The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in CH

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:	bigblue2
	the Diane Abbot bit

Diane Abbot is no worse than some of the others who are vying for the job. Wouldn’t be my pick though!

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Diane Abbot is no worse than some of the others who are vying for the job. Wouldn’t be my pick though!

Really? Do you know who Diane Abbott is? She's not in the same stratosphere as Phillips or Cooper.

[amogles]

	Quote:	marton
	"Churchill also said he was "strongly in favour of using poisoned gas against uncivilised tribes"," Prime example of whataboutery. Napoleon III's reconstruction of Paris was very successful and stands today.

There is no doubt that Churchill was a great and courageous leader, and that we owe him a huge debt of gratitude. One daren't even think what the world might be like today had he been less resolute.

He was also a great historian, writer, and orator, and the originator of many great one-liners.

One the other hand, he wasn't an angel by any stretch. He had very negative and dark sides to his character and said and also did many things that are difficult if not impossible to justify.

A "what would Churchill have done?" type of approach is not necessarily the most meaningful in today's context.

[TonyClifton]

	Quote:
	Oh Jess Phillips or Yvette Cooper would bother him quite a bit, I reckon.

Yvette Cooper nearly lost her seat thanks to her Brexit actions during the rotten Parliament. Jess Phillips is good on pointing out problems, not so good on solutions. Neither has much of a chance anyhow as it all comes back to the membership, and they will likely choose someone in the mould of Corbyn.

The Labour Party should have split years ago, but the likes of Tom Watson, Yvette Cooper and Jess Phillips didn’t have the backbone to do it!

[bigblue2]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Diane Abbot is no worse than some of the others who are vying for the job. Wouldn’t be my pick though!

?? she's an imbecile, every interview she gives is a train wreck, she can't even put matching shoes on ffs

[amogles]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	The Labour Party should have split years ago, but the likes of Tom Watson, Yvette Cooper and Jess Phillips didn’t have the backbone to do it!

They did. That's how the Dem bit got into the Libdems.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Social...tic_Party_(UK))

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Yvette Cooper nearly lost her seat thanks to her Brexit actions during the rotten Parliament. Jess Phillips is good on pointing out problems, not so good on solutions. Neither has much of a chance anyhow as it all comes back to the membership, and they will likely choose someone in the mould of Corbyn. The Labour Party should have split years ago, but the likes of Tom Watson, Yvette Cooper and Jess Phillips didn’t have the backbone to do it!

You're very big on backbone, I notice. And exclamatory phrases.

And

	Quote:
	You're very big on backbone, I notice. And exclamatory phrases. And

It's very easy language to add pizzazz to one's point of view without actually having to quantify anything or bring anything resembling fact.

[amogles]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	It’s not going to happen though unless the membership changes! Also, it’s not as if there’s a long list of candidates who are able to step up to the task. Of the current runners and riders I don’t see anyone there to bother Boris Johnson which is a shame. The biggest threat Boris Johnson faces is himself!

It's still early days and many leaders rise to the opportunity and don't really start to stand out until they are actually at the top. So let's wait and see.

I agree that Boris has a tendency of being his own worst enemy, so I hope the good Boris wins and suppresses the more crazy stuff.

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	The Labour Party should have split years ago, but the likes of Tom Watson, Yvette Cooper and Jess Phillips didn’t have the backbone to do it!

As they found out in the 80s, in the idiotic UK electoral system to split is suicide.

	Quote:
	As they found out in the 80s, in the idiotic UK electoral system to split is suicide.

Sometimes the electoral system saves the UK from other nightmares, too horrible to contemplate...

	Quote:
	In the 2015 general election, UKIP secured over 3.8 million votes (12.6% of the total), replacing the Liberal Democrats as the third most popular party, but only secured one seat, with Carswell retaining his seat and Reckless losing his.

[greenmount]

	Quote:	amogles
	... and ensure labour remains unelectable for another election cycle or two? In earnest, despite the entertainment of seeing Labour repeatedly shoot themselves in the foot, democracy requires a competent opposition and needs to be able to challenge the government on an eye to eye level. If you can't have that, democracy becomes a farce. I therefore wish that somebody competent steps into Corbyn's shoes.

And the Labour party would start having a proper decorative role in the eternal opposition benches? It doesn't seem very sincere to me.

There was too much gloating over the Labour's massive defeat.

[Aeneas]

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	Why should this be a joke? It’s been talked about for a long time that the next Labour leader should be a woman. Stephen Kinnock has today said so too.

Not a black, gay woman??!!

You homophobic, misogynist bigot!

[Blueangel]

	Quote:	amogles
	There is no doubt that Churchill was a great and courageous leader, and that we owe him a huge debt of gratitude. One daren't even think what the world might be like today had he been less resolute.

He was a great wartime leader and we were lucky to have him at that time.

	Quote:	TonyClifton
	The Labour Party should have split years ago, but the likes of Tom Watson, Yvette Cooper and Jess Phillips didn’t have the backbone to do it!

Nothing to do with backbone.
Reminds me of OH's dad who told his sons they must "fight apartheid from the inside out". Those three MPs didn't want to surrender their party to the Corbynistas.

As for the next Labour leader, it should be the best candidate regardless of any feature of their being. I reckon Johnson would have a run for his money with Eagle. She'd scare the crap out of him when she's in full flow, but she's not my personal top tip.

[Tom1234]

	Quote:	greenmount
	There was too much gloating over the Labour's massive defeat.

That's par for the course in a democracy.

[fatmanfilms]

Armenia-EU trade

Armenia benefits from the EU's Generalised Scheme of Preferences plus (GSP+) trading initiative. This offers Armenian exports advantageous access to the EU market by allowing complete duty suspension across approximately 66% of all EU tariff lines. More than 96% of EU imports eligible for GSP+ preferences from Armenia entered the EU with zero duties in 2017. The EU is Armenia's biggest export market, trade with the EU accounts for around 26.7% of Armenia's total trade.[47] EU-Armenia trade increased by 15% in 2018 reaching a total value of €1.1 billion.[48]

EU assistance to Armenia

The EU is the biggest provider of financial support and a key reform partner in Armenia.[48] As part of the European Neighbourhood Policy, Armenia benefits from EU financial assistance. The amount allocated to Armenia depends on Armenia's commitment to reforms. Certain EU reform targets need to be met before money is paid. The planned amount of EU assistance to Armenia for the period 2017-2020 is up to €185 million.[49][50]

So, Armenia is part of a ‘friends of the EU’ group enjoying significant almost level playing field trade with the EU but without the associated risks attached, without the membership costs attached AND it gets EU payments.

My question is...WTF is that all about?

[fatmanfilms]

	Quote:	bigblue2
	the Diane Abbot bit

Why would I pick a strong & capable leader for the opposition? The forum seems a little slower than normal after the election results.

My views have been slagged off on this thread for months, looks like I have been spot on. Living in an echo chamber is very dangerous

[Aeneas]

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	My question is...WTF is that all about?

It's called foreign aid. Rich nations give it to poorer nations to help them out. It can be in the form of loans, credit, infrastructure, technical or trade assistance.

It's an interesting concept - you should look it up.

The UK naturally is too wealthy to qualify for aid. At least for the next few years.

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	Why would I pick a strong & capable leader for the opposition? The forum seems a little slower than normal after the election results. My views have been slagged off on this thread for months, looks like I have been spot on. Living in an echo chamber is very dangerous

If you have weak and incapable opposition it's not good for ANYONE on either side of the political divide. Then you would see your famous echo chamber populating the Houses of Parliament.

Surely you can see the obvious problems with your view?

	Quote:	fatmanfilms
	Armenia-EU trade Armenia benefits from the EU's Generalised Scheme of Preferences plus (GSP+) trading initiative. This offers Armenian exports advantageous access to the EU market by allowing complete duty suspension across approximately 66% of all EU tariff lines. More than 96% of EU imports eligible for GSP+ preferences from Armenia entered the EU with zero duties in 2017. The EU is Armenia's biggest export market, trade with the EU accounts for around 26.7% of Armenia's total trade.[47] EU-Armenia trade increased by 15% in 2018 reaching a total value of €1.1 billion.[48] EU assistance to Armenia The EU is the biggest provider of financial support and a key reform partner in Armenia.[48] As part of the European Neighbourhood Policy, Armenia benefits from EU financial assistance. The amount allocated to Armenia depends on Armenia's commitment to reforms. Certain EU reform targets need to be met before money is paid. The planned amount of EU assistance to Armenia for the period 2017-2020 is up to €185 million.[49][50] So, Armenia is part of a ‘friends of the EU’ group enjoying significant almost level playing field trade with the EU but without the associated risks attached, without the membership costs attached AND it gets EU payments. My question is...WTF is that all about?

Just wait until you see the EU Least Developed Countries list, it will blow your mind

I know what you mean though, what sort of a liberal snowflake cuck helps out a neighbor?