The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Ace1]

	Quote:	Swisstree
	Money returned, for some. Millions to be spent on a sea front on the Jurassic coast, and I am sure it will be stunning and help us all to live within our means. Portsmouth to spend a fortune on painting the tower landmark even though it's fine as it is; meanwhile, streets away families can't get their disabled children out the door, no available therapy needed to keep limbs in basic working condition. No disabled specialized pool for water therapy in Hampshire for children, but there are for disabled dogs.. on and on, relentless. Councils continue to stop services and train/recruit staff in mental health care. Limited use of specialist staff for struggling children in schools.. on and on.

None of these issues, of course, are directly caused by Britain's EU membership, but they are great examples of the sort of thing that the public see as being consistently neglected, and for which they want to point the finger of blame.

Sadly, successive UK governments have failed to appreciate and address this feeling of helplessness, and I think that's a large part of the reason for the 'leave' vote - 'perhaps this might make some differences' sort of thing.

	Quote:	greenmount
	I am worried about what will happen with Europe/EU as a whole, much less with UK. I think I've seen enough sacrifices for this project so I can have a word about it.

Exactly- just as if Trump is elected, it is a decision made in one country that will affect many many other countries that didn't have a say. The effects and consequences will be massive for the whole of Europe, and way beyond too. With the lovely Marine gloating and stirring the extreme right in France for a Referendum- this is clear to see. The financial markets and exchange rates are not limited to the UK. And Switzerland is of course bracing itself against yet another CHF hike. With tourism down due to high france, and exports of all Swiss products down up to 30% for some companies- no wonder.

A great article in the New Statesman today 'I want my country back' - worth a read. It's absolutely how we feel (and so much more important than financial effects on us personally).

The biggest Brexit impact for the UK and for all of Europe is not so much of Brexit itself. That could be accomplished with minimal disruption. But there is now a psychological crutch available to anyone and everyone to use to fail. It's a free pass to failure without taking any personal responsibility for it.

People will be using Brexit as the reason for all their failures in life; personal, social, economical, national and institutional. In this day and age of elevated values of victimisation and acrimony, I think there is going to be a lot of very shrill whinging, weeping and gnashing of teeth.

[marton]

	Quote:	Mikers
	I'm not bright enough to understand the joke I'm afraid but I'm sure it's a goody. If anyone has some spare minutes this morning this guardian article today really sums it up well I think http://www.theguardian.com/politics/...ty-westminster They just never latched on to the danger. Having intellectual in/out debates on the South Bank in London just have been really enjoyable and self fulfilling for the wealthy intelligent 20 something's spending there flourishing career earnings. Meanwhile in Redcar, the steelworks had been shut and it was just, well, one of those things. This could be a terrible decision for the UK, but it was lost by remain, not won by leave.

"I'm not bright enough to understand the joke" I did not see it as a joke but as a social comment.

"Meanwhile in Redcar, the steelworks had been shut"

And next;
"Brexit decision piles pressure on Tata British steelworks"
"uncertainty following Britain's referendum vote raised the chances Tata would close its biggest British plant."

Source

[CathHarmony]

	Quote:	Swisstree
	Fed up with politicians from the UK and EU who do not listen. Local councils in the UK strapped for cash and closing essential services left, right and center in schools, mental care, disability assistance centers/units, specialist carers/ staff for adults and children.. relentless austerity which has stagnated progress for the everyday adult/child right across the the country. You bet people are fed up.

	Quote:	Ace1
	None of these issues, of course, are directly caused by Britain's EU membership, but they are great examples of the sort of thing that the public see as being consistently neglected, and for which they want to point the finger of blame. Sadly, successive UK governments have failed to appreciate and address this feeling of helplessness, and I think that's a large part of the reason for the 'leave' vote - 'perhaps this might make some differences' sort of thing.

I suspect immigration put so much strain on basic services, money had to be diverted there and not to services for disabled kids... a minority.

On top of that amenities that were already too crowded and underfunded are now inundated.

For people who live in rich areas and can afford private club and pool memberships the pressures aren't so obvious, for poorer people who have to share the public pool with young male syrian and afghani muslim refugees its more obvious.

You can call people stupid for not accepting the quality of life degradation but I'm guessing that thought process got you kicked out of the EU.

You have to look after your people not just use them.

[adrianlondon]

	Quote:	CathHarmony
	for poorer people who have to share the public pool with young male syrian and afghani muslim refugees its more obvious.

I guess if people think Syria and Afghanistan are in the EU some of the votes make sense.

[CathHarmony]

	Quote:	adrianlondon
	I guess if people think Syria and Afghanistan are in the EU some of the votes make sense.

Weren't we nearly forced to take a quota by the EU? That was enough to scare most people after what they saw in Germany.
Our borders being porous, have you seen who comes across the chanel from 'the jungle'? They only need to claim asylum and you have to process them dont you and then they are part of our society for the y.e.a.r.s it takes to process them.

another good point you made earlier, wasnt it you who made a post about the shit salaries in the UK. I'm guessing that affected poorer people too, probably more in the disposable income area than a wealthier person?

so on top of no. possibility of buying a house because of immigration demand has pushed prices up to an inflated level and little prospect of social housing because its being given away to immigrants.. its no wonder poorer people were worried.

	Quote:	CathHarmony
	I suspect immigration put so much strain on basic services, money had to be diverted there

Basic services were put on massive strain by Govt cuts, to education, to the NHS, to social services, to public housing (beginning with the sale of Council Houses under Mrs T)- and NOT by EU immigration. Perhaps in some parts of the UK, like East Anglia and the South East- but not generally.

With EU migrants contributing positvely to taxes, and in other ways- schools and more services could have been provided. It was a political choice not to do so, which had very little do do with the EU.

[adrianlondon]

	Quote:	CathHarmony
	Weren't we nearly forced to take a quota by the EU?

Oh no, something nearly happened but didn't! And now, something that didn't happen might.

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-36626553

	Quote:	CathHarmony
	another good point you made earlier, wasnt it you who made a post about the shit salaries in the UK

Maybe, I don't remember. The phrasing does sound like mine But if one plans to ever leave the UK for a holiday, or buy something not designed and manufactured in the UK then with sterling down around 10% the salaries are now 10% shittier.

Well I can't say I can blame the people of Calais- They will be having whip-rounds to buy boats soon. And the UK border guards there will be asked to leave. I'm sure the French will be happy to close a blind eye or two.

[22 yards]

	Quote:
	I'm sure the French will be happy to close a blind eye or two.

What would be the point of doing that?

Is that like "shutting the stable door after the horse has bolted"?

[MrVertigo]

	Quote:	adrianlondon
	I guess if people think Syria and Afghanistan are in the EU some of the votes make sense.

Well once they saw Sadiq Khan got elected they started thinking that.....

Potential future scenario:back to the roots. France, Germany, Italy and Benelux will regroup around a core entity....and put the satellite countries simmer at low heat till they find a way out of the long-term crisis.

The french news on TV at 8pm went to Bruxelles to interview the "desperate" faces of shell shocked EU servants who think about getting another citizenship than british to stay there...and repeating "this is a suicide this is a suicide". I think it sums quite well the disconnect with population when you know the numerous financial advantages they got there.

It's a bold decision made by the majority of British population, it needs to be respected and implemented. I hope no politician will try to repeat the 2005 experience of turning a No at referendum into a Yes by political jiggery-pokery. Will be a great test for UKIP and Boris to see if they can deliver what they promised.

Good luck.

[marton]

	Quote:	CathHarmony
	I suspect immigration put so much strain on basic services, money had to be diverted there and not to services for disabled kids... a minority. On top of that amenities that were already too crowded and underfunded are now inundated. For people who live in rich areas and can afford private club and pool memberships the pressures aren't so obvious, for poorer people who have to share the public pool with young male syrian and afghani muslim refugees its more obvious. You can call people stupid for not accepting the quality of life degradation but I'm guessing that thought process got you kicked out of the EU. You have to look after your people not just use them.

"share the public pool with young male syrian and afghani muslim refugees" So the Leave vote was not racist

Official statistics show that 1,602 Syrian people had been resettled in the UK by the end of March 2016 and there are 5,055 public pools in the UK. The Syrians must be running around like hell to visit these pools

So the young male syrian Christian refugees are OK?

[JagWaugh]

	Quote:	CathHarmony
	Weren't we nearly forced to take a quota by the EU? Our borders being porous, have you seen who comes across the chanel from 'the jungle'? They only need to claim asylum and you have to process them dont you? another good point you made earlier, wasnt it you who made a post about the shit salaries in the UK. I'm guessing that affected poorer people too, probably more in the disposable income area than a wealthier person? so on top of no possibility of buying a house because of immigration demand has pushed prices up to an inflated level and little prospect of social housing because its being given away to immigrants.. its no wonder poorer people were worried.

I knew it was a mistake to take you off my ignore list.


"The Jungle" Really? You're kidding, right?


Here is a link, my posting it presupposes an ability to read and even the slightest taint of human compassion: http://www.refugeecouncil.org.uk/pol...h_about_asylum


Here is another link: http://www.redcross.org.uk/What-we-d...ts-and-figures


Cooing at dogs and including "harmony" in your moniker evidently does not make you a particularly balanced human being.

[marton]

	Quote:	SOBEIT
	The sheer arrogance clearly struck a cord with voters yet DC and his aides failed to recognize the early warning signs and convinced themselves they would win convincingly. British politics across all parties is frankly inept.

"British politics across all parties is frankly inept." True, so who will now lead UK in to the golden future

[Tasebo]

	Quote:	Phos
	The biggest Brexit impact for the UK and for all of Europe is not so much of Brexit itself. That could be accomplished with minimal disruption. But there is now a psychological crutch available to anyone and everyone to use to fail. It's a free pass to failure without taking any personal responsibility for it. People will be using Brexit as the reason for all their failures in life; personal, social, economical, national and institutional. In this day and age of elevated values of victimisation and acrimony, I think there is going to be a lot of very shrill whinging, weeping and gnashing of teeth.

Something new to whinge about while in queue at the Post - many of those the very same individuals who claim to not to have realised their vote would count.

In this internet age, I fear a significant number (more than would have ever read a decent newspaper, let alone The Sun) are gathering their facts from all of the less-than-reliable sources that flood screens, and questionably edited manipulative feeds.

[Aleydis]

ZDF Heute Show - The UK leaving the EU (English Subtitles)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w0Y89dfR8v8

[marton]

	Quote:	Phil_MCR
	"A Prime Minister resigned. The £ plummeted. The FTSE 100 lost significant ground. But then the £ rallied past February levels, and the FTSE closed on a weekly high: 2.4% up on last Friday, its best performance in 4 months. President Obama decided we wouldn't be at the 'back of the queue' after all and that our 'special relationship' was still strong. The French President confirmed the Le Touquet agreement would stay in place. The President of the European Commission stated Brexit negations would be 'orderly' and stressed the UK would continue to be a 'close partner' of the EU. A big bank denied reports it would shift 2,000 staff overseas. The CBI, vehemently anti-Brexit during the referendum campaign, stated British business was resilient and would adapt. Several countries outside the EU stated they wished to begin bi-lateral trade talks with the UK immediately. If this was the predicted apocalypse, well, it was a very British one. It was all over by teatime. Not a bad first day of freedom." --Suzanne Evans UKIP

Quotes;
"EU referendum: Moody's cut UK's credit outlook to 'negative'"
"S&P says UK 'to lose top credit rating' after vote to leave the EU"

Stupid credit agencies, what do they know?

What can you say- well yes, it was all about them bl***y Muslims again, I knew it:

https://www.facebook.com/Channel4New...3842562976939/

so EU immigration is no problem, but them Muslims are- so I voted OUT to stop EU migration. Ohhh, I see!

[jacek]

I like listening to unbiased voices and it seems like the result of the referendum may be a long term benefit to the UK. It has been a well thought out and formed decision by both sides of the campaign. After all, we are entering the 4th industrial revolution and the inevitable world's progress will result in more dissatisfaction of average folks who are losing their manufacturing jobs outsourced to robots, growth of immigration due to globalization, small businesses growth hindered under current EU legislations and etc. Overall one has to look at a broader picture of the vote. Watch this 15min interview with the think tank Alec Hogg below:

http://www.fin24.com/Economy/watch-a...624?isapp=true