The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[Blueangel]

	Quote:
	It's a mechanism whereby members posting from bullshit factories in Omsk can be made invisible to genuine members of the forum.

But if TC put everyone he disagreed with on the ignore list, he'd have nothing left to read.

[Jim2007]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	But if TC put everyone he disagreed with on the ignore list, he'd have nothing left to read.

Think positive - he'd have no one to respond to either....

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	....Boris Johnson has said he will not cut corporation tax in order to fund the NHS (information). Couple this together with other information that we have – the Tories have pledged to take public spending up to the highest levels since the 1970s (a far cry from the party of fiscal responsibility of traditional right-wing Conservatives), they plan to set wages (through the minimum wage) of one in four people. This is a heavy spending, higher regulating Conservative Party which is a far cry from the Thatcherite (Right wing) years of deregulation and small government. EVIDENCE that the Conservative Party is taking up the center ground. Feel free to prove me wrong, only do try a little harder than “he’s lying” or “he’ll go back on his promises”....

An agenda that is not a million miles away from AfD or National Rally. It's what the far right are doing these days.

[John William]

	Quote:
	It's a mechanism whereby members posting from bullshit factories in Omsk can be made invisible to genuine members of the forum.

Which at this rate will mean that TC will posting his views all on his lonesome ( because he's filtered the
rest of us out ) with only fellow Brexit FMF for company.

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:
	Evidence is absolutely the same as facts. Everything else is varying shades of opinion. Just like everything you have written here. Please supply an example of evidence that is not fact based. "I care about democracy" implies that unless a person votes Tory, they don't care about democracy. Opinion as fact. "They are the only rational option " = hyperbole plus opinion as fact. Rest of paragraph, opinion as fact. No evidence, only opinion.

I can go one better. Here is my evidence that evidence is not equivalent to facts.

https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/evidence
https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/evidence
https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dic...glish/evidence
https://www.collinsdictionary.com/di...glish/evidence

Witnesses provide evidence in court. What they say may not be factually true.

It would be much less tedious if you'd just stick to the point of discussion.

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	John William
	Which at this rate will mean that TC will posting his views all on his lonesome ( because he's filtered the rest of us out ) with only fellow Brexit FMF for company.

Looks like the Tories will win the election with a landslide victory & BREXIT will occur shortly after. Won't be much to add to the thread

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	Looks like the Tories will win the election with a landslide victory & BREXIT will occur shortly after. Won't be much to add to the thread

Lemme guess... You've got a case of champagne ready to go?

That's never ended badly before, has it?

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	I can go one better. Here is my evidence that evidence is not equivalent to facts. https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/evidence https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/evidence https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dic...glish/evidence https://www.collinsdictionary.com/di...glish/evidence Witnesses provide evidence in court. What they say may not be factually true. It would be much less tedious if you'd just stick to the point of discussion.

Kind of a neat metaphor for Brexit really, isn't it? "Here's your totally honest non-fact based evidence to help you make your mind up, voters!"

Sorry if you think it's snarky but hey, come on, that IS funny!

[Blueangel]

Looks like the frit, chicken PM won't be standing in the 7 way TV debate, so tonight could be your only chance to see him squirm. Comes to something when the PM is seen as a debate liability unable to be held accountable.

	Quote:
	Scoop: Boris Johnson set to be replaced by Rishi Sunak in seven-way BBC #ge2019 debate next Friday PM very unlikely to attend, sending chief secretary to the Treasury in his place. Sunak, widely seen as a rising star in the Tory party, is the frontrunner to stand in for Mr Johnson on November 29. Conservative campaign insiders describe him as “a very ample TV performer” who is “intellectually dexterous”. The Tory campaign is keen to downplay the importance of the seven-way debate. Insiders describe it as "not a top-tier TV event”, which may explain why more senior cabinet ministers such as Sajid Javid and Priti Patel have not been put forward.

https://twitter.com/SebastianEPayne/...95796659822601

[aSwissInTheUS]

Mr. Bertolt Brecht once said something to the like of: He who says A as in acclamation does not have to say B as in Brexit. He can also realize that A was wrong.

Also, pushing a change through with all means which has no majority support in the population is not "democratic" even if in the past the same society has approved the change by democratic means.

If one wants the Brexit they know what they have to vote for in the next general election, but doing so just in the spirit of a false sense of democratic fulfillment is foolish and cowardice. It is just a cheap excuse to not have a real opinion and to not take responsibility for its own actions by putting the blame on the outcome of a past and no longer relevant referendum.

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	I can go one better. Here is my evidence that evidence is not equivalent to facts. https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/evidence https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/evidence https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dic...glish/evidence https://www.collinsdictionary.com/di...glish/evidence Witnesses provide evidence in court. What they say may not be factually true. It would be much less tedious if you'd just stick to the point of discussion.

It would be much less tedious if you actually read stuff properly and understood what was in those links.


Prove. True. Facts.

If witnesses say things that are not true then they are furnishing the court with viewpoints, feelings, opinions.

But sure. You clearly feel a desperate need to be Right in the face of, well, evidence to the contrary.

Question: are you paid by the word or the sentence? If it's by the idea/viewpoint you're not going to make much.

[marton]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	I can go one better. Here is my evidence that evidence is not equivalent to facts. https://www.lexico.com/en/definition/evidence https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/evidence https://dictionary.cambridge.org/dic...glish/evidence https://www.collinsdictionary.com/di...glish/evidence Witnesses provide evidence in court. What they say may not be factually true. It would be much less tedious if you'd just stick to the point of discussion.

"Witnesses provide evidence in court. What they say may not be factually true." In that case, it is no longer evidence, it is perjury

[bowlie]

Is it perjury if they believe it is true, when it isn’t? Eye-witnesses are notoriously unreliable.

[Blueangel]

There's still time to print off your Boris Bingo cards for the debate now, but Deborah Meaden has already called "Bingo!" so we're on round 2.

https://twitter.com/BlandreaJ/status...82883584774145

This link is for the bulls*** bingo card

https://twitter.com/ashgriff123/stat...630528/photo/1

[Raffles]

Well me myself and I do not feel reassured with either of the candidates during this debate.

[Blueangel]

Diabolical show from both tonight, but this takes the biscuit...


https://twitter.com/FullFact/status/1196887778736390146

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a9209816.html

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/poli...-a4291281.html

https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-50482637

[bowlie]

Following the debate, I don’t think many of the electorate were swayed.

The polls suggest that it will be close and it appears the conservatives will not have enough to force through Brexit.

Plus ça change plus c'est la même chose.

	Quote:	bowlie
	Following the debate, I don’t think many of the electorate were swayed. The polls suggest that it will be close and it appears the conservatives will not have enough to force through Brexit. Plus ça change plus c'est la même chose.

They could form a coalition government with some party that doesn't really want Brexit. Then there will be a Brexit proposal with a deadline extension. Some Tories will not support the proposal or leave the party. They will replace the PM and then we are exactly where we are now

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	k_and_e
	They will replace the PM and then we are exactly where we are now

I think the whole bloody lot of them should have a restore point in early 2010. That's one button I'd definitely press.

[marton]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Diabolical show from both tonight, but this takes the biscuit... Attachment 138184 https://twitter.com/FullFact/status/1196887778736390146 https://www.independent.co.uk/news/u...-a9209816.html https://www.standard.co.uk/news/poli...-a4291281.html https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-50482637

After an almighty storm, Twitter (TWTR) said that further attempts at deception would result in "decisive corrective action."