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View Poll Results: What would you personally prefer to happen?
I want the UK to stay in an ever-closer union 49 23.11%
I want the UK to stay in a loosely connected EU 68 32.08%
I want the UK out because the EU is bad for the UK 22 10.38%
I want the UK out because the EU is a bad thing 23 10.85%
I want the UK out because this would be good for the rest of us 17 8.02%
I don't really care 33 15.57%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

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  #23921  
Old 28.10.2019, 13:41
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

"Coastbound" is a direction? In England when you are never more than a hop, skip and a jump from the coast, whatever direction you go?
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  #23922  
Old 28.10.2019, 13:46
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

As anyone started a book going that even with this extension, they'll still be arguing in January and we'll still be no further forward.
Boris needs to remove the broom from his derriêre and stop acting the buffoon. In today's Parliament, the circus never seems to leave town.
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  #23923  
Old 28.10.2019, 13:48
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Cancel it, go back to the drawing board, come up with a proper plan, then present it to the people in five years, ten years, however long it takes to do it properly.

Really, what a bunch of totally useless tossers the Tories have turned out to be.
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  #23924  
Old 28.10.2019, 13:49
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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"Coastbound" is a direction? In England when you are never more than a hop, skip and a jump from the coast, whatever direction you go?
Sure, you can append "bound" to almost anything to imply directionality.

My least favourite direction is "Eggbound".
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  #23925  
Old 28.10.2019, 13:51
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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"in sat 18 months" means "within 18 months of having gifted", right?

Just a guess because otherwise the total wealth tax rate in your example would exceed two thirds: aren't CGT and IHT offset, so net IHT if death occured in sat would be 480k? The analogous question arises WRT an inter-vivos trust and the 20% IHT that falls due upon its founding.

What hasn't been touched upon is income. An inter-vivos trust doesn't pay income tax, right? Ignoring the 6% every ten years (some of which seems likely to be bypassed by chosing the appropriate assets), isn't it correct to say that a trust's income is untaxed until paid out, at which point it's to be taxed as income by the recipient, right?


With tax rates like that nothing needs to get sold, that's what income is for, a small portion will do.
No offset with CGT against IHT, both totally separate.

Income in a trust is usually taxable in the recipients hands, if retained its taxed more highly than a person as allowance & rates are higher

Trusts are generally for asset protection, prevents kids & wife spending too much money & are not tax efficient today. Running costs will be 2-3% on a trust of 1,000,000

In reality few people can afford to give away assets, the CGT invested would likely pay the higher IHT, if further assets sold to pay the CGT then more CGT to pay. Taking life insurance for 7 years is an option, less so aged 70
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  #23926  
Old 28.10.2019, 13:52
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Cancel it, go back to the drawing board, come up with a proper plan, then present it to the people in five years, ten years, however long it takes to do it properly.

Really, what a bunch of totally useless tossers the Tories have turned out to be.
Well, if you as Brexiteer #1 (ok, #2 let's be honest) are now saying this, then it shows how far the pendulum has swung.

To be honest, if we do reassess, come up with a plan, show honest impact assessments and have a vote where people are clued up, i'm all for it and happy to accept the outcome. What I am not in favour of is this rush-job, self-aggrandizing mess that the Tories are trying to force down everyone's collective gullets.
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  #23927  
Old 28.10.2019, 13:59
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Cancel it, go back to the drawing board, come up with a proper plan, then present it to the people in five years, ten years, however long it takes to do it properly.

Really, what a bunch of totally useless tossers the Tories have turned out to be.
It's quite telling when you look at the kind of people who are pushing a "rush-it-through-and-don't-look-too-hard-at-the-details" kind of Brexit.

I think if it was done properly and not rushed, there would be a fair few more Remainers going for it.
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  #23928  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:10
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Cancel it, go back to the drawing board, come up with a proper plan, then present it to the people in five years, ten years, however long it takes to do it properly.
I'm reading that as spending the next 10yrs punctuating every positive political decision with "And you wouldn't get that with Brexit!"

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I think if it was done properly and not rushed, there would be a fair few more Remainers going for it.
I'm not one of them. Not heard a positive tangible benefit in 4yrs of debate.
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  #23929  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:11
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

This proposed general election. Tories want the 12th Dec but the SNP want the 9th. What's the big fuss over 3 days here? Feel I missed something
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  #23930  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:13
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Breaking News on the morning of 28th October:

EU Agrees to Brexit deadline extension up to 31st January 2020, says Donald Tusk.

BBC News - EU Agrees Brexit extension to the 31st January 2020
I wonder whether number 10 are digging a ditch in the back garden in which to throw two ( Theresa May &
Boris Johnson ) PM lookalike mannequins from Madame Tussauds before burying them with full honour's;
to mourn the passing of yet another 'do or die' deadline Brexit date by the Tory Government.

Maybe future generations might forget who lies buried at the back of number 10 until future historians
hit upon the idea of let's call it:

The Tomb of the Unknown Brexiteers !!

Last edited by John William; 28.10.2019 at 14:23.
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  #23931  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:13
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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This proposed general election. Tories want the 12th Dec but the SNP want the 9th. What's the big fuss over 3 days here? Feel I missed something
Elections are always on Thursdays in the UK. How can they have it on a Monday?
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  #23932  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:20
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Elections are always on Thursdays in the UK. How can they have it on a Monday?
The SNP have not struck me as being very clever, they do make the Conservatives seem more competent, quite an own goal
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  #23933  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:21
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Elections are always on Thursdays in the UK. How can they have it on a Monday?
Traditionally they are always on a Thursday, but this is not written into law.

Thursdays were chosen because way back when somebody guessed you would get the highest turnout on a Thursday.

Dominic Cummings et al would prefer a lower turnout.

I’d think Sunday would actually provide the largest turnout.

So why don’t they have the second Referendum on Sunday and the election the following Thursday.
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  #23934  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:28
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Tories want the 12th Dec but the SNP want the 9th. What's the big fuss over 3 days here? Feel I missed something
Multiple things depending who you listen to.

1. Tories say 12 Dec offers the 3 days of debate they want to pass the WA.

2. Tories claim 9 Dec removes that debate time owing to the dissolution of Parliament.

3. PM led GE plan leaves the power to move the GE date in the hands of the PM, therefore he could force the UK to crash out of the EU at any point.

4. Uni terms end on either 9 Dec (Oxford, etc) or 13 Dec in many others. 9 Dec GE would catch the largest quota of student votes.

5. PM GE would be using the FTPA and require 2/3 of the vote to pass.

6. LD/SNP GE would be a one page amendable paper and only require a simple majority vote, therefore far more likely to garner enough support in the HoC.

I'm sure there are more reasons but I can't think of them off the top of my head.

Personally, I'm not in favour of either option and have emailed my local LD branch, British In Europe and the British Embassy yesterday expressing my concern. Despite what anyone might think, that's extremely out of character for me and I've never emailed the LDs or the British Embassy before.

Two reasons...
1. The European Parliament Elections vote fiasco hasn't been addressed properly yet, nevermind resolved.

2. The CWU postal workers union have pending strike action. The dates have yet to be announced, but on social media they have been open about deliberately planning it take place on dates which will be detrimental to the postal votes, because they misguidedly believe that the majority of postal voters are Conservatives.


N.B. Quick question please? Does anyone here have a proxy postal vote set up in the UK with a person who doesn't live in their voting constituency?

Last edited by Blueangel; 28.10.2019 at 14:36. Reason: Not 75% but 2/3. Sorry!
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  #23935  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:29
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Sure, you can append "bound" to almost anything to imply directionality.

My least favourite direction is "Eggbound".
in English words that end like that abound.
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  #23936  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:30
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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The SNP have not struck me as being very clever, they do make the Conservatives seem more competent, quite an own goal
Given the incompetence of the Tories thus far, it would seem the SNP /LDs aren't taking any chances and fighting for the max number of days before 31st Jan deadline.

It's not difficult to see the logic.
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Old 28.10.2019, 14:31
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Breaking News on the morning of 28th October:

EU Agrees to Brexit deadline extension up to 31st January 2020, says Donald Tusk.

BBC News - EU Agrees Brexit extension to the 31st January 2020
<<The president of the European Parliament, David Sassoli, said the extension was "positive", and "gives time for the UK to make clear what it wants". >>
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  #23938  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:34
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Given the incompetence of the Tories thus far, it would seem the SNP /LDs aren't taking any chances and fighting for the max number of days before 31st Jan deadline.

It's not difficult to see the logic.
The SNP want the 9th though so will get 3 days less
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  #23939  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:53
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Given the incompetence of the Tories thus far, it would seem the SNP /LDs aren't taking any chances and fighting for the max number of days before 31st Jan deadline.

It's not difficult to see the logic.

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The SNP want the 9th though so will get 3 days less
I never thought Sandgrounder or StirB who thanked the post were particularly strong on logic, thanks for pointing this out
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  #23940  
Old 28.10.2019, 14:55
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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The SNP want the 9th though so will get 3 days less
But three days more from GE to eventual exit, though. I guess this is the time when the SNP/LD assumes the Tories will do their damnedest to force amendments and other shenanigans, so are looking for max time to deal with it.
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