apparently. Which according to recent research makes no meaningful difference to your change of getting infected from it.
Is it 90% of the bacteria (which would indeed seem useless) or 90% of prevalence (which would seem significant)? I thought it was 90% of prevalence.

Now that you reminded me of the base, enjoy as well.
Reply With Quote
  #20772  
Old 04.07.2019, 17:06
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 8,020
Groaned at 484 Times in 403 Posts
Thanked 14,547 Times in 5,725 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Loz as per usual your 'argument' is pathetic, people aren't complaining about meat being Chlorine washed, after all most water supplies have it added. They are complaining that food animal standards are so low in the USA that Chlorine washing is necessary. For local farmers to compete with (lets face it) zero factory farmed US standards they would also have to resort to the same 'standards', you may be ok with that but most people with half a brain would prefer slightly higher standards.

If you want to eat hock burned poultry then move to the USA and knock yourself out.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank bigblue2 for this useful post:
  #20773  
Old 04.07.2019, 17:11
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
And it’s chlorine they’re washed in, not bleach. Just like prepackaged salad in the EU.
It just occurred to me the bit that you are misunderstanding here...

You realise that the issue with using the chlorinated solution is not because it's going to poison you or turn your insides a bit paler than they were, it's because they are using the wash to MASK the decaying process and prolong the shelf-life artificially. The standard of the chicken cannot be guaranteed because of this.

You seem to be arguing that consuming the chlorination solution is not harmful and we do it anyway via bags of salad. You can tell when salad has been on the shelf too long and, anyway, it probably won't kill you if it's gone a bit limp. Chicken on the other hand...

Last edited by Sandgrounder; 04.07.2019 at 17:12. Reason: Edit: too slow - bigblue2 got there before me.
Reply With Quote
  #20774  
Old 04.07.2019, 17:12
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Ostschweiz
Posts: 7,200
Groaned at 265 Times in 227 Posts
Thanked 9,315 Times in 4,909 Posts
Urs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Aren't those who want US beef or Argentinian beef here going to buy it regardless of price?

Why do we need US or South American farmers to compete at the bottom-of-the-barrel with European farmers?

Just like people in the US (or even the EU) are going to buy Swiss cheese, if they really want to, regardless of price.
These are different parts of the population. Like, the top 50% and the bottom 50%, respectively.
Reply With Quote
  #20775  
Old 04.07.2019, 17:16
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Loz as per usual your 'argument' is pathetic, people aren't complaining about meat being Chlorine washed, after all most water supplies have it added. They are complaining that food animal standards are so low in the USA that Chlorine washing is necessary. For local farmers to compete with (lets face it) zero factory farmed US standards they would also have to resort to the same 'standards', you may be ok with that but most people with half a brain would prefer slightly higher standards.

If you want to eat hock burned poultry then move to the USA and knock yourself out.
Do you believe food standards in Brazil are higher than in the US? A simple yes or no will do.
Reply With Quote
  #20776  
Old 04.07.2019, 17:18
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
ermmmm

"Chlorine is presently an important chemical for water purification (such as in water treatment plants), in disinfectants, and in bleach. Even small water supplies are now routinely chlorinated.[79]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chlorine#Disinfection
Yes, chlorine in Bleach. Not Bleach on food. Try again.
Reply With Quote
  #20777  
Old 04.07.2019, 17:25
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
It just occurred to me the bit that you are misunderstanding here...

You realise that the issue with using the chlorinated solution is not because it's going to poison you or turn your insides a bit paler than they were, it's because they are using the wash to MASK the decaying process and prolong the shelf-life artificially. The standard of the chicken cannot be guaranteed because of this.

You seem to be arguing that consuming the chlorination solution is not harmful and we do it anyway via bags of salad. You can tell when salad has been on the shelf too long and, anyway, it probably won't kill you if it's gone a bit limp. Chicken on the other hand...
We’re getting somewhere now. My argument is that this chlorine argument is a load of BS from the EU to detract from the real issue. They don’t care that much about food standards. If they did they wouldn’t be importing salmonella infested frozen chicken from Brazil. The whole chlorine thing is just an excuse to put up a non-tariff barrier with the US to ensure there is no trade deal. It’s double standards and it’s pure protectionism. And it’s why the EU has been so crap at enacting any significant trade deals.
Reply With Quote
  #20778  
Old 04.07.2019, 17:25
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 8,020
Groaned at 484 Times in 403 Posts
Thanked 14,547 Times in 5,725 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
Do you believe food standards in Brazil are higher than in the US? A simple yes or no will do.
LOL when you answer any of the questions you've been asked, rather then very very selective cutting and demanding proof then maybe, just maybe I'll take you seriously.

now you can post a million times on how I refuse to answer your questions in some kind of triumphant manor.
Reply With Quote
  #20779  
Old 04.07.2019, 17:27
bigblue2's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Glarus
Posts: 8,020
Groaned at 484 Times in 403 Posts
Thanked 14,547 Times in 5,725 Posts
bigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond reputebigblue2 has a reputation beyond repute
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
We’re getting somewhere now. My argument is that this chlorine argument is a load of BS from the EU to detract from the real issue. They don’t care that much about food standards. If they did they wouldn’t be importing salmonella infested frozen chicken from Brazil. The whole chlorine thing is just an excuse to put up a non-tariff barrier with the US to ensure there is no trade deal. It’s double standards and it’s pure protectionism. And it’s why the EU has been so crap at enacting any significant trade deals.
blah blah blah yes its protectionism, because no one can compete with huge factory farms with zero standards churning out shit meat, for EU farmers to compete they would have to do the same, get it? no, probably not.
Reply With Quote
  #20780  
Old 04.07.2019, 17:37
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Quote:
View Post
We’re getting somewhere now. My argument is that this chlorine argument is a load of BS from the EU to detract from the real issue. They don’t care that much about food standards. If they did they wouldn’t be importing salmonella infested frozen chicken from Brazil. The whole chlorine thing is just an excuse to put up a non-tariff barrier with the US to ensure there is no trade deal. It’s double standards and it’s pure protectionism. And it’s why the EU has been so crap at enacting any significant trade deals.
FFS, Loz. You realise that they STOPPED the infected chicken, don't you?

Do you really think they ordered xyz tonnes of chicken especially with a salmonella marinade?

I'll make it easy for you:

Salmonella infected meat violates EU food import standards.
Chlorine washed chicken violates EU food import standards.

The reasons are pretty similar if you think about it. Which you won't.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
europe




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Latest Referendum, what will be consequences for EU (C permit and B permit) holders? expat2014 Permits/visas/government 3 11.02.2014 08:59
Importing vehicles and the VAT consequences in Switzerland from France BEFO Finance/banking/taxation 6 07.08.2013 15:11
The (Available in CH) Dog Food Review Thread meloncollie Pet corner 44 08.05.2012 20:15
Common-law marriage and consequences in CH Mishto Family matters/health 9 01.10.2011 22:03
Something for the Brits: M&S in CH mark Daily life 11 15.11.2007 12:18


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 14:34.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0