The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:
	Is that a bit like "if a tree falls down in a forest does it make a sound if nobody hears it?" Just because you don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't happen. You are a Tory-voter so I'm guessing you're blind to the antics of people like Tommy Robinson et al, and only see what the naughty extreme left is doing.

I don't vote for anyone, would probably have voted for Tony Blair on his second term had I been in the U.K. Ever heard of floating voters? Tommy Robinson was never a Conservative so hardly a good example.

[greenmount]

	Quote:	k_and_e
	What point do you make here?

It's all in the article.

[Mikers]

	Quote:
	Is that a bit like "if a tree falls down in a forest does it make a sound if nobody hears it?" Just because you don't see it doesn't mean it doesn't happen. You are a Tory-voter so I'm guessing you're blind to the antics of people like Tommy Robinson et al, and only see what the naughty extreme left is doing.

I think there is a difference between far right groups like tommy robinsons lot (who wont be tory supporters anyway they are national front / britain first supporters) and the general left leaning gang who find it funny to throw milk shakes over people while shouting "scum" at them.

If you can find some examples of conservative voters screaming "corbyn scum" at Jeremy corbyn, or John Macdonald, or the rest of them, would be great so I can be confident its not just a one sided affair.

	Quote:	Mikers
	I think there is a difference between far right groups like tommy robinsons lot (who wont be tory supporters anyway they are national front / britain first supporters) and the general left leaning gang who find it funny to throw milk shakes over people while shouting "scum" at them. If you can find some examples of conservative voters screaming "corbyn scum" at Jeremy corbyn, or John Macdonald, or the rest of them, would be great so I can be confident its not just a one sided affair.

Don't know if he's a Tory but as we seem to be apportioning Brexiters as Tories and Remainers as Lefties...

Brexit supporter who assaulted Jeremy Corbyn jailed for 28 days

	Quote:
	A Brexit supporter who attacked Jeremy Corbyn with an egg during a mosque visit while yelling “respect the vote” has admitted an assault charge and been sentenced to 28 days’ imprisonment. John Murphy, hit the Labour leader in the head with the egg during the visit to Finsbury Park mosque and Muslim Welfare House in his north London constituency as part of the annual Visit My Mosque Day initiative.

Not sure why it's relevant nor why (once again) it's down to someone with an opposing point of view having to find sources to support someone else's views but, hey.

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	I don't vote for anyone, would probably have voted for Tony Blair on his second term had I been in the U.K. Ever heard of floating voters? Tommy Robinson was never a Conservative so hardly a good example.

Mikers brought up the subject of "hard left" and "hard right" so my post was really directed at him rather than you and your "reminiscing about Tony Blair" / "I can't vote" response. Tommy Robinson is a hard right example so was therefore relevant. Just sayin'

Read the preceding posts before going off on a tangent.

[amogles]

	Quote:	Mikers
	I think there is a difference between far right groups like tommy robinsons lot (who wont be tory supporters anyway they are national front / britain first supporters) and the general left leaning gang who find it funny to throw milk shakes over people while shouting "scum" at them.

To me even the idea of holding up Tommy Robinson as an example of despicable Toriness simply reeks of desperation.

	Quote:	Blueangel
	Absolutely. I've not had a single argument over Brexit or the election.

I have. But then me and my mum made up over a cuppa.

	Quote:	amogles
	To me even the idea of holding up Tommy Robinson as an example of despicable Toriness simply reeks of desperation.

Isn't he "hard right", then?

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	amogles
	To me even the idea of holding up Tommy Robinson as an example of despicable Toriness simply reeks of desperation.

Quite, people have very short memories, how about 'Ding Dong the which is dead" celebrating the death of Mrs Thatcher. More than 1 person in this thread commented positively at the time.

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	Quite, people have very short memories, how about 'Ding Dong the which is dead" celebrating the death of Mrs Thatcher. More than 1 person in this thread commented positively at the time.

That counts me out. I can spell "witch".

[John William]

[Mikers]

	Quote:
	Don't know if he's a Tory but as we seem to be apportioning Brexiters as Tories and Remainers as Lefties... Brexit supporter who assaulted Jeremy Corbyn jailed for 28 days Not sure why it's relevant nor why (once again) it's down to someone with an opposing point of view having to find sources to support someone else's views but, hey. Mikers brought up the subject of "hard left" and "hard right" so my post was really directed at him rather than you and your "reminiscing about Tony Blair" / "I can't vote" response. Tommy Robinson is a hard right example so was therefore relevant. Just sayin'

No, its not the same or a good example, that person is a nutter for brexit, he'd chuck eggs at the libdem's just as much I expect. probably boris johnson as well. he might go for milk shakes if its nigel farage. and his argument isnt about tory or labour, its about brexit.

The point being made, which isnt argumentative, isnt being "brought up" by me, was just showing that a survey has shown that labour supporters view people who dont match their views negatively, which you can see from endless examples of conservative politicians being shouted at by labour supporters who scream abuse at them. no brexit, no remain or leave, they do it just beacuse they hate them and they can. they do it over the NHS, over austerity, over welfare cuts, over thatchers death, anything they can find.

You don't find conservative supporters hurling the same level of vitriol at labour politicians or not that I have seen. Of course - it could be happening as has been said, but no one sees it. these crowds of tory blue's charging around braying at Laura Hitchcock or Dianne Abbot, with full riot squad police struggling to control them. but I havent seen it. Has anyone else ? do pipe up if you have.

Of course do not lose site that I dont like the tories. As I posted earlier, right now i dont like the tories, labour, libdems or any of them and want a proper centre ground party back. but that doesnt change the fact that labour are much more vocal in their abuse of conservative politicians.

[John William]

Meanwhile look who's been visiting Jean Claude Juncker's Grotto for Christmas.

	Quote:	Mikers
	No, its not the same or a good example, that person is a nutter for brexit, he'd chuck eggs at the libdem's just as much I expect. probably boris johnson as well. he might go for milk shakes if its nigel farage. and his argument isnt about tory or labour, its about brexit. The point being made, which isnt argumentative, isnt being "brought up" by me, was just showing that a survey has shown that labour supporters view people who dont match their views negatively, which you can see from endless examples of conservative politicians being shouted at by labour supporters who scream abuse at them. no brexit, no remain or leave, they do it just beacuse they hate them and they can. they do it over the NHS, over austerity, over welfare cuts, over thatchers death, anything they can find. You don't find conservative supporters hurling the same level of vitriol at labour politicians or not that I have seen. Of course - it could be happening as has been said, but no one sees it. these crowds of tory blue's charging around braying at Laura Hitchcock or Dianne Abbot, with full riot squad police struggling to control them. but I havent seen it. Has anyone else ? do pipe up if you have. Of course do not lose site that I dont like the tories. As I posted earlier, right now i dont like the tories, labour, libdems or any of them and want a proper centre ground party back. but that doesnt change the fact that labour are much more vocal in their abuse of conservative politicians.

It's highly subjective territory, to be fair. The whole Brexit/General Election thing is entwined and messy. To say that it's Labour supporters dishing out all the abuse is surprisingly naive. It's also being blown out of proportion in many cases, too. The bloke yesterday that apparently was "attacked by a Labour supporter" actually ran into the guy's finger if you look at the video. The truth now doesn't matter. The screaming tweets which were then picked up by the media already did the damage. So I guess a lot of it depends on how good you are at spinning stories and perhaps the Tories have the edge on that. A dubious accolade.

[amogles]

	Quote:	Mikers
	No, its not the same or a good example, that person is a nutter for brexit, he'd chuck eggs at the libdem's just as much I expect. probably boris johnson as well. he might go for milk shakes if its nigel farage. and his argument isnt about tory or labour, its about brexit.

Exactly. Just a nutter who did something stupid. I am not aware of many Brexiteers supporting what he did.

Quite in contrast to that guy who threw a milkshake over Farage, whose video was shared and liked by millions.

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	Quite, people have very short memories, how about 'Ding Dong the which is dead" celebrating the death of Mrs Thatcher. More than 1 person in this thread commented positively at the time.

She died in 2013 and I joined EF in 2015, so it wasn't me either.

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	Blueangel
	She died in 2013 and I joined EF in 2015, so it wasn't me either.

You missed all the fun!

[Mikers]

	Quote:
	It's highly subjective territory, to be fair. The whole Brexit/General Election thing is entwined and messy. To say that it's Labour supporters dishing out all the abuse is surprisingly naive. It's also being blown out of proportion in many cases, too. The bloke yesterday that apparently was "attacked by a Labour supporter" actually ran into the guy's finger if you look at the video. The truth now doesn't matter. The screaming tweets which were then picked up by the media already did the damage. So I guess a lot of it depends on how good you are at spinning stories and perhaps the Tories have the edge on that. A dubious accolade.

Ok, so to shame me for my clear naivety, can you give me an example of some conservative supporters shouting abuse at labour politicians, just an example will help. I can show you any number of news clips of labour supporters surrounding conservative politicians and bawling abuse at them. There must be a bunch of the same kind of thing you can pick up in return ?

	Quote:	amogles
	Exactly. Just a nutter who did something stupid. I am not aware of many Brexiteers supporting what he did. Quite in contrast to that guy who threw a milkshake over Farage, whose video was shared and liked by millions.

A nutter who did something stupid?

This thread is an exercise in advanced face-palmery.

	Quote:	Mikers
	Ok, so to shame me for my clear naivety, can you give me an example of some conservative supporters shouting abuse at labour politicians, just an example will help. I can show you any number of news clips of labour supporters surrounding conservative politicians and bawling abuse at them. There must be a bunch of the same kind of thing you can pick up in return ?

But why? What does it prove? Is there even a point to that any more? There was a survey posted by ToryClifton about people arguing over Brexit or having hurt feelings because they are Tory voters or whatever it was and now you are demanding footage of Labour supporters haranguing Tory politicians? Sorry, but the original point is so far derailed now.

[Mikers]

	Quote:
	A nutter who did something stupid? This thread is an exercise in advanced face-palmery. But why? What does it prove? Is there even a point to that any more? There was a survey posted by ToryClifton about people arguing over Brexit or having hurt feelings because they are Tory voters or whatever it was and now you are demanding footage of Labour supporters haranguing Tory politicians? Sorry, but the original point is so far derailed now.

Doesnt seem that derailed to me. It shows that in line with the survey, labour supporters view people who dont hold thier views more negatively than conservative supporters. I think we're still on track. if you've got an example, post away. if not then yes lets move on from the accurate and informative survey that Tony has posted.

[amogles]

	Quote:
	But why? What does it prove? Is there even a point to that any more? There was a survey posted by ToryClifton about people arguing over Brexit or having hurt feelings because they are Tory voters or whatever it was and now you are demanding footage of Labour supporters haranguing Tory politicians? Sorry, but the original point is so far derailed now.

And so the meltdown continues, as we drift into the realm of ever absurder extrapolations.

The statistic showed that Labour and Remain supporters are less likely to be tolerant of views on these matters that differ from their own.

Nothing in there about hurt feelings.