The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Blueangel]

Two very shady things that have pissed me off this weekend, both coming from Dominic Cummings.

Firstly, all ministerial special advisors have to answer to him instead of their respective ministers, which led to him having Sajid Javid's advisor, escorted out off Downing Street by police without Javid's knowledge.
Who the eff gave him that authority?! (as if we didn't know) And what the hell is he doing using the police in that manner? That's not their role at Downing Street.

Secondly, the twitter rumour mill was rife last night with 'news' that Cummings has also let it be known that any Tory MP who votes against the government will automatically be deselected whether their local party members want it or not!

https://www.channel4.com/news/sajid-...ancellors-aide

WTAF is going on with this government?!!

[bowlie]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	WTAF is going on with this government?!!

Taking back control. Obviously.

[Blueangel]

He's only gone and done it the effin' twonk!

	Quote:
	Tory rebels who try to block no-deal Brexit told they will have whip withdrawn The dramatic threat to effectively expel potential rebels from the party is being issued by Tory whips ahead of a critical week in parliament for Boris Johnson's Brexit plans. Withdrawing the whip would see MPs keep their seats in parliament but sit in the Commons as independent MPs.

https://news.sky.com/story/tory-rebe...drawn-11800021

With an estimated 40 Tory MPs set to rebel, this would reduce the number of Tory seats in the House would be seriously short of a majority.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Attachment 137596

Saw this last night - brilliant. Methinks Boris is beginning to wobble.

We are in for a very interesting week.

[Blueangel]

A bit of light relief...amid reports of JR-G on LBC telling a consultant neurologist who took part in drafting Operation Yellowhammer that he is "fearmongering" live on air https://twitter.com/theousherwood/st...32907922358273

[Mikers]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	A bit of light relief...amid reports of JR-G on LBC telling a consultant neurologist who took part in drafting Operation Yellowhammer that he is "fearmongering" live on air https://twitter.com/theousherwood/st...32907922358273 Attachment 137597

It would have helped a bit more if the consultant neurologist wasn't a prolific remain campaigner and is pictured climbing into a body bag pretending to be dead at a Pro EU Rally a few days ago, at which he has also given speeches.

Which asks the obvious question, why on earth are they hiring people like that to do the yellowhammer stuff ? Its kind of like asking an arsonist to write your fire regulations.

[rainer_d]

	Quote:	Mikers
	It would have helped a bit more if the consultant neurologist wasn't a prolific remain campaigner and is pictured climbing into a body bag pretending to be dead at a Pro EU Rally a few days ago, at which he has also given speeches. Which asks the obvious question, why on earth are they hiring people like that to do the yellowhammer stuff ? Its kind of like asking an arsonist to write your fire regulations.

Well, if it's a good arsonist, he'll surely come up with super ingenious ways on how a fire could start.


The problems start to arise once nobody crosschecks the work of these people....

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Mikers
	It would have helped a bit more if the consultant neurologist wasn't a prolific remain campaigner and is pictured climbing into a body bag pretending to be dead at a Pro EU Rally a few days ago, at which he has also given speeches.

I would expect the primary concern and motivation of a consultant neurologist to be for his patients. Kinda goes with the job! Same as all the leading doctors, oncologists and radiographers who wrote to the PM a month ago expressing their serious concerns. Do you honestly expect them to remain silent and complicit?

[Mikers]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	I would expect the primary concern and motivation of a consultant neurologist to be for his patients. Kinda goes with the job! Same as all the leading doctors, oncologists and radiographers who wrote to the PM a month ago expressing their serious concerns. Do you honestly expect them to remain silent and complicit?

You would certainly hope a neurologist was thinking first of his patients. You could help things along by doing some basic checks before hiring one, to make sure he hasn't got any tendencies which go outside the norm. I wonder how many neurologists there are in the UK that dont do speeches at Remain rallies ? I wonder if there are any, i mean its the obvious thing to do, if your a neutral, run-of-the-mill consultant, climbing into fake body bags and pretend to be dead at rallies to highlight the risk of leaving the EU.

	Quote:	Mikers
	You would certainly hope a neurologist was thinking first of his patients. You could help things along by doing some basic checks before hiring one, to make sure he hasn't got any tendencies which go outside the norm. I wonder how many neurologists there are in the UK that dont do speeches at Remain rallies ? I wonder if there are any, i mean its the obvious thing to do, if your a neutral, run-of-the-mill consultant, climbing into fake body bags and pretend to be dead at rallies to highlight the risk of leaving the EU.

You would suppose his actions originated from the objective stance of a remainer re: brexit.

However, we are now into crashing out with no deal full-on-drama territory and the prospects for the whole of the NHS and the various medical professionals are frightening. To look at him in a body bag as an isolated incident, the inference being he is not neutral, when there is nothing at all neutral about the crash-out brexit plans harming all in sundry, especially the sick and dying in hospitals up and down the country.

I do not think it is a reflection on his objectivity/ the norm, rather than a reflection on the frightening, abnormal times we live in.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Mikers
	I wonder how many neurologists there are in the UK that dont do speeches at Remain rallies ? I wonder if there are any, i mean its the obvious thing to do, if your a neutral, run-of-the-mill consultant, climbing into fake body bags and pretend to be dead at rallies to highlight the risk of leaving the EU.

Have you not considered that it might be precisely his direct involvement in the drafting of Operation Yellowhammer that brought about his desire to get the message of the dangers of no deal across to the public? He may well have been privy to information that has alerted him to the obstacles it causes to the care of his patients.

[Blueangel]

In fact, Operation Yellowhammer's existence was first leaked in Sept 2018. Dr. David Nicholl turned whistleblower (by his own admission) in March 2019 after his involvement in the drafting.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Yellowhammer

https://twitter.com/djnicholl/status...36324065587200

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Mikers
	You would certainly hope a neurologist was thinking first of his patients. You could help things along by doing some basic checks before hiring one, to make sure he hasn't got any tendencies which go outside the norm. I wonder how many neurologists there are in the UK that dont do speeches at Remain rallies ? I wonder if there are any, i mean its the obvious thing to do, if your a neutral, run-of-the-mill consultant, climbing into fake body bags and pretend to be dead at rallies to highlight the risk of leaving the EU.

It does not mean he is right or wrong. It is way past silly bugger time at this stage. If it is project fear, fake news or whatever then it is time it was actually addressed - in two months time the UK will loose trade deals covering 92% of their exports, unrestrained access to the wealthiest trade block in the world and no chance of US trade deal because they are talking to the money and the organ grinder has already said no deal unless it fully respects the GFA.

[Mikers]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	In fact, Operation Yellowhammer's existence was first leaked in Sept 2018. Dr. David Nicholl turned whistleblower (by his own admission) in March 2019 after his involvement in the drafting. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Yellowhammer https://twitter.com/djnicholl/status...36324065587200

Looks like he's a goodie after all then. Lets hope they listen to him.

Boris under pressure...

	Quote:
	U.K. lawmakers are planning to pass legislation forcing Prime Minister Boris Johnson to delay Brexit until Jan. 31 unless he can get a new agreement with the European Union by mid October. Johnson’s team have threatened an election if MPs back a rebel plan to rule-out a no-deal split from the bloc.

Makes sense, although it's probably not long enough if they want to sort out all the kinks.

[marton]

	Quote:
	Boris under pressure... Makes sense, although it's probably not long enough if they want to sort out all the kinks.

It will never be long enough when the British negotiators do not have an agreed position on what they want!

Ivan Rogers - The Spectator, writes about a clean break being sold as providing certainty, finality when it would do nothing of the sort.. and the true mess would then start and rumble on for many years.

An excellent read.

Ivan Rogers: the realities of a no deal Brexit


"If, as many suspect, the real plan proves to be that we have an election campaign devoted to blaming an intransigent EU for a ‘no deal’ outcome, then please let us not harbour illusions that afterwards, were this government to be returned, normality could rapidly return. And that both sides would just amicably sit down and hammer out the Canada-EU style Free Trade Deal to which the Prime Minister aspires. Or that a plethora of legal sectoral mini deals would quietly be struck to lead, seamlessly, to the same result.

Not a chance in hell."

[k_and_e]

	Quote:
	Boris under pressure... Makes sense, although it's probably not long enough if they want to sort out all the kinks.

Doesn't make sense at all. The EU will never move because it has no incentive to move. Either remain, take the deal or go for a no-deal.

The proposed deal is a bad deal. UK could then better remain.
No-deal will either be an extremely stupid or an extremely cunning move (time will tell).

	Quote:	k_and_e
	Doesn't make sense at all. The EU will never move because it has no incentive to move. Either remain, take the deal or go for a no-deal. The proposed deal is a bad deal. UK could then better remain. No-deal will either be an extremely stupid or an extremely cunning move (time will tell).

Did you read all of the article?