The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[bowlie]

Additionally the EU is not a static thing. It is constantly evolving, for better or worse, as its member states evolve.

I don’t think there is much appetite for ‘an even closer union’ today in Berlin, Paris, Rome or Madrid - or even in Brussels.

The Union will survive, with or without the excited kingdom, but as it is.

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	Sandgrounder
	If you swallowed all that as gospel truth then, yes, I too can see why you voted to Leave.

	Quote:	John William
	That must be the gospel as dreamt up by Dominic Cummings, embellished by the ERG before being uttered by the likes of Boris and Rees-Mogg and I love the punch line at the end, namely it's going to take 50 years for Brexit Britain to benefit from such a dream !! Another classic Mañana, mañana from a Brexiteer.

	Quote:	RufusB
	This may as well begin with "Once upon a time" ...

Brexit voter stupid. Love the originality.

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	I love how he loves making decisions for other people's kids, but not for his own. https://www.englishforum.ch/permits-...ml#post3102977 https://www.englishforum.ch/permits-...ml#post3103071

I’ve never said nor pretended otherwise that I’ve not benefitted from the EU. Nor have I ever said it was an easy decision to come to in voting to leave. I’m also not a politician so don’t have to reconcile my vote with the fact that I myself have benefitted from the UK being within the EU.

I do believe the vote was bigger than “what has the EU done for me” though. Truth be told I would have preferred the referendum be held 5 or 10 years later however I’m convinced that leaving is the correct decision long term. I also don’t believe one should vote for benefits for their kids if they believe that their grandchildren will have to pay the price.

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	k_and_e
	I kind of agree with that but it counts for Europe, not the EU. I don't see that happen. Yes, they are growing and often innovative, but their key strength seems to be cheap (cheap production resources, cheap offshoring). That's doesn't get a country anywhere.

At the moment you’re right, but what happens when their economies develop to the next level as we’ve seen in China and India? How will German heavy manufacturing be able to compete as the drip drip drip of core technology knowhow keeps getting lost to these developing markets?

I know it’s been used to death but Switzerland is one of the few examples we have. Switzerland has fantastic innovation and by not being a member of the EU has been able to steer its economy in a way that it is better prepared to deal with what’s coming. I don’t believe the UK will be able to ape Switzerland but it does show what is possible.

[Sandgrounder]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Brexit voter stupid. Love the originality.

You are the only person to use the word ‘stupid’.

[Sandgrounder]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	I know it’s been used to death but Switzerland is one of the few examples we have. Switzerland has fantastic innovation and by not being a member of the EU has been able to steer its economy in a way that it is better prepared to deal with what’s coming. I don’t believe the UK will be able to ape Switzerland but it does show what is possible.

You know that Switzerland isn’t in the same no-deal / shit deal scenario the UK is currently facing down, right? Nor does Switzerland have ‘sucking Trump’s balls’ on its to-do list.

[curley]

	Quote:	Sandgrounder
	You know that Switzerland isn’t in the same no-deal / shit deal scenario the UK is currently facing down, right? Nor does Switzerland have ‘sucking Trump’s balls’ on its to-do list.

Oh yuck, that would fall victim to procrastination if it were.

[marton]

Royal Mail wins bid to halt Christmas postal strikes

So postal voting for the next GE is safe!

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	Sandgrounder
	You are the only person to use the word ‘stupid’.

Just like the racist that never uses the N-word.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Sandgrounder
	You know that Switzerland isn’t in the same no-deal / shit deal scenario the UK is currently facing down, right? Nor does Switzerland have ‘sucking Trump’s balls’ on its to-do list.

He is also ignoring the fact that as EFTA members we take advantage of it 29 FTAs.... which covers about 80% of the groups trade, a bit like the deals covering 90% of the UKs trade that they are about to walk away from...

[Sandgrounder]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Just like the racist that never uses the N-word.

Actually, the reality is I was thinking you were too trusting, clearly fact-resistant and a bit gullible when it comes to Brexit. But if you favour the word ‘stupid’ that’s up to you.

[greenmount]

	Quote:	Jim2007
	Poster like TonyClifton always seem to ignore the obvious - the EU, USA, China etc... have no intention of sitting back while the UK some magically move forward ahead of them. Of course they won't and they have far more resources and capabilities to enforce their position than a junior partner, with is what the UK is about to become. They also ignore the fact that if you at the history of the EU it is actually very capable of reform, it's just that that reform does not suit him, so he choose to ignore it and pretend it does not happen. For instance the EU is second only to the US when it comes to military spending and as the focus moves a way from NATO and onto coordinated EU defence spending you can expect more cash will be available for investment in European projects and the UK will not be in the queue for either US or EU military spending and so on. Going it alone seeking to built a technology basis is not on the cards but anyway...

I know, sorry I'll be very quick: to talk in these terms of doom and gloom when Europe is one of the most innovative places in the world and you only have to look at human development indexes, education systems and so on.....and praise other places like India and China instead, wow. Not to mention freedom and peace. I think he's one of those trolls that we used to have right from the beginning when the Brexit thing started, but they're getting better and better these days. More subtle. But more ridiculous too.

[greenmount]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Brexit voter stupid. Love the originality.

	Quote:	Sandgrounder
	You are the only person to use the word ‘stupid’.

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Just like the racist that never uses the N-word.

I think someone should have spelled it out for you, after all you must be one of those people who are against political correctness and all that stuff that certain conservatives invoke when they are being called out on the shit they talk.

Stupid. There.

[k_and_e]

	Quote:	greenmount
	I know, sorry I'll be very quick: to talk in these terms of doom and gloom when Europe is one of the most innovative places in the world and you only have to look at human development indexes, education systems and so on.....and praise other places like India and China instead, wow. Not to mention freedom and peace. I think he's one of those trolls that we used to have right from the beginning when the Brexit thing started, but they're getting better and better these days. More subtle. But more ridiculous too.

So someone with a different opinion than you is a troll? Seems like freedom is not for everyone.

[greenmount]

	Quote:	k_and_e
	So someone with a different opinion than you is a troll? Seems like freedom is not for everyone.

Look up the definition of a troll. Why are you trolling me, btw? ;-)

You should use all that uhm love, for better causes, seriously. Your stalking is already ridiculous.

[k_and_e]

	Quote:	greenmount
	Look up the definition of a troll. Why are you trolling me, btw? ;-) You should use all that hate for better causes, seriously.

I don't think he is trolling. The posts seem to be his genuine opinion and everyone here is free to have an opinion. We can disagree without calling someone a troll.

[greenmount]

	Quote:	k_and_e
	I don't think he is trolling. The posts seem to be his genuine opinion and everyone here is free to have an opinion. We can disagree without calling someone a troll.

Everyone can have a free opinion minus people who call the trolls - trolls?

Lol, this is getting silly. I am pretty sure though that you can see the irony in all of these...
Seriously, why don't you stop stalking me?

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	k_and_e
	The posts seem to be his genuine opinion and everyone here is free to have an opinion. We can disagree without calling someone a troll.

When someone says they agree with national service as long as their kids aren't obliged do it, and is willing to remove the FOM of us and ours but brags about it not affecting their kids, I'd say that's trolling. Also, whilst StirB took a comic approach in responding to this "the likes of countries you’ve barely heard of will soon become economic power houses", my bread and butter was booking business flights to those countries and knowing which flights had to be met with a security detail because they were quite literally in bandit country. TC claims we're calling him 'stupid'. He's the one implying we're all stupid. Do not be mistaken about that.

[greenmount]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	When someone says they agree with national service as long as their kids aren't obliged do it, and is willing to remove the FOM of us and ours but brags about it not affecting their kids, I'd say that's trolling. Also, whilst StirB took a comic approach in responding to this "the likes of countries you’ve barely heard of will soon become economic power houses", my bread and butter was booking business flights to those countries and knowing which flights had to be met with a security detail because they were quite literally in bandit country. TC claims we're calling him 'stupid'. He's the one implying we're all stupid. Do not be mistaken about that.

You assume K and E wants an honest discussion but he only wants to diminish/humiliate certain posters that he repeatedly called "keyboard warriors" for having a different opinion than his own (see an older reply to RufusB, I can look it up for you) and made fun of (mainly the "Remoaners" and other people about whom he probably thinks they shouldn't voice their opinions here) while bringing false counterarguments. Just so you know. And then accuses others for doing the things that he's actually doing. The old internet "tricks" and old that jazz.
At the end of the day this is EF, I know. But still.

	Quote:	k_and_e
	I don't think he is trolling. The posts seem to be his genuine opinion and everyone here is free to have an opinion. We can disagree without calling someone a troll.

You crack me up. As soon as you're called a troll, you tone it down and write a few more reasonable sentences, rather than the usual one-liners.. and then do a double take and calmly call someone out for doing something you're doing yourself. Lol!

I love the reasonable, we all have an opinion shite about folks who write false bollocks, and plenty of it..