The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[moggy]

Does anyone know who William Oliver Healey is?

his petition is now over 2 million

only needed 100,000 for a Parliament Debate


https://petition.parliament.uk/petitions/131215

[adrianlondon]

	Quote:
	Well, when 1000s Google the EU after voting for Brexit- and say 'we never knew the facts, we just listened to the Sun (Murdoch), Farage and Bojo- had we known the facts we would have voted for remain! When others say they dont' mind EU immigration but they voted out to keep them Muslims out. When Cornwall votes for Brexit and then immediately panic about being worse off- etc, etc. The mind does boggle, no? And when stats show that the vast majority who voted out are over 65 and won't be really affected by the vote. Can we really say the vote was rational and informed?

I voted Remain, am usually pompous enough to believe giving the vote to everyone is a stupid idea (still do), but .... many people over 65 will have seen their holidays (and potential retiring-abroad plans) adversely affected due to the banking sector share crash and sterling fall and as for those stupid people who had no idea what they were voting for ... unless there are millions of them (and only on one side of the vote) then it makes little difference.

The vote was certainly not rational nor informed, but it seemed neither side thought it worthwhile to actually speak the facts in a language that a relatively unsavvy population could understand. The mistake was calling the referendum in the first place imo. To call it means to be prepared to lose. So tough.

[lost_inbroad]

	Quote:	greenmount
	Don't know what this page has to do with anything though, Lost... Do 71% foreign criminals in Swiss prisons have anything to do with Brexit?

It's a juxtaposition, showing similar effects open borders can have on countries welcoming people who previously had been prevented to travel freely to the country.

	Quote:	porsch1909
	It's the UK's choice when they invoke the treaty and I've not seen a single Brexiteer saying they aren't happy with it being delayed 3 months. Why should Cameron put up with the shit part of negotiating the exit? He was firmly remain.

Because he called the Referendum and chose the date???

Do you realy think he can just go on his jollies, and same for his mates at the HoC... b*gger off till September, now that can of worms has been opened. Surely not

	Quote:
	Because he called the Referendum and chose the date??? Do you realy think he can just go on his jollies, and same for his mates at the HoC... b*gger off till September, now that can of worms has been opened. Surely not

Of course he can. The referendum was an internal consultation. It's up to the government what they do with the results.

[marton]

	Quote:	lost_inbroad
	Switzerland: 71% in 2015. And y'all are paying for their sojourn. http://www.bfs.admin.ch/bfs/portal/e...en_zahlen.html

You need to be careful quoting such statistics; many people who were born in Switzerland are classed as foreigners
Plus they do not usually give foreigners bail so most of the pre-trial detentions are foreigners.

[marton]

	Quote:	lost_inbroad
	It's a juxtaposition, showing similar effects open borders can have on countries welcoming people who previously had been prevented to travel freely to the country.

Britain is not in Schengen so there is no open border?

	Quote:	marton
	Good to see a specific point; I do not remember seeing htis mentioned by Brexit? Anyway this process is under investigation - the European Ombudsman has opened an investigation into the secret meetings between European institutions to shape laws, known as trilogues. According to the EU website "After each trilogue the negotiating team shall report back to the following meeting of the committee responsible. Documents reflecting the outcome of the last trilogue shall be made available to the committee." Source The results of a trilogue have to be voted on by the EU Parliament; it does not automatically become law.

I have posted on this more than once before. The Ombudsman is not getting anywhere and has been told to back off, by the very people she is investigating.

May 2016.

Steve Peers, Professor of Law, University of Essex, comments:

"The Council's objection to the Ombudsman's competence is totally unfounded.

The Ombudsman is clearly not questioning the substantive outcome of the political negotiations in trilogues, or the decision to hold trilogues in particular cases, or the existence or organisation of the trilogue system as a whole. The investigation only concerns the transparency of trilogues, and access to trilogue documents. Access to documents is clearly a question of (mal)administration, and the overall rules and practice on transparency (ie, whether there is a register of ongoing trilogues) necessarily hugely influence the specific issue of access to documents in practice. So there should be no doubt whatsoever about the Ombudsman's competence to hold the investigation.

	Quote:
	Of course he can. The referendum was an internal consultation. It's up to the government what they do with the results.

The extreme right wing of UKIP, the EDL and Britain First will of course just sit back and wait patiently, like little lambs. And foreign markets, the £ and what little industry left in UK will get ready to pack, together with financial services? Months of uncertainty will surely help, I'm sure.

Which planet do you live on, really. OINK OINK OINK OINK OINK

[lost_inbroad]

	Quote:	marton
	You need to be careful quoting such statistics; many people who were born in Switzerland are classed as foreigners Plus they do not usually give foreigners bail so most of the pre-trial detentions are foreigners.

Open borders, facilitated immigration, no big difference really.

[greenmount]

	Quote:	lost_inbroad
	Open borders, facilitated immigration, no big difference really.

If you check out the nationality of foreign criminals in Swiss prisons (and probably UK prisons too) you'll notice that most of them are coming from countries that are not included in the open borders, facilitated immigration group.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_Switzerland

But this thing is irrelevant to Brexit anyway.

	Quote:	porsch1909
	Not sure what planet you're on sometimes

Do you truly believe the UK and Europe will wait till after recess to get answers- whilst PM and Ministers and MPs go off on their jollies - to Europe I suppose? Really?

And Nicola and the Scotts will also wait for a couple of months to see what happens next? She was on the ball already today- and I'm sure she's already cancelled her holiday. And so will Ruth. They might actually get together and work together, those two- they have more balls tham the rest of them together.

[marton]

	Quote:	lost_inbroad
	Open borders, facilitated immigration, no big difference really.

Difference is between having to show your passport and also pass through immigration controls or not

[JagWaugh]

	Quote:	greenmount
	If you check out the nationality of foreign criminals in Swiss prisons (and probably UK prisons too) you'll notice that most of them are coming from countries that are not included in the open borders, facilitated immigration group. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_Switzerland But this thing is irrelevant to Brexit anyway.

Indeed, one of the defining characteristics of prison populations is that they tend to have a low regard for the law.

[Deep Purple]

	Quote:
	Ahem... the UK isn't out of the EU yet. Parliament hasn't exercised its sovereignty yet... http://uk.businessinsider.com/green-...-brexit-2016-6

Even if it is accepted as legally binding it doesn't make it a done deal

http://a-j-b.blogspot.co.uk/2016/06/...and-might.html

David Lammy has called on Parliament to disregard the referendum result.

He won't be the last.

[SOBEIT]

One bonus, at least Wales still remain.

Like Bojo- not very good at answering questions, are you?

How will the people of voted OUT, react if they have to wait months of delay for a decision, and if their wish is not carried out - whilst the GVT goes off on their joliies? Will they just sit quietly, chatting about the birds and bees in the meantime? Will Scotland just sit around twiddling thumbs? Whilst manufacturing is planning its escape, and financial services too?

Now I've heard and read some weird stuff over the past few days- so ...

I wonder how many young people you have discussed this in the UK?

	Quote:	greenmount
	If you check out the nationality of foreign criminals in Swiss prisons (and probably UK prisons too) you'll notice that most of them are coming from countries that are not included in the open borders, facilitated immigration group. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crime_in_Switzerland But this thing is irrelevant to Brexit anyway.

That Wikipedia article is based on 2009 data. Romania and Bulgaria, referred to by an earlier poster, were not in the EU at that time and did not have free access across EU borders, nor any more right to live in EU countries or Switzerland than other non-EU countries.

Now, Romanians and Bulgarians have far easier access to Switzerland and to EU countries. Romanians top the crime lists in many of those countries. That's the point that LiB and other posters are making.

[SOBEIT]

I can see a lot of expats living on UK pensions looking for the exit door and relocating back to the UK.