The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Mikers]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	I watched the whole thing live and why shouldn't the PM face a small crowd (estimated 200-300 people out of a 6,000 British expat population) mostly made up of angry expats? They face being affected more than us lot in Switzerland. If he came to Zurich I'd be heckling the ....... .... You should read what's being said about them on social media by Brexiteers in the UK. According to them, all expats are wealthy tax dodgers working for blue chip companies. I 100% sympathise with the crowd in Luxembourg. I'm British with an EU partner, like many of them, and also like many of them, we can't just pack up and go back to the UK now directly because of the new minimum income requirements introduced by Theresa May and the slithy tove, Priti Patel. We've all been unwillingly relegated to pawns in an increasingly elaborate 4D game of chess. I didn't sign up for that and I deeply resent it. https://twitter.com/mediawhizz/statu...48159479914496

But thats the point: what was it actually meant to achieve ? From a brexit perspective it only hardened the resolve - people who want Brexit were furious at the luxembourg fit-up and the Telegraph and Mail were raging about it today. So it further entrenched their view that the EU are a bunch of cynical whatevers.

The luxembourg PM got a bit of glory being able to rant about the UK and some hardline remainers cheered and whooped drowing out everything else which I suppose is good if you want to remain and see the UK getting a public kicking.

In terms of actual progress ? A Press conference with both leaders responding to questions, i.e. without external interference might have led to us being informed about their views more genuinely.

It all just seemed a bit silly to me.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Mikers
	- people who want Brexit were furious at the luxembourg fit-up and the Telegraph and Mail were raging about it today.

I'm long past giving a flying flamingo what they think because they couldn't give a flying flamingo for anyone other than themselves. 'Myopic' doesn't even scratch the surface.

	Quote:	Mikers
	The luxembourg PM got a bit of glory being able to rant about the UK and some hardline remainers cheered and whooped drowing out everything else which I suppose is good if you want to remain and see the UK getting a public kicking.

"Hardline remainers"? People who stand to lose everthing they've worked for more like. No expats benefit from seeing the UK get a good kicking, by they have the right to demonstrate and make their voices heard to the new PM particularly seeing as they are currently the only scrutiny he's exposed to.

	Quote:	Mikers
	It all just seemed a bit silly to me.

You think the right to protest is silly?
If the PM dared show his face in Switzerland, he'd get the same tenfold.

	Quote:	Mikers
	But thats the point: what was it actually meant to achieve ? From a brexit perspective it only hardened the resolve - people who want Brexit were furious at the luxembourg fit-up and the Telegraph and Mail were raging about it today. So it further entrenched their view that the EU are a bunch of cynical whatevers.

The Daily Wail "rages" about anything from working mothers, to Millennials making more money than the average Boomer, to Gary Lineker's latest slapdown-tweet of Prince Piers Morgan so I wouldn't attach too much importance to them "raging" at Luxembourg. It's their business model and it gets clicks.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:
	It's their business model and it gets clicks.

And I've increasingly found that all the tv debates surrounding this are ridiculously mediocre with people using topics that we've debated and demolished time and again on EF.

The Embassy's new round of Brexit Information roadshows was announced last week, so for anyone who missed it (myself included), the details are here...

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/b...in-switzerland

[Mikers]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	I'm long past giving a flying flamingo what they think because they couldn't give a flying flamingo for anyone other than themselves. 'Myopic' doesn't even scratch the surface. "Hardline remainers"? People who stand to lose everthing they've worked for more like. No expats benefit from seeing the UK get a good kicking, by they have the right to demonstrate and make their voices heard to the new PM particularly seeing as they are currently the only scrutiny he's exposed to. You think the right to protest is silly? If the PM dared show his face in Switzerland, he'd get the same tenfold.

I think it's important that people can protest. I don't think the right kind of setup is when we need to hear from the leaders of two countries about what they have just spoken about and protesters are standing 10 yards away making them unable to be heard. I think that is pointless and does not help either side.

[Blueangel]

One for the geeks: The Secret Barrister has begun #SupremeCourtFacts parody on twitter. Don't bother with the comments on the thread as he's reposting the real gold on his page.


https://twitter.com/BarristerSecret/...60999058853888

It reminds me of the tales my brother used to tell about different circuit judges he worked with when he was a barrister. One particular one always kept his sandwiches under his wig.

	Quote:	Blueangel
	One for the geeks: The Secret Barrister has begun #SupremeCourtFacts parody on twitter. Don't bother with the comments on the thread as he's reposting the real gold on his page. Attachment 137685 https://twitter.com/BarristerSecret/...60999058853888 It reminds me of the tales my brother used to tell about different circuit judges he worked with when he was a barrister. One particular one always kept his sandwiches under his wig.

Because nothing says solemn and weighty legal mind like sweaty egg sarnies balancing on the bonce?

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Mikers
	I think it's important that people can protest. I don't think the right kind of setup is when we need to hear from the leaders of two countries about what they have just spoken about and protesters are standing 10 yards away making them unable to be heard. I think that is pointless and does not help either side.

Pointless is the BS that Boris has been doing in Berlin, Paris, Dublin and now Luxembourg for the past few weeks, playing to the home crowd, pretending to be negotiating a new deal, when in reality all he was doing was blowing hot air and trying to pulling all the other EU leaders into his little game. It was always a dangerous game to play and yesterday he got burned.

And of course it was a setup, just like the leaked Irish foreign affairs report on his performance as foreign secretary and the fact that Junker choose to wear a green tie yesterday. Nothing happens at that level that the 27 plus the commission have not discussed at their regular morning call.

	Quote:	Mikers
	I think it's important that people can protest. I don't think the right kind of setup is when we need to hear from the leaders of two countries about what they have just spoken about and protesters are standing 10 yards away making them unable to be heard. I think that is pointless and does not help either side.

That's a pretty poor, limp excuse. The press conference wasn't really for the benefit of the gathered crowd, it was for the European and perhaps to a lesser extent the world's press.

Directional microphones pick up what the person is saying into them and very little of the background noise, so if he's really trying to say that it was so loud that the mics wouldn't pick him up, that's yet another easily disproven lie. How often does a football commentator say "ooh, this stadium is a bit noisy, I'm going to have to leave"?

[Mikers]

	Quote:
	That's a pretty poor, limp excuse. The press conference wasn't really for the benefit of the gathered crowd, it was for the European and perhaps to a lesser extent the world's press. Directional microphones pick up what the person is saying into them and very little of the background noise, so if he's really trying to say that it was so loud that the mics wouldn't pick him up, that's yet another easily disproven lie. How often does a football commentator say "ooh, this stadium is a bit noisy, I'm going to have to leave"?

Ok there must be some confusion then. I watched it on telly as the Luxembourg PM was speaking and he had to stop sometimes because you couldn't hear him, just the cheering. If it wasn't actually loud and it was just bad TV then of course Johnson has no leg to stand on. My impression from the news was that the volume of the crowd was significant.

[Reb77Br]

	Quote:	Mikers
	Ok there must be some confusion then. I watched it on telly as the Luxembourg PM was speaking and he had to stop sometimes because you couldn't hear him, just the cheering. If it wasn't actually loud and it was just bad TV then of course Johnson has no leg to stand on. My impression from the news was that the volume of the crowd was significant.

Around 75 people, according to reports, e.g. The Guardian, The Telegraph.

[amogles]

	Quote:	Reb77Br
	Around 75 people, according to reports ...

do they even have that many people in Luxemburg?

	Quote:	Mikers
	Ok there must be some confusion then. I watched it on telly as the Luxembourg PM was speaking and he had to stop sometimes because you couldn't hear him, just the cheering. If it wasn't actually loud and it was just bad TV then of course Johnson has no leg to stand on. My impression from the news was that the volume of the crowd was significant.

Don't know what you were listening to but you can see and hear the Lux PM here completely clearly and no interruptions. He gets cheered a couple of times but nothing madly loud.

Even listening to the crowd in the brief clip of the 2 of them walking past (and closer than the location of the podium was) would not have drowned them out. Clearly - imo - Johnson not willing to hear himself being booed.

[Mikers]

	Quote:
	Don't know what you were listening to but you can see and hear the Lux PM here completely clearly and no interruptions. He gets cheered a couple of times but nothing madly loud. Even listening to the crowd in the brief clip of the 2 of them walking past (and closer than the location of the podium was) would not have drowned them out. Clearly - imo - Johnson not willing to hear himself being booed.

Yes thats the one. He does stop a couple of times so if that had been the reverse, the continual booing, like you could hear as they were walking about, its not really a suprise he didnt show up because it would have just been fairly ridiculous.

Anyway, its pointless arguing it. I think its a stupid thing to do, to run a press conference with loads of protesters there, whoever is up front, even if its daffy duck and mickey mouse.

Other people see it as Johnson chickening out of a normal press conference with no discernible noise and won't listen to any other possible explanation.

	Quote:	Mikers
	Yes thats the one. He does stop a couple of times so if that had been the reverse, the continual booing, like you could hear as they were walking about, its not really a suprise he didnt show up because it would have just been fairly ridiculous. Anyway, its pointless arguing it. I think its a stupid thing to do, to run a press conference with loads of protesters there, whoever is up front, even if its daffy duck and mickey mouse. Other people see it as Johnson chickening out of a normal press conference with no discernible noise and won't listen to any other possible explanation.

What does Boris expect? He's potentially turning these people's lives upside down and perhaps uprooting many families and kids who have only known these places as home.

I'm sure he would like us all to kowtow and tug forelocks to our betters, but it's 2019, not 1600.

[Raffles]

Boris is now just running down the clock, he isn't interested in a deal with the EU.
Leaving is fine but no deal is not the intelligent thing to do, I've never heard his reasons for no deal, he doesn't discuss his plans openly. Acting very strange to me.

[marton]

	Quote:	Raffles
	Boris is now just running down the clock, he isn't interested in a deal with the EU. Leaving is fine but no deal is not the intelligent thing to do, I've never heard his reasons for no deal, he doesn't discuss his plans openly. Acting very strange to me.

Maybe like Trump he is also a Russian puppet!

[Raffles]

I don't know about that, but he's definitely wooden headed.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	Mikers
	Other people see it as Johnson chickening out of a normal press conference with no discernible noise and won't listen to any other possible explanation.

You'd have a valid point if it was the first occasion, but it isn't.

The PM was heckled when he made a statement outside No.10...
https://news.sky.com/video/johnson-h...ement-11800932

He cancelled an interview with Channel 4 at the G7 after they sent a fell crew down to Biarritz specially for it, and all because he didn't like the angle of a story they covered the previous evening.
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a9078441.html

He chose the Police event in Yorkshire for his next statement. you could see that as being his 'safe space', but it was a totally inappropriate backdrop for such a statement.

Then he moved on to Rotherham and got heckled and challenged there.

Then Luxembourg happened.

Cummings' policy of getting Johnson out into Leave areas outside of London backfired. The Google hits were all for him getting heckled in the UK, so they needed to make the search results promote more recent heckling occasions. That's how Cummings works. That's his purpose. What they wanted was 'Angry protesters in the EU force PM to cancel press appearance'. We they got was the PM running scared from a crowd of less than 100 angry British grannies and a baby, not that the media have reported it that way, but that's what it was. What a spineless, pathetic creature he is.

Good grief! Why would any european leader accommodate the person who is trying to screw them over with constant disrespect, lies and subterfuge.

We should be grateful to them for showing him up. I wonder if there's any chance the british public could be made aware that it was the 10 year tory austerity policy which screwed them over and not the EU? Maybe an european leader could swing that one by the british public.. seeing as the BBC and the british press refuse to do it.